Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Destinations > Europe > Nordic Region
Reload this Page >

Coronavirus in Sweden

Coronavirus in Sweden

Old Aug 12, 2022, 12:15 pm
  #2956  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Stockholm
Programs: Various
Posts: 3,368
Originally Posted by nacho
It is mission impossible: Elbrist is not caused by lack of supply as Sweden is the biggest exporter of electricity in Europe. Which party dares to come up with a plan to renew all the grid?

SD wants nuclear plants, and it's a good solution for back up when the renewables are not reliable, but building one takes 15 years and I wonder which kommun would be happy to host a nuclear plant.
The question is why Sweden forced Vattenfall to close two Ringhals reactors.Not that we don't know but lying politicians could deny it.

Regarding the first point it helps to know that the different prices in the country is due to Denmark's complaints. They first complained we had Barsebäck open and after we closed that they then complained we didn't export enough to Denmark...
Fredrik74 is offline  
Old Aug 12, 2022, 3:35 pm
  #2957  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Originally Posted by Fredrik74
The question is why Sweden forced Vattenfall to close two Ringhals reactors.Not that we don't know but lying politicians could deny it.

Regarding the first point it helps to know that the different prices in the country is due to Denmark's complaints. They first complained we had Barsebäck open and after we closed that they then complained we didn't export enough to Denmark...
Reactors should perhaps be considered to have a finite lifespan of c. 40 years or so. For technical reasons but also because of technical skills/knowledge transfer issues and to keep people fresh and on their toes.

Isn’t electricity more expensive around Varberg than around Kiruna?

Originally Posted by nacho
They both have SD as their initials

Immigration? I thought the main topics of this election would be elbrist (lead to multiple municipalities had to turn away businesses because they don't have enough electricity supply), high electricity prices, healthcare and crime.

I think Covid-19 is not really a topic in this election because the opinion is that it's over. I doubt any politician will bring that up because every single parliament member was responsible for the high death tolls.
Covid-19 is completely irrelevant in Sweden at this point, and there will be basically no accountability or credit for what went on during the pandemic.

Given that even Scandinavian billionaires are marking down their Swedish property prices to try to get property sales to happen, and given the inflation and interest rate scene is hitting the property market and consumers in general, the appetite to rush up the property-related taxes can’t be great. Who wants property taxes back in an environment like this.

There seems to be more growing appetite in Sweden to mass-medicate poor children for ADHD than to even make children get vaccinated against Covid-19.

This evening on the way back into Sweden from Copenhagen, I saw no Swedish border control at Hyllie. In the area between Malmo Arena and the Hyllie train station, I did see two residual Swedish police cars — one marked and one unmarked — parked where it’s illegal for the average Svensson to park. In other words, the police had drawn down most of the remaining passport control presence by the time I returned today. Could have been dinner break this time, but not sure about that.

Last edited by GUWonder; Aug 12, 2022 at 3:53 pm
GUWonder is offline  
Old Aug 13, 2022, 3:06 am
  #2958  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: CPH
Programs: UAMP S, TK M&S E (*G), Marriott LTP, IHG P, SK EBG
Posts: 11,077
Sweden needs a renewed grid for the nation. The excess electricity produced in the north can't really get to the south. I think Ringhals needs a renovation too.

It's profitable to sell electricity with the current prices and Sweden needs a new nuclear plant and grid.

Denmark is a bit like Germany about nuclear power. The land in Barseback can be super desirable for building expensive villas.

About mass medicating children with ADHD/autism, it's not something new. I know someone who told me that if a parent contacted bup and they will certainly medicate the child as the first thing.

I have seen police in Sweden parking illegally in various places. I used the ferry to Sweden and never got checked. I don't know if checking passport is mostly for the bridge.
nacho is offline  
Old Aug 13, 2022, 6:43 pm
  #2959  
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: USA
Programs: American Airlines (Executive Platinum), Hyatt (Globalist), Hilton (Diamond), IHG (Diamond)
Posts: 2,917
Originally Posted by GUWonder
So as vacations get wrapped up and coughing in Sweden starts to become increasingly prevalent again on public transport, Sweden goes back to ramping up border control checks for those arriving into Malmo on the trains from CPH during the busy commuter hours. What a wasteful dog and pony show.
What does this entail? Thanks.
js1993 is offline  
Old Aug 15, 2022, 12:51 pm
  #2960  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Originally Posted by js1993
What does this entail? Thanks.
If getting off at the Hyllie stop in Sweden, it may involve checking your passport biodata page against you, checking passport stamps, and asking about the stay location and purpose of stay. Only the first of those is the most common when encountering passport control in Sweden when taking the train into the country in southern Sweden when using a US passport.

For those arriving train passengers not getting off the train at the Hyllie stop, then the passport control personnel may board the train at the Hyllie stop and perform these passport/ID checks for all passengers before allowing the train to continue onward. At times, it’s this on-board passport/ID check that is most variable in how long it takes to conclude.

It’s a wasteful dog and pony show when it’s performed since it involves so many personnel and vehicles to hassle people who can get into Sweden pretty easily anyway by just coming later or taking another way and asylum/refugee claimants are mostly admitted anyway.
js1993 likes this.
GUWonder is offline  
Old Aug 15, 2022, 1:11 pm
  #2961  
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: USA
Programs: American Airlines (Executive Platinum), Hyatt (Globalist), Hilton (Diamond), IHG (Diamond)
Posts: 2,917
Originally Posted by GUWonder
If getting off at the Hyllie stop in Sweden, it may involve checking your passport biodata page against you, checking passport stamps, and asking about the stay location and purpose of stay. Only the first of those is the most common when encountering passport control in Sweden when taking the train into the country in southern Sweden when using a US passport.

For those arriving train passengers not getting off the train at the Hyllie stop, then the passport control personnel may board the train at the Hyllie stop and perform these passport/ID checks for all passengers before allowing the train to continue onward. At times, it’s this on-board passport/ID check that is most variable in how long it takes to conclude.

It’s a wasteful dog and pony show when it’s performed since it involves so many personnel and vehicles to hassle people who can get into Sweden pretty easily anyway by just coming later or taking another way and asylum/refugee claimants are mostly admitted anyway.
Thanks. Nothing related to Covid vax or testing?
js1993 is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2022, 4:05 am
  #2962  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Originally Posted by js1993
Thanks. Nothing related to Covid vax or testing?
They gave up checking for vaccination and testing results since Sweden gave up such requirements. So coughing up a lung without a test result or vaccination proof is not a problem at these checkpoints anymore. They unfortunately didn’t give up the passport/ID checks.
js1993 likes this.
GUWonder is offline  
Old Oct 3, 2023, 2:00 pm
  #2963  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: ARN
Posts: 3,470
When this thread was first created, I posted a lot in it. But with time, I stopped posting simply because Flyertalk in general, and this thread specifically, took far too much of my time. Due to work and family obligations, I just had to reduce the amount of time that I spent on FT.

Recently, however, I took another look at statistics for the three Scandinavian countries for 2020-2022. And I was not surprised at what I found.

All of the figures that I’ve based these charts on, are taken directly from ssb.no, scb.se, and dst.dk.

What’s quite clear when comparing these charts is that Sweden has handled the “pandemic” better than Norway, and way better than Denmark.

I am, and have always been, convinced that the reason for this is that much of what has been done to fight covid has destroyed people's physical and mental health, while at the same time, the economy and society at large has been damaged. In Scandinavia, Denmark was without a doubt the country with the most restrictions in the fight against covid, and Sweden was the country with the fewest restrictions.

Take face masks as an example. Cochrane studies have shown that masks do little or no good in reducing the transmission of an airborne virus. At the same time, there’s also a study that shows that mortality from covid-19 increases by 85 percent among people who use a face mask due to the Fögen effect. Another study shows that all face masks contain substances that cause cancer. Face masks can also cause hypercapnia. In addition, wearing a face mask leads to less empathy with fellow human beings, which can lead to an increase in violent crimes.

Therefore, it’s not surprising that countries with a population of “diligent” face mask users, have a higher total mortality than a country where most people never used a face mask, and it’s not surprising that Norway and Denmark have seen a steeper mortality increase than Sweden.


Chart 1: Mortality 2011-2022 per million





When comparing the three Scandinavian countries, we can see that Sweden and Denmark had roughly the same mortality during the past decade. This changed dramatically in 2021-2022. During these two years, Denmark had around 10 percent higher mortality than Sweden.

Mortality in Norway has for a long time been significantly lower than for both of the other two Scandinavian countries. This is perhaps partly due to the fact that Norway has a relatively younger population. But when you look at 2021-2022, you see that mortality in Norway is approaching the Swedish level. Between 2015-2018, mortality in Norway was 15-16 percent lower than mortality in Sweden, but in 2022, mortality in Norway was only seven per cent lower than in the country to the east.


Chart 2: Comparison of mortality 2015-2019 versus 2020-2022




This chart shows the decreased or increased mortality in 2020-2022 compared to 2015-2019. When covid arrived in 2020, Norway had a record low number. The “pandemic year” saw the lowest mortality in Norwegian history. In the same year, Denmark had slightly higher mortality than before, while Sweden had clearly higher mortality than in the previous five years.

In 2021, however, things started to change. In the year when “everyone” was “vaccinated,” Denmark had the same increase in mortality as Sweden had before the “vaccines” existed. In Norway, the graph also started to go awry. Sweden, on the other hand, saw a mortality that was far lower than the average for 2015-2019. In all of Swedish history, 2021 was the second best year in terms of mortality.

The next year, 2022, was a disaster year for both Norway and Denmark. Both countries had an increase of more than eight percent compared to the five years before the “pandemic.” Sweden continued with very low mortality.

The last bars show that Denmark had an average increase of 4.64%, while Norway had an increase of 2.03%, and Sweden had a very modest increase in mortality of 0.35% over these three years.


Chart 3: Excess deaths in 2020-2022




When you convert the increase in mortality into actual deaths, you find a total excess deaths over three years of 961 people in Sweden, 2570 people in Norway and 7608 people in Denmark. When you take the size of the population into account (Denmark is 44 percent smaller than Sweden, while Norway is 48 percent smaller), it’s not hard to see that many of the things that the governments did to fight covid, actually led to an increase in total mortality.
js1993 likes this.
RedChili is online now  
Old Oct 3, 2023, 3:46 pm
  #2964  
Hilton 10+ BadgeAccor 10+ Badge
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rhineland-Palatinate
Programs: *A Gold (A3), HHonor Gold
Posts: 5,685
Still citing the Cochrane study even when its author has themselves said it does not mean masks do not work, but that they are not studied well.
Or the masks contains cancer inducing toxins that is limited to a subset of masks from Korea and explains those substance disappear a few minutes after opening.
[mod edit]

Last edited by NewbieRunner; Oct 3, 2023 at 4:33 pm Reason: Rule 12 violation.
fransknorge is offline  
Old Oct 3, 2023, 4:04 pm
  #2965  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: CPH
Programs: UAMP S, TK M&S E (*G), Marriott LTP, IHG P, SK EBG
Posts: 11,077
Sweden has also shut down like the rest after a while. They even stopped Danes from entering Sweden (I know that because I had to get a Swedish passport to go home from Denmark to Sweden).

If you want to go an accurate study you need to look at the death rate when Sweden was wide open and there were plenty of numbers showing a much higher mortality rate compared to other Scandinavian countries.
GUWonder likes this.
nacho is offline  
Old Oct 3, 2023, 6:03 pm
  #2966  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Originally Posted by nacho
Sweden has also shut down like the rest after a while. They even stopped Danes from entering Sweden (I know that because I had to get a Swedish passport to go home from Denmark to Sweden).

If you want to go an accurate study you need to look at the death rate when Sweden was wide open and there were plenty of numbers showing a much higher mortality rate compared to other Scandinavian countries.
I know Danes who lived/live in Sweden and were stopped by Sweden from entering Sweden when returning home to Sweden from Denmark. Then hoops had to be jumped to get them back into Sweden. For various parts of the pandemic, Sweden seemed pretty shut down and restricted too. And Sweden seemed to have some restrictions longer than Denmark. In some ways Sweden was even more restricted and bizarre than what I saw in Denmark and Norway. Like the times where Swedish border control police with gigantic nozzle masks on at the Malmo-Hyllie station “border” saying you cannot get in and it’s human ping-pong unless claiming asylum.

Speaking of mental health, societal cohesion and criminal implications of the pandemic measures, the increase in gang activity, serious gang violence and illegal drug use seems to have been worse in post-pandemic Sweden than in post-pandemic Denmark.
GUWonder is offline  
Old Oct 3, 2023, 6:57 pm
  #2967  
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: USA
Programs: American Airlines (Executive Platinum), Hyatt (Globalist), Hilton (Diamond), IHG (Diamond)
Posts: 2,917
Originally Posted by GUWonder
Speaking of mental health, societal cohesion and criminal implications of the pandemic measures, the increase in gang activity, serious gang violence and illegal drug use seems to have been worse in post-pandemic Sweden than in post-pandemic Denmark.
Sweden has almost double the migrants on a per capita basis, but this is a topic for OMNI.
js1993 is offline  
Old Oct 3, 2023, 7:15 pm
  #2968  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Tokyo
Programs: JAL Metal Card (OWE), SAS Eurobonus Gold (*G), Marriott Titanium (LTP), Tokyu Hotels Platinum
Posts: 21,134
The Fögen Effect.... For anyone who wants to be mildly entertained, you should Google the advent of that term. Scientifically, it is down there with flat earthers, the abominable snowman, and other fun pseudo science.
CPH-Flyer is online now  
Old Oct 4, 2023, 3:13 am
  #2969  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
“Sweden has almost double the migrants on a per capita basis”?

…… and then that would just help make the point that these Johnny come lately excess mortality numbers need to control for the fact that foreign-origin individuals in Scandinavia tend to be younger on average than the domestic populations as a whole and that has consequences which can mask the true face of what has gone on as a result of the pandemic comparatively speaking.

Originally Posted by CPH-Flyer
The Fögen Effect.... For anyone who wants to be mildly entertained, you should Google the advent of that term. Scientifically, it is down there with flat earthers, the abominable snowman, and other fun pseudo science.
I had a stats-teaching instructor by that name. The effect of that was that I quickly learned that sometimes the pupils actually know the subject better than the teacher of the moment.

Fogen in Swedish refers to valid reason or cause. But then you have to strip away the confounding factors that act like fog.

Last edited by GUWonder; Oct 4, 2023 at 10:06 am
GUWonder is offline  
Old Oct 4, 2023, 9:22 am
  #2970  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: CPH
Programs: UAMP S, TK M&S E (*G), Marriott LTP, IHG P, SK EBG
Posts: 11,077
Originally Posted by GUWonder
I know Danes who lived/live in Sweden and were stopped by Sweden from entering Sweden when returning home to Sweden from Denmark. Then hoops had to be jumped to get them back into Sweden. For various parts of the pandemic, Sweden seemed pretty shut down and restricted too. And Sweden seemed to have some restrictions longer than Denmark. In some ways Sweden was even more restricted and bizarre than what I saw in Denmark and Norway. Like the times where Swedish border control police with gigantic nozzle masks on at the Malmo-Hyllie station “border” saying you cannot get in and it’s human ping-pong unless claiming asylum.

Speaking of mental health, societal cohesion and criminal implications of the pandemic measures, the increase in gang activity, serious gang violence and illegal drug use seems to have been worse in post-pandemic Sweden than in post-pandemic Denmark.
The most stupid thing is that you can fly from CPH to ARN without any issues but you can't drive into Sweden from Denmark. Remember Mr got a Swedish passport just to get a smoother ride home? I got one just to be able to go back to Sweden during the pandemic.

1/3 of the gang members in Uppsala are under 12...

The almost worthless SEK causing increase in cost = higher inflation.
nacho is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.