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UA Orders Boeing 777-300ERs / 77Ws w/ 1-2-1 Polaris Business, 3-4-3 Economy

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Old Dec 9, 2016, 11:15 am
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UA Orders Boeing 777-300ERs / 77Ws w/ 1-2-1 Polaris Business, 3-4-3 Economy

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Old Jan 23, 2015, 9:01 am
  #136  
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Originally Posted by jacobac00
This question is sincere and not snark, I hope. Why does the AC 773 get picked on so much? They are hardly the only carrier to feature 10 across in Y on the 773. EK, EY, AF, KL, and NZ all come to mind as having 10 across in Y.

Again, genuine question as to why AC gets singled out? I've never flown them and certainly won't in that cabin. I wouldn't plan on flying in any cabin that had 10 across unless it could be helped.
17 inch wide with 31 inches of pitch on AC
17 inch wide with 32 inches of pitch on AF

AF isn't much better, but AC is running the benchmark slaveship.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 9:17 am
  #137  
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Originally Posted by halls120
17 inch wide with 31 inches of pitch on AC
17 inch wide with 32 inches of pitch on AF

AF isn't much better, but AC is running the benchmark slaveship.
i can bet big money UA will copy the same 17/31 torture chamber that qualifies for prosecution at The Hague

But you gotta give AC some credit ... they have created the single CASM king of the 77W world while still offering 36 flat bed J and true Y+ cabins.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 9:36 am
  #138  
 
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Originally Posted by jacobac00
This question is sincere and not snark, I hope. Why does the AC 773 get picked on so much? They are hardly the only carrier to feature 10 across in Y on the 773. EK, EY, AF, KL, and NZ all come to mind as having 10 across in Y.

Again, genuine question as to why AC gets singled out? I've never flown them and certainly won't in that cabin. I wouldn't plan on flying in any cabin that had 10 across unless it could be helped.
This is why. They aren't the narrowest, and don't have the worst pitch.....they (and AA) have them both together though.

NH: 16.5w 31-34p
AC: 17.0w 31p
AA: 17.0w 31p
EK: 17.0w 33-34p
AF: 17.0w 32p
NZ: 17.1w 32-33p
EY: 17.5w 31-33p
KL: 17.5w 31p
SU: 17.8w 30-32p
KE: 18.0w 33-34p
TK: 18.0w 31-32p
AI: 18.0w 33p
9W: 18.5w 32p
CA: 18.0w 32p
CX: 18.5w 32p
Last edited by Madone59; Jan 23, 2015 at 9:43 am
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 9:46 am
  #139  
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Originally Posted by Madone59
This is why. They aren't the narrowest, and don't have the worst pitch.....they (and AA) have them both together though.

NH: 16.5w 31-34p
AC: 17.0w 31p
AA: 17.0w 31p
EK: 17.0w 33-34p
AF: 17.0w 32p
NZ: 17.1w 32-33p
EY: 17.5w 31-33p
KL: 17.5w 31p
SU: 17.8w 30-32p
KE: 18.0w 33-34p
AI: 18.0w 33p
CA: 18.0w 32p
CX: 18.5w 32p
Don't know your source for the above, but AA disagrees with it. According to AA, its 77Ws feature seat pitch of "31/32," not simply "31p" as your compilation provides.

http://www.aa.com/i18n/amrcorp/corpo...acts/fleet.jsp

If your source was the notoriously unreliable garbage website Seatguru, then your entire compilation is suspect.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 9:49 am
  #140  
 
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Originally Posted by FWAAA
If your source was the notoriously unreliable garbage website Seatguru, then your entire compilation is suspect.
This is news to me so let me add the * of. I got it all off Seatguru and only want to be judged on my efforts and not the quality of the information
Last edited by Madone59; Jan 23, 2015 at 10:00 am
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 9:53 am
  #141  
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Originally Posted by FWAAA
If your source was the notoriously unreliable garbage website Seatguru, then your entire compilation is suspect.
It's fair to be suspicious of SeatGuru - Mistakes-R-Us - but the poster made a good-faith effort, and presenting the combined width/pitch ranking brings organization to the data. Changing AA's pitch to 31-32 isn't going to drop AA well down from the heights of misery. Forever a fan of objective data where available...
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 10:14 am
  #142  
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Originally Posted by Madone59
This is news to me so let me add the * of. I got it all off Seatguru and only want to be judged on my efforts and not the quality of the information
I applaud the effort and I apologize for the tenor of my post; I probably could have written it in a more friendly manner. No meanness was intended. Compiling data can be difficult and it's entirely possible that even the airlines' sites will contain errors or misleading info.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 10:32 am
  #143  
 
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Originally Posted by FWAAA
No meanness was intended.
and no meanness was interpreted, no worries.
Last edited by Madone59; Jan 23, 2015 at 2:01 pm Reason: tpyo
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 12:41 pm
  #144  
 
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Originally Posted by jetsetEWR
i can bet big money UA will copy the same 17/31 torture chamber that qualifies for prosecution at The Hague

But you gotta give AC some credit ... they have created the single CASM king of the 77W world while still offering 36 flat bed J and true Y+ cabins.
Originally Posted by Madone59
This is why. They aren't the narrowest, and don't have the worst pitch.....they (and AA) have them both together though.

NH: 16.5w 31-34p
AC: 17.0w 31p
AA: 17.0w 31p
EK: 17.0w 33-34p
AF: 17.0w 32p
NZ: 17.1w 32-33p
EY: 17.5w 31-33p
KL: 17.5w 31p
SU: 17.8w 30-32p
KE: 18.0w 33-34p
TK: 18.0w 31-32p
AI: 18.0w 33p
9W: 18.5w 32p
CA: 18.0w 32p
CX: 18.5w 32p
That makes sense. I only seemed to hear the complaint about 10 across when referencing AC. I agree that the pitch is horrible.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 1:18 pm
  #145  
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Keep in mind that there is no standard for measuring seat width on a plane, unlike for pitch, so there's a decent chance that even when working with accurate numbers the space they represent may not line up.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 2:04 pm
  #146  
 
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I would take any airline's reporting of seat pitch/width with reservation. Since it is self reported, no real purpose served being too honest with the customers when implementing a high density configuration.

That said, the Boeing 300ER fuselage dimension is a given and even with a relatively generous business class of 36 seats, Air Canada manages to squeeze 422 economy seats (24PE/398E) into the plane. The comparable AA plane (admittedly with 8F and 1/3 more J @52) has 250 economy (30PE/220E).
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 2:11 pm
  #147  
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Originally Posted by luckypierre

That said, the Boeing 300ER fuselage dimension is a given and even with a relatively generous business class of 36 seats, Air Canada manages to squeeze 422 economy seats (24PE/398E) into the plane. The comparable AA plane (admittedly with 8F and 1/3 more J @52) has 250 economy (30PE/220E).
The AC 77W HD also draws criticism for being severely under-lav'ed, which probably explains how they got the extra seats in. I think there are also issues with the galleys, all contributing to what is by all reports one of the most miserable long haul Y experiences in the world.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 2:32 pm
  #148  
 
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Originally Posted by sbm12
Keep in mind that there is no standard for measuring seat width on a plane, unlike for pitch, so there's a decent chance that even when working with accurate numbers the space they represent may not line up.
Indeed, this is something that has always bugged me. I think "between in the inside of the armrest" would be a great standard. Guess that is too much to ask for from the industry.

Also amusing how seat guru gets so much wrong. The whole point of their site is to have accurate information on seats, yet...
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 2:38 pm
  #149  
 
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Originally Posted by jacobac00
Indeed, this is something that has always bugged me. I think "between in the inside of the armrest" would be a great standard. Guess that is too much to ask for from the industry.
Agreed - PMUA for example reported IPTE biz seat width from the outside of the armrests.

Speaking of armrests, armrest width is something that also comes up in the discussions about shrinking personal space (I forget which airline that pax allege the armrests were also shrunk, resulting in more fighting with neighbors). So even if there's a standard for seat width measurement, there are still other factors.
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Old Jan 23, 2015, 2:42 pm
  #150  
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Originally Posted by gengar
Agreed - PMUA for example reported IPTE biz seat width from the outside of the armrests.
Which probably didn't really add that much, as the armrests on the 763 and 772 have to be the narrowest J armrests in the world.
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