Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airlines and Mileage Programs > Air Canada | Aeroplan
Reload this Page >

Grounding of 737 Max - Effect on AC incl OMNI 767 lease

Old Mar 12, 2019, 11:26 am
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: yyznomad
Latest updates from aircanada.com
Originally Posted by https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/home/book/travel-news-and-updates/2019/737-airspace-closure.html
If you currently have a reservation for a flight between now and September 02, 2019 that was scheduled to be operated by a Boeing 737 MAX aircraft, we've implemented a policy that makes it possible for you to make voluntary changes to your itinerary within three (3) weeks of your original travel dates.
Read below for more details.

Air Canada Timetable Effective June 27, 2019 to September 29, 2019 (AC's link: https://services.aircanada.com/porta...metable-en.pdf)
Air Canada Timetable Effective June 20, 2019 to September 22, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective June 13, 2019 to September 15, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective June 6, 2019 to September 8, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective May 30, 2019 to September 1, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective May 23, 2019 to August 25, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective May 16, 2019 to August 18, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective May 9, 2019 to August 11, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective May 2, 2019 to August 4, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective April 25, 2019 to July 28, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective April 18, 2019 to July 21, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective April 11, 2019 to July 14, 2019
Air Canada Timetable Effective March 28, 2019 to June 30, 2019



May 29, 2019
If you are travelling within the next 72 hours, call:

1-833-354-5963

If you booked through a Travel Agency, please call them for immediate assistance
In compliance with Transport Canada's safety notice closing Canadian airspace to Boeing 737 MAX aircraft operations, Air Canada has grounded its 24 737 MAX aircraft until further notice.Air Canada is now updating its May, June and July schedule to further optimize its fleet and re-accommodate customers. Because the timeline for the return to service of the 737 Max is unknown, for planning purposes and to provide customers certainty for booking and travel, Air Canada is removing all 737 MAX aircraft from its schedule until at least September 02, 2019. A summary of schedule changes for April is posted below in the following question and answer: "What is Air Canada doing to reschedule customers?". Additional schedule changes will be posted as warranted.
  • Air Canada's cancellation and rebooking policies are in place with full fee waiver for affected customers.
  • We are working to rebook impacted customers as soon as possible.
  • Given the magnitude of our 737 MAX operations which on average carry nine to twelve thousand customers per day, customers can expect delays in rebooking and in reaching Air Canada Call Centres.
  • If you are travelling within the next 72 hours, please call the number at the top of this page.
  • If you booked through a Travel Agent, you may contact them directly for assistance.
We appreciate our customers' patience as we work to get everyone on their way.

If you'd like to make other plansIf you currently have a reservation for a flight between now and September 02, 2019 that was scheduled to be operated by a Boeing 737 MAX aircraft, we've implemented a policy that makes it possible for you to make voluntary changes to your itinerary within three (3) weeks of your original travel dates.If you are impacted by this policy, you may contact Air Canada Reservations (1-888-247-2262). If you are travelling in the next 72 hours, please call Air Canada Reservations number at the top of this notice. If you purchased your ticket with AeroplanExternal site which may not meet accessibility guidelines., or Air Canada Vacations or your travel agent, please contact them directly.

****

March 19, 2019

UPDATED - INFORMATION ON IMPACTED ROUTES


**********

UPDATED - Air Canada Responds to Transport Canada's Closure of Canadian Airspace to the Boeing 737 MAX Aircraft

https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/...e-closure.html

March 19, 2019

If you are travelling within the next 72 hours, call:

1-833-354-5963

If you booked through a Travel Agency, please call them for immediate assistance

In compliance with Transport Canadas safety notice closing Canadian airspace to Boeing 737 MAX aircraft operations, Air Canada has grounded its 24 737 MAX aircraft until further notice.

Air Canada is now updating its April and May schedule to further optimize its fleet and re-accommodate customers. Because the timeline for the return to service of the 737 Max is unknown, for planning purposes and to provide customers certainty for booking and travel, Air Canada is removing all 737 MAX aircraft from its schedule until at least July 1, 2019. A summary of schedule changes for April is posted below in the following question and answer: What is Air Canada doing to reschedule customers?. Additional schedule changes will be posted as warranted.
  • Air Canada's cancellation and rebooking policies are in place with full fee waiver for affected customers.
  • We are working to rebook impacted customers as soon as possible.
  • Given the magnitude of our 737 MAX operations which on average carry nine to twelve thousand customers per day, customers can expect delays in rebooking and in reaching Air Canada Call Centres.
  • If you are travelling within the next 72 hours, please call the number at the top of this page.
  • If you booked through a Travel Agent, you may contact them directly for assistance.
We appreciate our customers' patience as we work to get everyone on their way.

If you'd like to make other plans

If you currently have a reservation for a flight that was scheduled to be operated by a Boeing 737 MAX aircraft, we've implemented a policy that makes it possible for you to make voluntary changes to your itinerary within three (3) weeks of your original travel dates.

If you are impacted by this policy, you may contact Air Canada Reservations (1-888-247-2262). If you are travelling in the next 72 hours, please call Air Canada Reservations number at the top of this notice.

If you purchased your ticket with Aeroplan, or Air Canada Vacations or your travel agent, please contact them directly.


*********
March 13, 2019

Air Canada confirmed today that it will comply immediately with Transport Canada's safety notice closing Canadian airspace to Boeing 737 MAX aircraft operations until further notice.

Air Canada's cancellation and rebooking policies are in place with full fee waiver for affected customers. We are working to rebook impacted customers as soon as possible. Given the magnitude of our 737 MAX operations which on average carry nine to twelve thousand customers per day, customers can expect delays in rebooking and in reaching Air Canada Call Centres. Priority will be given to customers travelling within the next 72 hours. We appreciate our customers' patience.

If you'd like to know what type of aircraft you are flying on, simply retrieve your booking from the My Bookings tab, then click on the 'Details' link in the Flight Details section. We also advise you to check the status of your flight before heading to the airport.

We fully support Transport Canada's decision and will continue to work with them towards a resolution of this situation as soon as possible.

Alternate Travel Plans
If you currently have a reservation for a flight operated by a Boeing 737 MAX aircraft, we've implemented a policy that makes it possible for you to make voluntary changes to your itinerary within three (3) weeks of your original travel dates.

If you are impacted by this policy, you may contact Air Canada Reservations (1-888-247-2262).

If you purchased your ticket with AeroplanExternal site which may not meet accessibility guidelines., or Air Canada Vacations or your Travel agent, please contact them directly Some questions you may have are below with our answers, but if you can't find what you need, contact us at 1-888-247-2262, or reach out to us on on FacebookExternal site which may not meet accessibility guidelines. or TwitterExternal site which may not meet accessibility guidelines..

How many Boeing 737 MAX aircraft does Air Canada have?
Air Canada has a fleet of 24 Boeing 737 MAX-8 aircraft, which have been in operation since 2017. We have a total fleet of 400 aircraft (including 24 737MAX), comprising Air Canada mainline, Air Canada Rouge and Air Canada Express aircraft.

Where do the Boeing 737 MAX aircraft fly to?
These aircraft operate flights across North America, to Mexico, the Caribbean, Hawaii, as well as from Atlantic Canada to London Heathrow.

How many Boeing 737 MAX flights are there each day, and how many passengers are affected?
We typically operate approximately 75 Boeing 737 MAX flights daily out of a total schedule of approximately 1,600 daily flights system-wide, representing less than six percent of our total flying.

We have a total fleet of 400 aircraft (including 24 Boeing 737 MAX), comprising Air Canada mainline, Air Canada Rouge and Air Canada Express aircraft.

What is Air Canada doing to reschedule customers?
We are making adjustments to our schedule to minimize the disruption to customers as much as possible, by optimizing the deployment of the rest of our fleet and looking at alternative options, including accommodating customers on other airlines.

As an example of some of our adjustments to Boeing 737 MAX flights cancelled, we have re-scheduled widebody aircraft to serve Hawaii starting today, March 13. Some flights will operate as scheduled with mainline or Air Canada Rouge aircraft, such as on Montreal-Martinique and Montreal-Guadeloupe. Other routes, notably Halifax-London and St. John's-London are cancelled in the short term, with customers being re-routed through our Montreal and Toronto hubs.

What should I do right now?
As changes are finalized in our flight schedule, customers whose flight times or flight numbers have changed can expect to receive an email detailing their updated itinerary. This information is also available in My Bookings on the Air Canada App.

If you are travelling soon, you can also contact us or your travel agent. Please understand that priority is being given to customers travelling within the next 72 hours.

We have also put in place a rebooking policy, space permitting, and without additional fees for affected customers. Given the magnitude of our Boeing 737 MAX operations, which on average carry nine to twelve thousand customers per day, customers can expect delays in rebooking and in reaching Air Canada's Call Centres.

Where can I go to for more information?
If you would like to know what type of aircraft you are flying on, simply retrieve your booking from the My Bookings tab, then click on the 'Details' link in the Flight Details section.

If you are travelling soon, you can contact us, reach out to our social media teams on FacebookExternal site which may not meet accessibility guidelines. or TwitterExternal site which may not meet accessibility guidelines., or call your travel agent.

We also advise you to check the status of your flight before going to the airport.

We thank all of our customers for their patience.

Will Air Canada cover my out-of-pocket expenses such as additional accommodation costs that I may incur as a result of these disruptions?
Our normal protocol for irregular events which are out of our control is in effect. We are regrettably unable to reimburse for such expenses.



****


MONTREAL, March 13, 2019 /CNW Telbec/ - Air Canada confirmed today that it will comply immediately with Transport Canada's safety notice closing Canadian airspace to Boeing 737 MAX aircraft operations until further notice.

Air Canada's cancellation and rebooking policies are in place with full fee waiver for affected customers. We are working to rebook impacted customers as soon as possible but given the magnitude of our 737 MAX operations which on average carry nine to twelve thousand customers per day, customers can expect delays in rebooking and in reaching Air Canada call centres and we appreciate our customers' patience.

Customers are further advised to check the status of their flight on aircanada.com prior to going to the airport.

We fully support this decision and will continue to work with Transport Canada towards resolution of this situation as soon as possible.


SOURCE Air Canada

For further information: Isabelle Arthur (Montral), [email protected], 514 422-5788; Peter Fitzpatrick (Toronto), [email protected], 416 263-5576; Angela Mah (Vancouver), [email protected], 604 270-5741; Internet: aircanada.com

https://aircanada.mediaroom.com/2019...7-MAX-Aircraft




https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/...to-london.html

Originally Posted by ac.com
Information on Air Canada Halifax-London and St. Johns-London service

March 12, 2019

Due to the UK's Civil Aviation Authority banning all Boeing 737 Max aircraft operations in the U.K. Air Canada has cancelled the following flights:

AC 860 Halifax London-Heathrow on March 12
AC861 London-Halifax on March 13
AC822 St. Johns-London on March 13
AC823London-St. Johns on March 14

We are working to rebook impacted customers as soon as possible through our Montreal, Toronto and Ottawa hubs.

Affected customers may contact Air Canada Reservations to change their flights to another date free of charge.

As well, due to anticipated call volumes, customers can expect delays reaching Air Canada call centres, so we appreciate our customers patience.

Air Canada will provide updates as more information becomes available.
Print Wikipost

Grounding of 737 Max - Effect on AC incl OMNI 767 lease

Old May 8, 2019, 11:20 am
  #736  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SJC/YUL
Programs: DL PM, Marriott Gold
Posts: 3,907
Originally Posted by canadiancow
What about lost revenue?

If they were able to recoup any revenue lost from the grounding, then any expenses (like salaries) would be irrelevant.
IMO, not a chance of Boeing paying lost revenue or other expenses. As I say, I do think they will offer some kind of financial goodwill, but I personally don't see that number coming close to making AC "whole" on this
Mountain Explorer is online now  
Old May 8, 2019, 11:37 am
  #737  
5mm
Suspended
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 669
Originally Posted by kjnangre
IMO, not a chance of Boeing paying lost revenue or other expenses. As I say, I do think they will offer some kind of financial goodwill, but I personally don't see that number coming close to making AC "whole" on this
Boeing will end up covering the majority of costs for all airlines for the grounding of the Max.. They already put away $1B for the first 30 days. It may not be all cold hard cash, but major additional discounts on future deliveries of the Max/non Max aircraft is a for sure.
5mm is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 11:43 am
  #738  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SJC/YUL
Programs: DL PM, Marriott Gold
Posts: 3,907
Originally Posted by 5mm
Boeing will end up covering the majority of costs for all airlines for the grounding of the Max.. They already put away $1B for the first 30 days. It may not be all cold hard cash, but major additional discounts on future deliveries of the Max/non Max aircraft is a for sure.
I disagree. But we shall see
Mountain Explorer is online now  
Old May 8, 2019, 12:21 pm
  #739  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toronto
Programs: AC SE100K, Emerald Exec, HHG
Posts: 631
Originally Posted by kjnangre
I disagree. But we shall see
They did with the dreamliner groundings in 2013
sram is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 12:29 pm
  #740  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SJC/YUL
Programs: DL PM, Marriott Gold
Posts: 3,907
Originally Posted by sram
They did with the dreamliner groundings in 2013
Source? Significantly fewer 787s were in service, if I remember right.
Mountain Explorer is online now  
Old May 8, 2019, 12:47 pm
  #741  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toronto
Programs: AC SE100K, Emerald Exec, HHG
Posts: 631
Originally Posted by kjnangre
Source? Significantly fewer 787s were in service, if I remember right.
https://airwaysmag.com/uncategorized...-compensation/

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/13/70318...nly-just-begun

Boeing paid compensation to customers at the time but did so under a gag order so the terms of the deal are not public. Some estimate it at $500M

Are you suggesting that since the issues related to the Max are more costly, more severe and pose a bigger impact to airlines, the likelihood of compensation is lower?
They will compensate, not everything, but they will be writing big cheques. They self-insure up to a limit then their insurer (Global Aerospace) will kick in.
sram is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 12:51 pm
  #742  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,344
Originally Posted by 5mm
There is not a programmer in the world that could write the program you want. Its impossible to write because you cant program a extra row on the A319.
If I have row 13 (regular Y) on a 763, and the flight is changed to 77L, does this mean I get a free PE seat? (I honestly have no idea how AC handles this, but I would imagine there are at least some airlines that would be reluctant to do so). Perhaps even more importantly, the system could surely be intelligent enough to transfer from a preferred seat on one plane to a preferred seat on the other plane, as long as there is available space. The bottom line is that they are charging extra for certain rows, so the least they could do is at least try to accommodate your request automatically. It would only take a couple hours at the most to create a map of comparable seats between all of the different airplanes that could be factored into the algorithm (bulkhead to bulkhead; exit to exit; preferred to preferred). Of course, it would not be completely perfect, but it would be an improvement over doing purely numerically. By your logic, someone in row 40 on a 777 would simply be SOL if the flight was moved to a 767.

Originally Posted by 5mm
Since when did AC make window seats non washroom access? Really?
Not sure what/who you are replying to with this bizarre comment. I can't really make any sense of it
downinit is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 12:56 pm
  #743  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SJC/YUL
Programs: DL PM, Marriott Gold
Posts: 3,907
Originally Posted by sram
https://airwaysmag.com/uncategorized...-compensation/

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/13/70318...nly-just-begun

Boeing paid compensation to customers at the time but did so under a gag order so the terms of the deal are not public. Some estimate it at $500M
So you have absolutely no clue how much compensation they paid. You call that evidence??

I said from the beginning that Boeing will likely offer some financial goodwill, but will not make the airlines whole.

Originally Posted by kjnangre
I do think they will offer some kind of financial goodwill, but I personally don't see that number coming close to making AC "whole" on this
The articles you linked and the ones I've found all seem to indicate exactly that. I rest my case. Next time try checking your facts before posting.
Mountain Explorer is online now  
Old May 8, 2019, 1:00 pm
  #744  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 8,050
Originally Posted by Mikey Mike Mike
I noticed on flightradar24 that there were two AC maxes moved on Sunday - FSEQ from Halifax to Windsor, but more signifcantly that GEHY moved from Windsor to Calgary. I don't know whether it was to make space at Windsor, but to move one MAX back to a main base suggested to me, there may be a fix / testing etc due to start soon. I don't know if one of the four bases is the MAX centre of excellence, but they are the first moves since they cleared them all to two locations for storage many weeks ago.
A few weeks ago two fins were swapped between YVR-YQG.
Two more went YQG-YVR.
WS has moved some around as well.
tracon is online now  
Old May 8, 2019, 1:08 pm
  #745  
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Halifax
Programs: AC SE100K, Marriott Lifetime Platinum Elite. NEXUS
Posts: 4,600
Originally Posted by downinit
Perhaps even more importantly, the system could surely be intelligent enough to transfer from a preferred seat on one plane to a preferred seat on the other plane, as long as there is available space.
It could be, but then things could do a lot of things. It doesn't.

AC IT isn't smart enough to use my seating preference when it rebooks me and me alone. And even without that preference explicitly asked and answered, they have big data enough to know that at >95% I sit in the aisle, that is clearly where I want to be. But alas, no. 100% of the time they auto seat me for whatever reason its in a window.
RangerNS is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 1:14 pm
  #746  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE 2MM; UA MP Premier Silver; Marriott Bonvoy LT Titanium Elite; Radisson; Avis PC
Posts: 35,281
Originally Posted by Mikey Mike Mike
I noticed on flightradar24 that there were two AC maxes moved on Sunday - FSEQ from Halifax to Windsor, but more signifcantly that GEHY moved from Windsor to Calgary. I don't know whether it was to make space at Windsor, but to move one MAX back to a main base suggested to me, there may be a fix / testing etc due to start soon. I don't know if one of the four bases is the MAX centre of excellence, but they are the first moves since they cleared them all to two locations for storage many weeks ago.
Originally Posted by tracon
A few weeks ago two fins were swapped between YVR-YQG.
Two more went YQG-YVR.
WS has moved some around as well.
You mean like the below referenced?

Originally Posted by tracon
C-GEHY has left YVR for YQG.
Originally Posted by tracon
C-FSNQ coming back the other way.
Originally Posted by tracon
C-FSOC YVR-YQG
Originally Posted by tracon
C-FSNU YQG-YVR
yyznomad is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 1:27 pm
  #747  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toronto
Programs: AC SE100K, Emerald Exec, HHG
Posts: 631
Originally Posted by kjnangre
So you have absolutely no clue how much compensation they paid. You call that evidence??
Yes, both parties admitted to paying compensation. The amount is under non-disclosure. You still question whether it happened? ok, move on .

You are mixing "Goodwill" and "Liability". "Financial Goodwill" is an accounting procedure. Are you suggesting that Boeing will buy back the airplanes (Goodwill=Price−(Asset+Liabilities)) Do you understand the difference? Its likely you are using terms you don't understand. If you are suggesting Boeing "offer" a level of compensation to airlines, perhaps, but, Boeing will be contractually obligated to pay airlines and suppliers based on indemnification, fraud and negligence. Those amounts, just like in the past, will be determined behind closed doors, and Boeing has little leverage, or the Airlines goes public. In this case Goodwill does not apply. You are never "Whole" in these cases due to intangible losses (brand+reputation+time). Perhaps you should check your facts before posting?
sram is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 2:06 pm
  #748  
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: YEG
Programs: HH Silver
Posts: 56,466
Exclamation

Let's please leave the wider MAX matters to the master thread on the topic and focus this one to the effects on AC. Any more off topic posts about Boeing MAX compensation or aircraft orders will be deleted.

tcook052
AC forum mod.
tcook052 is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 4:44 pm
  #749  
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 53
Originally Posted by kjnangre
Paying them is clearly the morally right thing to do IMO. I get that AC is a "victim" here also. But AC can weather this, not every pilot has enough savings to completely lose pay for who knows how long.

Also, by paying them, AC more or less guarantees that they will be available to return to service if/when the time comes (rather than moving on to other jobs)
AC has no choice but to pay them. This article mentions that there are 420 idled Max pilots, some will be recertified on a/c types they previously flew:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...ing-of-boeing/
Resurrection is offline  
Old May 8, 2019, 4:52 pm
  #750  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SJC/YUL
Programs: DL PM, Marriott Gold
Posts: 3,907
Originally Posted by Resurrection
AC has no choice but to pay them. This article mentions that there are 420 idled Max pilots, some will be recertified on a/c types they previously flew:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...ing-of-boeing/
The post directly before mine said that there's a clause in the CBA which could allow for the pilots to stop being paid. Maybe he's right. Maybe you are. IDK. Either way, I think paying them is the right thing to do.
Mountain Explorer is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.