iahphx

Yup, releasing these folks "into the world" doesn't seem like such a good idea now. I'm half-expecting the Cambodian prime minister who personally greeted the passengers and gave them roses to come down with an infection..

Are there actually any cruises still operating in Asia? I'm kind of expecting something to happen on a cruise ship in the Caribbean: taking such a cruise right now would have real risk. But cruising in Asia would be insane.

We'll see how this all shakes out, but I'm expecting word to come out that there are a million people in Asia with Wuflu. But somehow when you leave Wuhan, it's mostly mild. There's really no other explanation for what's going on.

iahphx

Maybe you can't get USA commercial crew to fly? Remember, back when there were less than a half dozen cases in HKG, the AA crews wouldn't fly. Otherwise,you would think UA would jump on this opportunity to put their Asian fleet back into service.

I did find it funny that some pax have too much luggage for the evacuation flight. Having seen so many tourists flying around with seemingly all their worldly possessions, I'm not surprised. That said, these are basically military charters. Aren't they used to lots of gear?

And I do agree you'd be foolish to not take the USA up on their offer for a gratis evacuation back to America. It's a low probability bet that your alternative will be better. I am expecting some folks not to realize this. I'm also expecting some of these pax to arrive back in rough shape. These travellers are likely old and soft: not like the American evacuees from Wuhan. The military charters won't be the style they're accustomed to.

jiejie

The point is, that testing isn't necessarily reliable. If you tested all the US passengers at this point, it might find a few positives. But it also might find lots of negatives in asymptomatic individuals who will later turn positive. Since test kits don't grow on trees, and since the proper test procedure is invasive and requires skill to take the sample, it really makes the most sense to limit testing to symptomatic individuals and their close contacts. And safely quarantine everyone else for 14 days.

I think those passengers who are choosing to stay on the ship, in the belief that they will be released to travel at will after Feb 19, are going to be in for a rude awakening. They should take the offer of the USG charter while they can. Even if the overpackers need to just abandon their excess stuff and give to the crew.

No US commercial carrier will fly this mission on their aircraft. I doubt their insurance companies nor their crew unions would allow it. Cargo craft are less comfortable but more configurable to the special needs of this sort of flight.

iahphx

Is that invasive and semi-dangerous testing procedure really the only way to get an accurate diagnosis? Logic would tell me there has to be a better way, and hopefully a lot of smart people are working hard on coming up with a much improved test.

notquiteaff

I for sure would leave my too-large bag behind if this was a show stopper for the return flight.

The Wuhan evac flíghts were not free for the passengers, I think. Not sure if Princess will reimburse pax in this case, as Holland America seem to be doing for Westerdam pax. Expensive event for Carnival (parent of both).



Even if it isn’t United sending a Polarized widebody, there are companies with passenger widebodies that specialize on military charters. Did they all say “no, thanks” when asked?

I assume Kalitta still have to have qualified flight attendants on these self-loading cargo charters. Perhaps not serving drinks and meals and fluffing pillows, but staffing the emergency exits, while wearing bunny suits? Or did the FAA just waive any such rule, or do they not apply to human cargo flights?

BuildingMyBento

Sounds very wumao to me.

Firstly, "the tourists" have already returned to China? Have you noticed a mainlander's propensity to travel/stay abroad throughout Chinese history? Given the lengthy incubation period, and self-realization that quarantines are being imposed in certain locations, what more could we ask for?

2nd, Wuhan isn't exactly a heavy hitter for international visitors/transit pax, vis-a-vis other cities/regions; Yichang is more for the warmer months.

3rd, propaganda. I am gobsmacked by what my (US) government says on a quotidian basis. Believing Beijing causes lateral bewilderment. However, in this case I have a friend in Guangzhou who's mobile number and name were jotted down on a public list at a Burger King for having a slightly above-average temperature. He gave an incorrect number, but it's unnerving to ponder the breadth of any political machine.

I'm shocked that cases haven't yet appeared in the Meningitis Belt.

nk15

They should definitely leave their excess baggage behind in the cruise ship to be securely incinerated.

notquiteaff

“The passengers were tested regularly on board and Cambodia also tested 20 once it docked. None was found to have the new coronavirus that has killed more than 1,500 people, the vast majority in China.”

I have asked it before and I’ll ask it again: how did they test the pax aboard while it was “drifting” from country to country? Don’t see how they could have had sufficient tests or the lab needed to process them.

iahphx

I assume "the testing" consisted of taking their temperature and asking them if they felt sick. Does anyone know whether any testing occurred in Cambodia? Did they just let them walk off the boat, meet the Cambodian prime minister and take them to the airport?

jiejie

If you're talking sbout the nasopharyngeal swab, then yes, my understanding is that right now, this is the best they have to get to a place in the body that might have enough viral reservoir (at least in early stages) to register on a test. It's not just a simple swab like for strep throat. I'm willing to be corrected on this though.

Really? @trublu's comments sound very logical to me...as long as China maintains its its current controls on international outbound travel by Chinese and internal quarantine controls, and as long as other governments' border closures and restrictions are maintained or even increased and broadened for a while.
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I think it's the non-Chinese travelers that now need to be scrutinized, and community contacts. Example: the Japanese leisure traveler to Hawaii that was mostly asymptomatic until returning to Japan. Example: the Singapore church group infecting each other when someone in the group somehow acquired and introduced the virus.

nk15

I am wondering, is anyone coordinating and supervising this? Like the WHO? Or is it a leadership vacuum and jurisdictional nightmare where everyone tries to avoid the problem and duck and hide?

jiejie

Am following with interest the story of the 83-year old American woman from the Westerdam who flew to Malaysia and was tested (apparently starting to show symptoms) and found positive for COVID-19. I have not heard where she got on the ship, it could have been HK on Feb 1 at the latest. It brings up very interesting questions about how she could have acquired this virus, given they had been at sea for two weeks without porting. I hope they retest her to make sure they aren't getting a false positive, but I'm not optimistic.

The entire cruise industry, everywhere in the world not just Asia, now needs to seriously question whether sponsoring floating petri dishes is a responsible thing to do. I suspect more governments may take matters into their own hands and close ports, which will render cruise lines' decisions moot.

notquiteaff

I suspect (fear) there was a lot of “motivation” both from fellow passengers (following the Diamond Princess story) and crew/cruise line to not find any false positives, because Westerdam would then likely have turned into another Diamond Princess situation.

helvetic

I'd much rather be stuck in Japan than the US personally. The land of delicious food!

helvetic

I wouldn't take the "gratis" flight. First of all, isn't the US charging people like $1300 for the evacs? And after 2 weeks in quarantine, I wouldn't be ready to sign up to quarantine another 2 weeks. And lastly, Japan is a very nice place to be — would much rather stick around here vs. go back to the USA. The healthcare is far better, the food is far better, and you'd be… you know… free. Not a prisoner in a military base.

Not to mention, you'd have to fly in economy on a cargo plane. Not exactly the business class ticket I'd be accustomed to.