Jun 4, 2014, 7:33 am
Last edit by: mkr
UAL
earnings released: Thursday, July 24,2014 9:30 am CST/10:30 EST
If you missed the live webcast of the 2nd Q earnings conference call, it is now available for replay for a limited time and will later be archived.
A transcript is now available also.
Click this link for access to replay and transcript of call:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/23227909-post151.html
Current 2Q 2014 UAL guidance (4/24/14 investor update):
PRASM +1-3%
ASM "quarter, flat to +1%, full year +.5 to 1.5%"
CASM ex fuel, "quarter +1.25 to 2.25%, full year +1-2%"
Analyst guidance/actual 2Q 2013 results:
6/5/14 estimates:
1.86/share (using the 367M shares from last release $682M profit ex special items) [2q 2013 actual was $521M; $1.35/share ex specials; $469M GAAP]
Revenue 10.33B (3.3% growth) [2q 2013 was $10B]
Actual results:
- $789m GAAP Net income, $2.34/share. 7.6% margin
- $919m Net Income (excluding specials) or $1.04 per share. 8.9% margin
- $906m Operating Income (8.8% margin)
- $1.08B Operating Income excluding specials (10.4% margin)
- PRASM up 3.7%, yield up 3.0%; domestic yield +6.8%
- ASM -0.1%
- CASM-Ex fuel, profit sharing and special items down 0.2%
- Operating Revenue: $10.33B (up 3.3%); Passenger Revenue $8.98B( up3.6%)
- $1.5B in operating cash flow
Links to UA Press Releases / News Articles / etc.:
DAL
earnings released: Wednesday July 23 at 10 edt. Call link: https://event.on24.com/eventRegistra...epage=register
Actual results:
- $801m GAAP Net income, $0.94/diluted share. 7.5% margin
- $889m Net Income (excluding specials) or $1.04 per share. 8.4% margin
Delta's pre-tax income, ex special items was $1.4 billion.
- $1.58B Operating Income (14.9% margin)
- $1.61B Operating Income excluding specials (15.1% margin)
- PRASM up 5.7%, yield up 3.8%; domestic yield +7.4%
- ASM +3.2%
- CASM-Ex fuel, profit sharing and special items was FLAT
- Operating Revenue: $10.62B (up 9%); Passenger Revenue $9.27B ( up9%)
- Over $2.0B in operating cash flow and $1.5B in free cash, net debt $7.9B
3Q projections: Operating margin +15 to +17%, CASM +0 to 2%, "unit revenues" (I take to be PRASM - spin) +2-4% "driven by continued corporate and domestic strength, along with benefits from our revenue initiatives."
Links to DL Press Releases / News Articles / etc.:
http://news.delta.com/2014-07-23-Del...Quarter-Profit
AAL - earnings call: July 24, 2014 at 12:30 cdt
link to call: http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix....estorrelations
Estimates/AAL guidance:
2Q PRASM +5-7% (updated estimate from 6/9/14 traffic release). YTD ASM +2.5%.
Actual results:
- $864m GAAP Net income
- $1.5B Net Income (excluding specials)
- $11.4B Revenue (+10.2%)
- Yeld +6.5% (17.34)
- PRASM up 5.9%, (14.57)
- ASM +3.1%
- CASM +3.9% (13.61)
earnings released: Thursday, July 24,2014 9:30 am CST/10:30 EST
If you missed the live webcast of the 2nd Q earnings conference call, it is now available for replay for a limited time and will later be archived.
A transcript is now available also.
Click this link for access to replay and transcript of call:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/23227909-post151.html
Current 2Q 2014 UAL guidance (4/24/14 investor update):
PRASM +1-3%
ASM "quarter, flat to +1%, full year +.5 to 1.5%"
CASM ex fuel, "quarter +1.25 to 2.25%, full year +1-2%"
Analyst guidance/actual 2Q 2013 results:
6/5/14 estimates:
1.86/share (using the 367M shares from last release $682M profit ex special items) [2q 2013 actual was $521M; $1.35/share ex specials; $469M GAAP]
Revenue 10.33B (3.3% growth) [2q 2013 was $10B]
Actual results:
- $789m GAAP Net income, $2.34/share. 7.6% margin
- $919m Net Income (excluding specials) or $1.04 per share. 8.9% margin
- $906m Operating Income (8.8% margin)
- $1.08B Operating Income excluding specials (10.4% margin)
- PRASM up 3.7%, yield up 3.0%; domestic yield +6.8%
- ASM -0.1%
- CASM-Ex fuel, profit sharing and special items down 0.2%
- Operating Revenue: $10.33B (up 3.3%); Passenger Revenue $8.98B( up3.6%)
- $1.5B in operating cash flow
Links to UA Press Releases / News Articles / etc.:
UA Deutsche Bank Presentation PDF
WSJ Article: United Continental: One Sick Bird - related FT thread on WSJ's One Sick Bird article.
May 2014 UA Traffic Reporting Discussion Thread
Q1 2014 Investor Conference Call FT Discussion Thread
United Continental Is Underestimating the Threat From Delta Air Lines @ The Motley Fool - related FT Discussion Thread
United Should Close Dulles Hub, Analyst Says, as He Cuts Rating - FT Discussion Thread
WSJ Article: United Continental: One Sick Bird - related FT thread on WSJ's One Sick Bird article.
May 2014 UA Traffic Reporting Discussion Thread
Q1 2014 Investor Conference Call FT Discussion Thread
United Continental Is Underestimating the Threat From Delta Air Lines @ The Motley Fool - related FT Discussion Thread
United Should Close Dulles Hub, Analyst Says, as He Cuts Rating - FT Discussion Thread
DAL
earnings released: Wednesday July 23 at 10 edt. Call link: https://event.on24.com/eventRegistra...epage=register
Actual results:
- $801m GAAP Net income, $0.94/diluted share. 7.5% margin
- $889m Net Income (excluding specials) or $1.04 per share. 8.4% margin
Delta's pre-tax income, ex special items was $1.4 billion.
- $1.58B Operating Income (14.9% margin)
- $1.61B Operating Income excluding specials (15.1% margin)
- PRASM up 5.7%, yield up 3.8%; domestic yield +7.4%
- ASM +3.2%
- CASM-Ex fuel, profit sharing and special items was FLAT
- Operating Revenue: $10.62B (up 9%); Passenger Revenue $9.27B ( up9%)
- Over $2.0B in operating cash flow and $1.5B in free cash, net debt $7.9B
3Q projections: Operating margin +15 to +17%, CASM +0 to 2%, "unit revenues" (I take to be PRASM - spin) +2-4% "driven by continued corporate and domestic strength, along with benefits from our revenue initiatives."
Links to DL Press Releases / News Articles / etc.:
http://news.delta.com/2014-07-23-Del...Quarter-Profit
AAL - earnings call: July 24, 2014 at 12:30 cdt
link to call: http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix....estorrelations
Estimates/AAL guidance:
2Q PRASM +5-7% (updated estimate from 6/9/14 traffic release). YTD ASM +2.5%.
Actual results:
- $864m GAAP Net income
- $1.5B Net Income (excluding specials)
- $11.4B Revenue (+10.2%)
- Yeld +6.5% (17.34)
- PRASM up 5.9%, (14.57)
- ASM +3.1%
- CASM +3.9% (13.61)
UAL 2Q 2014 Results/Discussion/News → Results Announced July 24th, 2014 ←
Jul 24, 2014, 11:07 am
#257
Join Date: May 2009
Location: San Diego
Programs: Star, Oneworld, Skymiles, SPG
Posts: 243
I managed to snag two very good fares in August: SAN-HNL RT for $440 and SAN-LHR RT for $997. While these fares are good for me, they are not good for UA. I expect by labor day to have 38,000 PQM and barely $2,500 PQD including $160 for E+ seats. Averages out to 6.5 cents per mile. UA is not making any money on my tickets.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:13 am
#258
Join Date: Oct 2006
Programs: Onepass
Posts: 217
It was in reference to going to the used market for additional narrowbody mainline aircraft. They, Compton?, mentioned that while the new aircraft producers are coming out with are marvels, they're trying to grow while controlling CAPEX. I think the reference was towards the new C Series and other similar aircraft.
They referenced used 738s and A320s, specifically that 738s are more expensive than similarly aged A320s. Not sure if by A320s they were also including A319s. Since they've increased the capacity on the Airbuses with the slimlines their CASM has improved. Might be an opportunity to grab some Airbuses from operators who are upgrading to the NEOs.
They referenced used 738s and A320s, specifically that 738s are more expensive than similarly aged A320s. Not sure if by A320s they were also including A319s. Since they've increased the capacity on the Airbuses with the slimlines their CASM has improved. Might be an opportunity to grab some Airbuses from operators who are upgrading to the NEOs.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:19 am
#259
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: LGA/JFK/EWR
Programs: UA 1K1.75MM, Hyatt Globalist, abandoned Marriott LTT (RIP SPG), Hertz PC
Posts: 21,172
I managed to snag two very good fares in August: SAN-HNL RT for $440 and SAN-LHR RT for $997. While these fares are good for me, they are not good for UA. I expect by labor day to have 38,000 PQM and barely $2,500 PQD including $160 for E+ seats. Averages out to 6.5 cents per mile. UA is not making any money on my tickets.
Again - if UA doesn't want to offer those fares, they don't have to! So you snagging them doesn't make you a "bad customer".
Jul 24, 2014, 11:20 am
#260
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: What I write is my opinion alone..don't read into it anything not written.
Posts: 9,686
Jul 24, 2014, 11:23 am
#261
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York, NY
Programs: UA, AA, DL, Hertz, Avis, National, Hyatt, Hilton, SPG, Marriott
Posts: 9,454
They could likely put in orders for E190/195, the 190 holds 94, and the 195 106 in 2 class standard config. They would probably have to operate those as mainline.
I don't really know what sort of used aircraft would become available in the seating range they seem to need more. The 318/736 come to mind but they are very high CASM aircraft.
I don't really know what sort of used aircraft would become available in the seating range they seem to need more. The 318/736 come to mind but they are very high CASM aircraft.
The A320 is probably United's preferred machine, as the 319 already has the highest CASM of the narrowbody fleet and the used 321 market is almost nonexistent.
The 737-600 or A318 are non-starters.
I don't think they're trying to address a ~100-seater capacity gap as much as they are trying to get more planes, period.
They alluded to used 738s and Airbuses, and mentioned that a used Airbus is cheaper than a used 738. That's probably more along the lines of what they're thinking.
They alluded to used 738s and Airbuses, and mentioned that a used Airbus is cheaper than a used 738. That's probably more along the lines of what they're thinking.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:24 am
#262
Suspended
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: DEN
Programs: Delta Silver. Former AA gold. UA MP and DL Plat AMEX cardholder
Posts: 1,254
It was in reference to going to the used market for additional narrowbody mainline aircraft. They, Compton?, mentioned that while the new aircraft producers are coming out with are marvels, they're trying to grow while controlling CAPEX. I think the reference was towards the new C Series and other similar aircraft.
They referenced used 738s and A320s, specifically that 738s are more expensive than similarly aged A320s. Not sure if by A320s they were also including A319s. Since they've increased the capacity on the Airbuses with the slimlines their CASM has improved. Might be an opportunity to grab some Airbuses from operators who are upgrading to the NEOs.
They referenced used 738s and A320s, specifically that 738s are more expensive than similarly aged A320s. Not sure if by A320s they were also including A319s. Since they've increased the capacity on the Airbuses with the slimlines their CASM has improved. Might be an opportunity to grab some Airbuses from operators who are upgrading to the NEOs.
Why wouldn't they pull 757s out of the desert if they need more metal? Not to mention A320s are cheaper because they typically don't last as long as a 737 from a cycle perspective.
I don't buy it. I think they mentioned that piece for the investors to be happy. Same thing as saying they will be adding streaming entertainment "soon" with no end date.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:25 am
#263
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Bay Area, CA
Programs: UA Plat 2MM; AS MVP Gold 75K
Posts: 35,068
Exactly. Right now, with LFs in the high 80s and strong PRASM performance in the domestic network, UA simply needs more frames. UA is standing behind their logic in replacing domestic 752s with 739ERs, and it's hard to argue with the bottom-line savings, but UA still needs a less capital-intensive solution to get more airplanes into the low end of the fleet.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:29 am
#265
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Join Date: Apr 2012
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Programs: Delta Silver. Former AA gold. UA MP and DL Plat AMEX cardholder
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UA pulling a DL and getting used aircraft goes against everything they stand for from an MX perspective. It would likely be much cheaper to take sUA 757 and modify them to their liking rather than buying 30-40 airbus from a 3rd world operator and refresh them. Talk about just sinking money into each frame just to get them up to speed.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:32 am
#266
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
The logic for buying used aircraft seems backwards for UA and ordering new planes.
Why wouldn't they pull 757s out of the desert if they need more metal? Not to mention A320s are cheaper because they typically don't last as long as a 737 from a cycle perspective.
I don't buy it. I think they mentioned that piece for the investors to be happy. Same thing as saying they will be adding streaming entertainment "soon" with no end date.
Why wouldn't they pull 757s out of the desert if they need more metal? Not to mention A320s are cheaper because they typically don't last as long as a 737 from a cycle perspective.
I don't buy it. I think they mentioned that piece for the investors to be happy. Same thing as saying they will be adding streaming entertainment "soon" with no end date.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:37 am
#267
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Bay Area, CA
Programs: UA Plat 2MM; AS MVP Gold 75K
Posts: 35,068
UA pulling a DL and getting used aircraft goes against everything they stand for from an MX perspective. It would likely be much cheaper to take sUA 757 and modify them to their liking rather than buying 30-40 airbus from a 3rd world operator and refresh them. Talk about just sinking money into each frame just to get them up to speed.
That said, it now a proven strategy based on DL's results -- they have been buying both used MD-90s and the AirTran 717s, in conjunction with their new equipment.
Just like buying a car, there's a benefit to not having as large a cash outlay (or a payment).
It's also much faster than ordering new aircraft if they don't want to miss this economic cycle.
One of the benefits of having a mixed Airbus/Boeing narrowbody fleet, they can be open to either type of aircraft without impacting their ops too much. Which also flies in the face of traditional CO thinking.
Maybe they're growing up.
Jul 24, 2014, 11:39 am
#269
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: LAX
Programs: UA MM | BA Silver
Posts: 7,193
Also, I can't tell from the thread, is UNITED talking about buying or leasing used AC?
Jul 24, 2014, 11:40 am
#270
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Programs: Delta Silver. Former AA gold. UA MP and DL Plat AMEX cardholder
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