Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion.
Apr 4, 2014, 2:13 pm
#4666
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New Orleans
Programs: UA life gold, UA/CO life Presidents/United Club since 1965; Marriott life titanium, HH diamond
Posts: 597
Apr 4, 2014, 2:15 pm
#4667
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Million Miler, United Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond, Choice Hotels Diamond
Posts: 12,148
A Bonus Bonus question, then, about American Airlines. How many types of aircraft have they bought which were hopeless, and which they started to sell off within, say. seven years of the last one being delivered new, well before their depreciation was up. I think they must hold an unenviable record for how often this has happened to them.
I would add to the list of models bought the MD-11. As for inherited, the Trans-Caribbean DC-8s were quickly disposed of, and I don't believe the ex-TWA 747SPs spent much time wearing the AA eagle either. Also, add the ex-Reno Air MD90s to the list.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Apr 4, 2014, 2:19 pm
#4668
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Million Miler, United Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond, Choice Hotels Diamond
Posts: 12,148
12. Ottawa, Canada was served by one international flight. Please identify the route, the airline and the equipment.
Any specific range of dates? Back in mid '90s, there was CP YOW-LHR with 763 equipment.
Summer of 1968. We've since established that this was flown by Eastern Airlines with a 727-100 from Ottawa to Syracuse and beyond to DCA, MIA and NAS.
14. Sticking with the spring of 1994, please identify the three airlines that enjoyed fifth freedom rights on the New York to Montreal route.
I seem to remember AR and RG doing this route a few years earlier. Note sure if that extended to spring 1994.
You've got one of the airlines right. We're looking for a total of three airlines. Feel free to add the aircraft types flown as well if you like...
Apr 4, 2014, 2:20 pm
#4669
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SEA (the REAL Washington); occasionally in the other Washington (DCA area)
Programs: DL PM 1.57MM; AS MVPG 100K
Posts: 21,375
I will add the MD-11 and the 747SP to the list of AA-purchased models that didn't remain in the fleet for very long (the SPs had been in service with TWA, but AA acquired them in order to start DFW-Tokyo service well before TW's final bankruptcy and the merger)
geez, Seat2A, timing is everything!
geez, Seat2A, timing is everything!
Last edited by jrl767; Apr 4, 2014 at 2:21 pm Reason: great minds thinking and typing alike
Apr 4, 2014, 2:25 pm
#4670
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Million Miler, United Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond, Choice Hotels Diamond
Posts: 12,148
I will add the MD-11 and the 747SP to the list of AA-purchased models that didn't remain in the fleet for very long (the SPs had been in service with TWA, but AA acquired them in order to start DFW-Tokyo service well before TW's final bankruptcy and the merger)
geez, Seat2A, timing is everything!
geez, Seat2A, timing is everything!
Apr 4, 2014, 2:34 pm
#4671
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Million Miler, United Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond, Choice Hotels Diamond
Posts: 12,148
Apr 4, 2014, 2:35 pm
#4672
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Million Miler, United Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond, Choice Hotels Diamond
Posts: 12,148
Here are the remaining unanswered questions:
13. It’s spring of 1994 and the days of multiple nonstops between New York JFK and Nassau with BOAC, Northeast and Pan Am are long gone. Now you need to fly nonstop from Nassau up to New York’s JFK and only one airline offers a single daily nonstop. Please identify the airline and the aircraft operated on this route. A N S W E R E D
14. Sticking with the spring of 1994, please identify the three airlines that enjoyed fifth freedom rights on the New York to Montreal route. A N S W E R E D
15. Which airline operated the first scheduled dual class aircraft flight in the U.S.? What year did it begin and what type of aircraft was used? A N S W E R E D
16. It’s the spring of 1983 and you want to fly from Hartford, Connecticut to Buffalo, New York. Normally you’d call US Air but a new airline is offering nonstop jet service on this route. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used. A N S W E R E D
17. In the late 1990s, this airline operated the only nonstop service between Chicago’s Midway Airport and Myrtle Beach, North Carolina with a single daily flight. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used. A N S W E R E D
18. Fast forward seven years and now another airline is serving the Chicago to Myrtle Beach market with nonstop jet flights four days a week out of the nearby Gary, Indiana airport. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used. A N S W E R E D
13. It’s spring of 1994 and the days of multiple nonstops between New York JFK and Nassau with BOAC, Northeast and Pan Am are long gone. Now you need to fly nonstop from Nassau up to New York’s JFK and only one airline offers a single daily nonstop. Please identify the airline and the aircraft operated on this route. A N S W E R E D
14. Sticking with the spring of 1994, please identify the three airlines that enjoyed fifth freedom rights on the New York to Montreal route. A N S W E R E D
15. Which airline operated the first scheduled dual class aircraft flight in the U.S.? What year did it begin and what type of aircraft was used? A N S W E R E D
16. It’s the spring of 1983 and you want to fly from Hartford, Connecticut to Buffalo, New York. Normally you’d call US Air but a new airline is offering nonstop jet service on this route. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used. A N S W E R E D
17. In the late 1990s, this airline operated the only nonstop service between Chicago’s Midway Airport and Myrtle Beach, North Carolina with a single daily flight. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used. A N S W E R E D
18. Fast forward seven years and now another airline is serving the Chicago to Myrtle Beach market with nonstop jet flights four days a week out of the nearby Gary, Indiana airport. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used. A N S W E R E D
Last edited by Seat 2A; Apr 6, 2014 at 7:05 pm
Apr 5, 2014, 3:43 pm
#4673
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: LFT
Programs: AA Plat, lots of AA, AS, DL, UA miles, former top level CO Elite (sigh...)
Posts: 10,795
As for the other two air carriers, let's go with Royal Air Maroc (AT) with a B747SP and LADECO (UC) with a B757. Routing for the Royal Air Maroc service was probably Casablanca (CMN) - New York (JFK) - Montreal Mirabel (YMX) while the routing for the LADECO flight may have been Buenos Aires (EZE) - Santiago (SCL) - Miami (MIA) - New York (JFK) - Montreal Mirabel (YMX).
Apr 5, 2014, 4:18 pm
#4674
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 8,476
However, I believe the first dual class flights were on prop aircraft, and Pan Am on LAX/SFO to Honolulu in the early-1950s was a pioneer US route, some of the aircraft with sleeper berths, along with lower priced reclining seats. Aircraft would be a Boeing Stratocruiser.
Apr 5, 2014, 5:04 pm
#4675
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Million Miler, United Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond, Choice Hotels Diamond
Posts: 12,148
14. Sticking with the spring of 1994, please identify the three airlines that enjoyed fifth freedom rights on the New York to Montreal route.
Aerolineas Argentinas (AR) has already been correctly guessed so I'll add that this airline may have been operating an A310 with a routing of Cordoba (COR) - Buenos Aires (EZE) - New York (JFK) - Montreal Mirabel (YMX).
As for the other two air carriers, let's go with Royal Air Maroc (AT) with a B747SP and LADECO (UC) with a B757. Routing for the Royal Air Maroc service was probably Casablanca (CMN) - New York (JFK) - Montreal Mirabel (YMX) while the routing for the LADECO flight may have been Buenos Aires (EZE) - Santiago (SCL) - Miami (MIA) - New York (JFK) - Montreal Mirabel (YMX).
With regard to the three airlines - correct on all counts! With regard to the aircraft, per the schedule I was referencing, Aerolineas Argentinas was operating a 747, Royal Air Maroc a 747-400 and LADECO a 757-200.
Originally Posted by WHBM
15. Which airline operated the first scheduled dual class aircraft flight in the U.S.? What year did it begin and what type of aircraft was used?
Dual class originally came with separate aircraft used for the two classes of service, with the cheaper seats being in the older aircraft. This was finally squelched by the first jets, large enough to hold all classes. However, I believe the first dual class flights were on prop aircraft, and Pan Am on LAX/SFO to Honolulu in the early-1950s was a pioneer US route, some of the aircraft with sleeper berths, along with lower priced reclining seats. Aircraft would be a Boeing Stratocruiser.
According to information provided in Jon Proctor's book "From Props to Jets" it was TWA's 1049G Super Constellation in 1956. Here's a quote from the page:
"Ambassador Service was greatly enhanced with the introduction of 1049G Super G Constellations in September 1956, the first dual-class aircraft in the United States. Passengers seated in the noisier forward cabin received "Golden Banner Deluxe Coach Service" that featured hot meals for purchase, along with cocktails for sale. Meanwhile, a limited number of sleeping berths were available for Ambassador Class passengers on night flights. In the more spacious mid-cabin Mural Lounge, canapés were offered from a silver serving tray, along with cocktails before an elaborate meal service with wine and Champagne."
Now here's a question for you: If Mr. Proctor's information is correct, was this the world's first dual class service or only the first in the U.S.?
Last edited by Seat 2A; Apr 5, 2014 at 5:16 pm
Apr 5, 2014, 5:37 pm
#4676
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 8,476
Although Pan Am were offering First Class and Tourist (which they called Rainbow) by this time on Hawaii flights, I've just realised that Hawaii was not in the USA until a few years later ..........
Better leave such to the locals
Better leave such to the locals
Apr 5, 2014, 5:41 pm
#4677
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: IWA
Programs: DL, AA
Posts: 3,923
16. It’s the spring of 1983 and you want to fly from Hartford, Connecticut to Buffalo, New York. Normally you’d call US Air but a new airline is offering nonstop jet service on this route. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used.
You must be talking about Best Airlines flying DC-9-10 series aircraft.
You must be talking about Best Airlines flying DC-9-10 series aircraft.
Apr 5, 2014, 5:44 pm
#4678
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Million Miler, United Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond, Choice Hotels Diamond
Posts: 12,148
16. It’s the spring of 1983 and you want to fly from Hartford, Connecticut to Buffalo, New York. Normally you’d call US Air but a new airline is offering nonstop jet service on this route. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used.
You must be talking about Best Airlines flying DC-9-10 series aircraft.
I am, Icecat, I am. Good call! ^^
Apr 5, 2014, 6:16 pm
#4679
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: New York
Posts: 1,257
Only a few years after TWA's introduction of the dual-class 1049G its cachet was surpassed by that of jets. In February, 1964, a friend, who had never before been on an airplane, and I decided to fly from JFK to Hartford/Springfield and back. TWA's deal was that an economy-class ticket got one an economy-class seat on a 707 or a first-class seat on a 1049G. So we jetted to BDL and flew back in comfort, albeit without the canapes and cocktails. The surprising thing was the 707 on such a short flight shortly after introduction of jets.
Apr 5, 2014, 6:27 pm
#4680
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: IWA
Programs: DL, AA
Posts: 3,923
18. Fast forward seven years and now another airline is serving the Chicago to Myrtle Beach market with nonstop jet flights four days a week out of the nearby Gary, Indiana airport. Please identify the airline and the aircraft used.
Hooters Air operated by Pace as a public charter using 737-200/300 aircraft on Thursday, Friday, Sunday and Monday.
Hooters Air operated by Pace as a public charter using 737-200/300 aircraft on Thursday, Friday, Sunday and Monday.