Jun 19, 2013, 9:45 pm
Last edit by: fti
People, please edit/use the wiki so same questions are not always asked.
The current CTA decision on the Yangon deal is only for tickets canceled by SWISS Airlines for the seven merged complaints/companions and tickets canceled by Jet Airways for one complainant and companions
- It's not about other carriers because each carrier submits different tariffs.
- If you are not one of the complainants or their companions above who were mentioned in the respective cases, you need to submit a case yourself for hearing.
- There's currently one person who is on Iberia for CTA decision, one can either wait for results or submit a complaint to CTA.
Result of the current case for LX in brief is:
- CTA found 5(F) in the tariff used to be unclear for canceling tickets on erroneously quoted fares.
- 5(F) is unjust and unreasonable and must be revised or taken down by July 9, 2013 (or SWISS can appeal by then)
- SWISS did not use its tariff correctly to cancel the tickets.
- SWISS must compensate one complainant's First Class ticket and any related expenses by July 18, 2013 provided with evidence.
- SWISS must transport other complainants (and their companions) in the original price charged with same booking class and routing by June 18, 2014.
Result of the current case for 9W in brief is:
- Tariff on file had no clauses for "erroneous fares" and was updated subsequently, which means it is not relevant to this event
- Therefore, 9W is to reinstate the tickets with a 1-year validity for transport between the same points and the same booking class.
CTA official news can be read here for general overview of the case.
Actual CTA case review can be found here for reference should you wish to file a complaint.
If you have a similar case that's with SWISS, you need to file with CTA to get a result through informal process first before it gets to formal process. The entire procedure can take up to 3 months for each and the result may not be same cause it's case-by-base and the reviewer of the case can be different.
To file an informal complaint with CTA, see here. Click through all of the pages to get to the online form for the informal complaint. Or click here.
To file a formal complaint after informal complaint has been closed, see here. Continue on to the next page to see the address or email address for the formal complaint.
The July 17th and 18th responses from LX can be found here:
Other Letters:
Feel free to add dates, flights, etc., in order to plan DOs, etc.
Aug 4: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 5: ICN-SFO (UA892)
Jason8612
Aug 7: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 11: ICN-NRT-ORD (UA78, UA882)
Jason8612
Aug 14: BOS-IAD-NRT-ICN (UA285, UA803, UA79)
Deltspygt
Aug 19: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA352)
Deltspygt
Oct 1: UA433-UA893
JeredF +1
Oct 8: UA892-UA242
JeredF +1
Oct 9: BOS-SFO-ICN (UA433, UA893)
BigJC
Oct 13: ICN-NRT-ORD-BOS (UA78, UA882, UA744)
BigJC
Oct 21: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
Sterndogg +1
flyerdude88 (SFO - ICN portion only)
Oct 23: ICN - SFO UA 892
flyerdude88
Oct 27: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-BOS UA286
Sterndogg +1
Nov 05: BOS-ORD UA521, ORD-NRT UA881
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 11: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-IAD UA727
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 26: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-NRT UA837, NRT-ICN UA79
thepla
Nov 27: BOS-ORD-NRT-ICN (UA501, UA881, UA196)
BigJC+1
Nov 29: Planning 2 days in TPE, been to ICN
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-ORD UA698, ORD-BOS UA961
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA822)
BigJC+1
Dec 15: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
songzm
Dec 25: BOS-IAD UA285, IAD-NRT UA803, NRT-ICN UA79
Dinoscool3 +2
Dec 30: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA444
songzm
Dec 31: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA770
Dinoscool3 +2
Jan 11: BOS-SFO UA1523, Jan 12: SFO-ICN UA893
margarita girl
Jan 12: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
Zebranz
14 Jan: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
ORDOGG
19 Jan: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-ORD UA698 to ORD-BOS UA961
ORDOGG
Jan 22: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA500
margarita girl
Feb 5: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA242
Zebranz
CMB-DFW EY F
FARE IS GONE
FARE RULES (thanks to SQ421)
FRTLK Fare Rules (RT)
FOWLK Fare Rules (OW)
WHEN ARE YOU FLYING?
Feel free to add any additional cities you're leaving from!
Please slot yourselves in!!!
ex-CMB
Feb
Mar
8 - Darmajaya
12 - Thaidai
22 - Deadinabsentia
Apr
21 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
26 - tahsir21
May
28 - Upperdeck744
29 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
Jun
12 - lelee
Jul
7 - HansGolden +6
8 - arcticbull + 1
11 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: SIN-CMB, DFW-MCI)
25 - Tycosiao
30 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: MCI-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Aug
17 - DC777Fan
26 - Yi Yang
31 - dcas
Sep
Oct
Nov
8 - harryhv
29 - stephem+4
Dec
6 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. roastpuff , JFKEZE (UL Code-share)
7 - DWFI
10 - jlisi984 + dad (CMB-AUH-DFW)
21 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
ex-AUH
Jan
Feb
Mar
Apr
27 - RICHKLHS
May
Jun
29 - yerffej201
Jul
9 - HansGolden +6
27 - Tycosiao
Aug
Sep
Oct
Nov
30 - stephem+4 (to JFK)
Dec
7 - JFKEZE, DWFI [EY161 nonstop]
9 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. Roastpuff
ex-DFW
Jan
Feb
Mar
14 - Thaidai
15 - zainman +1
Apr
25 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
May
Jun
Jul
Aug
22 - arcticbull + 1
Sep
22 - bonsaisai (positioning flights ORD-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Oct
Nov
19 - harryhv->Paris
Dec
19 - Yi Yang, jona970318
24 - DWFI (EY160 nonstop)
26 - HansGolden +6 (CDG), LwoodY2K (AUH)
The current CTA decision on the Yangon deal is only for tickets canceled by SWISS Airlines for the seven merged complaints/companions and tickets canceled by Jet Airways for one complainant and companions
- It's not about other carriers because each carrier submits different tariffs.
- If you are not one of the complainants or their companions above who were mentioned in the respective cases, you need to submit a case yourself for hearing.
- There's currently one person who is on Iberia for CTA decision, one can either wait for results or submit a complaint to CTA.
Result of the current case for LX in brief is:
- CTA found 5(F) in the tariff used to be unclear for canceling tickets on erroneously quoted fares.
- 5(F) is unjust and unreasonable and must be revised or taken down by July 9, 2013 (or SWISS can appeal by then)
- SWISS did not use its tariff correctly to cancel the tickets.
- SWISS must compensate one complainant's First Class ticket and any related expenses by July 18, 2013 provided with evidence.
- SWISS must transport other complainants (and their companions) in the original price charged with same booking class and routing by June 18, 2014.
Result of the current case for 9W in brief is:
- Tariff on file had no clauses for "erroneous fares" and was updated subsequently, which means it is not relevant to this event
- Therefore, 9W is to reinstate the tickets with a 1-year validity for transport between the same points and the same booking class.
CTA official news can be read here for general overview of the case.
Actual CTA case review can be found here for reference should you wish to file a complaint.
If you have a similar case that's with SWISS, you need to file with CTA to get a result through informal process first before it gets to formal process. The entire procedure can take up to 3 months for each and the result may not be same cause it's case-by-base and the reviewer of the case can be different.
To file an informal complaint with CTA, see here. Click through all of the pages to get to the online form for the informal complaint. Or click here.
To file a formal complaint after informal complaint has been closed, see here. Continue on to the next page to see the address or email address for the formal complaint.
The July 17th and 18th responses from LX can be found here:
Other Letters:
Feel free to add dates, flights, etc., in order to plan DOs, etc.
Aug 4: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 5: ICN-SFO (UA892)
Jason8612
Aug 7: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 11: ICN-NRT-ORD (UA78, UA882)
Jason8612
Aug 14: BOS-IAD-NRT-ICN (UA285, UA803, UA79)
Deltspygt
Aug 19: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA352)
Deltspygt
Oct 1: UA433-UA893
JeredF +1
Oct 8: UA892-UA242
JeredF +1
Oct 9: BOS-SFO-ICN (UA433, UA893)
BigJC
Oct 13: ICN-NRT-ORD-BOS (UA78, UA882, UA744)
BigJC
Oct 21: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
Sterndogg +1
flyerdude88 (SFO - ICN portion only)
Oct 23: ICN - SFO UA 892
flyerdude88
Oct 27: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-BOS UA286
Sterndogg +1
Nov 05: BOS-ORD UA521, ORD-NRT UA881
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 11: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-IAD UA727
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 26: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-NRT UA837, NRT-ICN UA79
thepla
Nov 27: BOS-ORD-NRT-ICN (UA501, UA881, UA196)
BigJC+1
Nov 29: Planning 2 days in TPE, been to ICN
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-ORD UA698, ORD-BOS UA961
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA822)
BigJC+1
Dec 15: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
songzm
Dec 25: BOS-IAD UA285, IAD-NRT UA803, NRT-ICN UA79
Dinoscool3 +2
Dec 30: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA444
songzm
Dec 31: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA770
Dinoscool3 +2
Jan 11: BOS-SFO UA1523, Jan 12: SFO-ICN UA893
margarita girl
Jan 12: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
Zebranz
14 Jan: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
ORDOGG
19 Jan: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-ORD UA698 to ORD-BOS UA961
ORDOGG
Jan 22: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA500
margarita girl
Feb 5: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA242
Zebranz
CMB-DFW EY F
FARE IS GONE
FARE RULES (thanks to SQ421)
FRTLK Fare Rules (RT)
FOWLK Fare Rules (OW)
WHEN ARE YOU FLYING?
Feel free to add any additional cities you're leaving from!
Please slot yourselves in!!!
ex-CMB
Feb
Mar
8 - Darmajaya
12 - Thaidai
22 - Deadinabsentia
Apr
21 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
26 - tahsir21
May
28 - Upperdeck744
29 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
Jun
12 - lelee
Jul
7 - HansGolden +6
8 - arcticbull + 1
11 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: SIN-CMB, DFW-MCI)
25 - Tycosiao
30 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: MCI-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Aug
17 - DC777Fan
26 - Yi Yang
31 - dcas
Sep
Oct
Nov
8 - harryhv
29 - stephem+4
Dec
6 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. roastpuff , JFKEZE (UL Code-share)
7 - DWFI
10 - jlisi984 + dad (CMB-AUH-DFW)
21 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
ex-AUH
Jan
Feb
Mar
Apr
27 - RICHKLHS
May
Jun
29 - yerffej201
Jul
9 - HansGolden +6
27 - Tycosiao
Aug
Sep
Oct
Nov
30 - stephem+4 (to JFK)
Dec
7 - JFKEZE, DWFI [EY161 nonstop]
9 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. Roastpuff
ex-DFW
Jan
Feb
Mar
14 - Thaidai
15 - zainman +1
Apr
25 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
May
Jun
Jul
Aug
22 - arcticbull + 1
Sep
22 - bonsaisai (positioning flights ORD-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Oct
Nov
19 - harryhv->Paris
Dec
19 - Yi Yang, jona970318
24 - DWFI (EY160 nonstop)
26 - HansGolden +6 (CDG), LwoodY2K (AUH)
[PREM FARE GONE] RGN First class comes back again!!!!
Oct 19, 2012, 1:54 pm
#4021
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tucson, AZ, USA. UA 1K, reluctant but * best in class * DL FO/MM. Former BA jumpseat rider and scourge of Dilbertian management and apologists. As LX might - and do - say: "....an experienced frequent flyer of international airlines"
Posts: 3,386
How is that possible? Any more than LX can file a fare they later officially characterize as an "error" when they don't recognize such a category in their CoC? @:-)I am by no means the person who booked the most of these...and bear in mind, as I stated before, these seventeen were broken down among Rounds 1, 2 and 3. Family want to come to RGN too, this isn't just an MR.
You really think my seventeen was remarkable? There are silent lurkers who have booked more than this. And what about the guy who booked seventy of the UA 4-mile HKG award tickets?
Do you seriously believe that my individual purchases mean anything to any of the airlines? They are spread around seven different plating carriers, so I have a mean ~ 2.6 tickets per plate.
Finally, I only bought two itins from Round 3 - one cxld by LX, which I'm fighting for, with you guys, and one IB that is still intact. Others bought more than that from Round 3.
The only "excess" I admit is managing to book most of these on the same NH flight from RGN on one day. The subsequent sectors are all different but the Shark family occupied half of the entire 73G cabin from RGN to NRT. That's now been rationalized to some degree by cancelling some of the x.uk tickets.
Oct 19, 2012, 1:55 pm
#4022
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: UA Gold-MM, AA Gold-MM, F9-Silver, Hyatt Something, Marriott Gold, IHG Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 6,404
That having been said.................. we all realise that he hasn't booked them all for himself, right? He stated on the thread that was done for himself and a number of family members over the whole year. So we're not even being fair here. I, then, booked 3 tickets - so go ahead and hate on me too!
And heck, by the time you count up the number of passengers on my trips -- which are booked for multiple people on the same itin (family) across multiple rounds and including the tickets I intend to cancel but haven't done yet -- I'm probably not far off myself.
In a former life, I was the king of grocery store deals..... trust me, you can't even imagine. I had a saying, 'Buy the pile when the soup is free!'
Go ahead and hate.
Last edited by hobo13; Oct 19, 2012 at 2:16 pm
Oct 19, 2012, 2:41 pm
#4023
Join Date: Oct 2012
Programs: United and Delta
Posts: 25
colpuck, now, now... first, excessive "greed" for misfiled fares here on FT?? How is that possible? Any more than LX can file a fare they later officially characterize as an "error" when they don't recognize such a category in their CoC? @:-)
I am by no means the person who booked the most of these...and bear in mind, as I stated before, these seventeen were broken down among Rounds 1, 2 and 3. Family want to come to RGN too, this isn't just an MR.
You really think my seventeen was remarkable? There are silent lurkers who have booked more than this. And what about the guy who booked seventy of the UA 4-mile HKG award tickets?
Do you seriously believe that my individual purchases mean anything to any of the airlines? They are spread around seven different plating carriers, so I have a mean ~ 2.6 tickets per plate.
Finally, I only bought two itins from Round 3 - one cxld by LX, which I'm fighting for, with you guys, and one IB that is still intact. Others bought more than that from Round 3.
The only "excess" I admit is managing to book most of these on the same NH flight from RGN on one day. The subsequent sectors are all different but the Shark family occupied half of the entire 73G cabin from RGN to NRT. That's now been rationalized to some degree by cancelling some of the x.uk tickets.
How is that possible? Any more than LX can file a fare they later officially characterize as an "error" when they don't recognize such a category in their CoC? @:-)I am by no means the person who booked the most of these...and bear in mind, as I stated before, these seventeen were broken down among Rounds 1, 2 and 3. Family want to come to RGN too, this isn't just an MR.
You really think my seventeen was remarkable? There are silent lurkers who have booked more than this. And what about the guy who booked seventy of the UA 4-mile HKG award tickets?
Do you seriously believe that my individual purchases mean anything to any of the airlines? They are spread around seven different plating carriers, so I have a mean ~ 2.6 tickets per plate.
Finally, I only bought two itins from Round 3 - one cxld by LX, which I'm fighting for, with you guys, and one IB that is still intact. Others bought more than that from Round 3.
The only "excess" I admit is managing to book most of these on the same NH flight from RGN on one day. The subsequent sectors are all different but the Shark family occupied half of the entire 73G cabin from RGN to NRT. That's now been rationalized to some degree by cancelling some of the x.uk tickets.
i wished i had booked 17-20 fares. people are just pissed they "lost" such remarkable deals.
Oct 19, 2012, 2:55 pm
#4024
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: ZRH/SFO
Programs: A3*G - AZ CFP- HH DIA
Posts: 3,666
colpuck, now, now... first, excessive "greed" for misfiled fares here on FT?? How is that possible? Any more than LX can file a fare they later officially characterize as an "error" when they don't recognize such a category in their CoC? @:-)
I am by no means the person who booked the most of these...and bear in mind, as I stated before, these seventeen were broken down among Rounds 1, 2 and 3. Family want to come to RGN too, this isn't just an MR.
You really think my seventeen was remarkable? There are silent lurkers who have booked more than this. And what about the guy who booked seventy of the UA 4-mile HKG award tickets?
Do you seriously believe that my individual purchases mean anything to any of the airlines? They are spread around seven different plating carriers, so I have a mean ~ 2.6 tickets per plate.
Finally, I only bought two itins from Round 3 - one cxld by LX, which I'm fighting for, with you guys, and one IB that is still intact. Others bought more than that from Round 3.
How is that possible? Any more than LX can file a fare they later officially characterize as an "error" when they don't recognize such a category in their CoC? @:-)I am by no means the person who booked the most of these...and bear in mind, as I stated before, these seventeen were broken down among Rounds 1, 2 and 3. Family want to come to RGN too, this isn't just an MR.
You really think my seventeen was remarkable? There are silent lurkers who have booked more than this. And what about the guy who booked seventy of the UA 4-mile HKG award tickets?
Do you seriously believe that my individual purchases mean anything to any of the airlines? They are spread around seven different plating carriers, so I have a mean ~ 2.6 tickets per plate.
Finally, I only bought two itins from Round 3 - one cxld by LX, which I'm fighting for, with you guys, and one IB that is still intact. Others bought more than that from Round 3.
Some deals will go through, others not... so what's up?
Oct 19, 2012, 3:11 pm
#4027
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: ヒルトン大阪
Programs: ゴールデングローブ
Posts: 1,982
Oct 19, 2012, 3:31 pm
#4028
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: AU
Programs: former Olympic Airways Gold (yeah - still proud of that!)
Posts: 14,410
nope. Just stating the facts.
Economy class - I don't see how any airline could get away with arguing a mistake fare. As everyone has said - $1 fares (plus taxes) are common and there is no way for a consumer to know an airline is not genuinely selling a cheap fare, even at a loss, as part of their overall advertising campaign.
First class - totally different ball-game.
Economy class - I don't see how any airline could get away with arguing a mistake fare. As everyone has said - $1 fares (plus taxes) are common and there is no way for a consumer to know an airline is not genuinely selling a cheap fare, even at a loss, as part of their overall advertising campaign.
First class - totally different ball-game.
Oct 19, 2012, 3:34 pm
#4029
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: NYC/PSP
Programs: AA EXP, A3 Gold
Posts: 4,109
nope. Just stating the facts.
Economy class - I don't see how any airline could get away with arguing a mistake fare. As everyone has said - $1 fares (plus taxes) are common and there is no way for a consumer to know an airline is not genuinely selling a cheap fare, even at a loss, as part of their overall advertising campaign.
First class - totally different ball-game.
Economy class - I don't see how any airline could get away with arguing a mistake fare. As everyone has said - $1 fares (plus taxes) are common and there is no way for a consumer to know an airline is not genuinely selling a cheap fare, even at a loss, as part of their overall advertising campaign.
First class - totally different ball-game.
Oct 19, 2012, 3:35 pm
#4030
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: UA Gold-MM, AA Gold-MM, F9-Silver, Hyatt Something, Marriott Gold, IHG Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 6,404
nope. Just stating the facts.
Economy class - I don't see how any airline could get away with arguing a mistake fare. As everyone has said - $1 fares (plus taxes) are common and there is no way for a consumer to know an airline is not genuinely selling a cheap fare, even at a loss, as part of their overall advertising campaign.
First class - totally different ball-game.
Economy class - I don't see how any airline could get away with arguing a mistake fare. As everyone has said - $1 fares (plus taxes) are common and there is no way for a consumer to know an airline is not genuinely selling a cheap fare, even at a loss, as part of their overall advertising campaign.
First class - totally different ball-game.
Oct 19, 2012, 3:36 pm
#4031
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: AU
Programs: former Olympic Airways Gold (yeah - still proud of that!)
Posts: 14,410
I just wish someone would share them with me (if they were so common there would be no need for a thread of 4000+ posts when they happen - they would just be a single line in the 'good deal premium fares' thread)
Oct 19, 2012, 3:55 pm
#4033
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: YYC
Posts: 215
I don't think one dollar fares are common enough to state that.
However, in this case since Swiss assumes I know this is "obviously a mistake fare", I would love to show them my e-ticket from round one that was honored... clearly this must not be too unusual ex-rgn if similar fares have appeared three times now
However, in this case since Swiss assumes I know this is "obviously a mistake fare", I would love to show them my e-ticket from round one that was honored... clearly this must not be too unusual ex-rgn if similar fares have appeared three times now
Oct 19, 2012, 4:30 pm
#4035
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Here
Posts: 1,912
No loss to anybody this time around I think - but it does bear thinking about not booking with them IF there was a round 4.
TIT after all so I suspect that you'll not likely get very far complaining anyway. Maybe it's their intention that the best defense is offense - make broad sweeping statements to make sure nobody books a jumbo on them in the future.
They are NOT a patch on that other star carrier 890 miles south. For what they've done here in R3 (without coercion by DOT or CTA), I will channel more money their way. All round pound for pound pretty much unbeatable bar a less than stellar FFP, but i can live with that.