Rules for Involuntary & long-term Schedule Changes

Old Jun 15, 2018, 11:33 am
  #61  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 67
What's the new booking code? Still O? If not, don't forget to add your FF card to the reservation and collect those points
nollbit is offline  
Old Jun 15, 2018, 1:38 pm
  #62  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 789
Originally Posted by nollbit
What's the new booking code? Still O? If not, don't forget to add your FF card to the reservation and collect those points
you're very perceptive! Is that normal with a reissue that the fare bucket changes?
rosenkavalier is offline  
Old Jun 15, 2018, 3:00 pm
  #63  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 67
Originally Posted by rosenkavalier

you're very perceptive! Is that normal with a reissue that the fare bucket changes?
I don't know about "normal", but it does happen. I've only seen it on same day cancellations/delays when I've been rebooked. So you're in F or A now? If so, gratulations!
nollbit is offline  
Old Jun 16, 2018, 6:15 pm
  #64  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 789
Originally Posted by nollbit
I don't know about "normal", but it does happen. I've only seen it on same day cancellations/delays when I've been rebooked. So you're in F or A now? If so, gratulations!
will look into it...😉
rosenkavalier is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 1:45 am
  #65  
Moderator: SAS
Hyatt Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,125
Originally Posted by rosenkavalier
So, for those curious how this was resolved:
i called the LH First hotline, (very long wait times!) and they somehow had trouble confirming me for the flight with only 40 mins connection, which suited me perfectly. The system wouldn't confirm although it's a legal connection. Anyway, the agent offered the following alternative: LX F via ZRH! That's like striking the jackpot as far as I'm concerned as LX F is off limits (I'm not a member of Miles & More)
next question is the lounge access in ZRH as I've read many reports of LX denying F pax on their flights lounge access if booked on codeshare. (I know I'm not codeshare but just wanted to check to avoid bad surprises) Since I'm at ZRH right now waiting for another flight, I walked from the SEN lounge to the F lounge to ask personally if my situation would allow access. (LX flight number, F cabin, award on partner ticket stock) it took 3 lounge employees (including a supervisor) to confirm that as long as I had a boarding pass in LX F, I would be granted access. It seems that since a few months, they have abolished their very 'bnzli' rule of denying pax on LX F metal access just because they booked on a codeshare.
So all in all I think a very good resolution.
Thank you to all who participated in this discussion.


Congratulations! You are one lucky guy (or girl).

Since it is an award ticket (on LH 220 stock) you will be allowed in, but only when it's on LH 220 or LX 724 stock. Award flights no matter the program do book into the stock of the executing carrier normally, so it'd be LH 220 O Class (First Class Award), which will then give you acces.
If it were for example UA Full Fare codeshare you'd still be out of luck as that bnzli rules as you call it is very much alive and well :P
I wonder... was the new flight booked into O? Or were you extremly lucky and it was maybe even ticketed into F or A? Because the circumstances make it look like the agent didn't really realize it was an award ticket and may have rebooked you into a full fare class...

Last edited by Nick Art; Jun 18, 2018 at 1:52 am
Nick Art is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 4:02 am
  #66  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: AU
Programs: former Olympic Airways Gold (yeah - still proud of that!)
Posts: 14,391
Originally Posted by Nick Art
Congratulations! You are one lucky guy (or girl).

Since it is an award ticket (on LH 220 stock) you will be allowed in, but only when it's on LH 220 or LX 724 stock. Award flights no matter the program do book into the stock of the executing carrier normally, so it'd be LH 220 O Class (First Class Award), which will then give you acces.
If it were for example UA Full Fare codeshare you'd still be out of luck as that bnzli rules as you call it is very much alive and well :P
I wonder... was the new flight booked into O? Or were you extremly lucky and it was maybe even ticketed into F or A? Because the circumstances make it look like the agent didn't really realize it was an award ticket and may have rebooked you into a full fare class...
Anyone ticketed on an LH or LX flight number in F is entitled to use the First class lounge. The ticket stock doesn't matter. You could have an award issued by Avianca (Lifemiles) for a flight in LH F and you will have full access.

The exceptions have been codeshares, where a United flight number, but traveling on LX metal, was refused entry. As award tickets are almost never issued on codeshare flight numbers, it shouldn't be a problem.

Last edited by LHR/MEL/Europe FF; Jun 18, 2018 at 4:08 am
LHR/MEL/Europe FF is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 4:07 am
  #67  
Moderator: SAS
Hyatt Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,125
Originally Posted by LHR/MEL/Europe FF
Anyone ticketed on LH or LX F is entitled to use the First class lounge. The ticket stock doesn't matter. You could have an award issued by Avianca (Lifemiles) for a flight in LH F and you will have full access.

The exceptions have been codeshares, where a United flight number, but traveling on LX metal, was refused entry. As award tickets are almost never issued on codeshare flight numbers, it shouldn't be a problem.
Well yes... that's what I'm saying. If you buy a Avianca lifemiles first class award flight on LH the flight will be ticketed using LH 220 stock booking it into O... or is that not the case anymore? I mean ticket stock any flight number are connected?
But if you buy a full fare UA flight that is being flown by a Swiss AC but the ticket is being ticketed on UA stock you will not get any access to the LX FCL for example. Hence the ticket stock is the thing that matters.
So we're basically saying the same thing.
Nick Art is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 4:15 am
  #68  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: AU
Programs: former Olympic Airways Gold (yeah - still proud of that!)
Posts: 14,391
Originally Posted by Nick Art
Well yes... that's what I'm saying. If you buy a Avianca lifemiles first class award flight on LH the flight will be ticketed using LH 220 stock booking it into O... or is that not the case anymore?
But if you buy a full fare UA flight that is being flown by a Swiss AC but the ticket is being ticketed on UA stock you will not get any access to the LX FCL for example. Hence the ticket stock is the thing that matters.
So we're basically saying the same thing.
If I redeem through Lifemiles it will be issued on 134 stock (for Avianca). Only LH will issue their own awards/tickets on 220 stock.

The issue with lounge access was never the ticket stock, but rather the flight you had bought. If you bought a UA F flight on LX metal (ticketed as UAXXXX), then you were a United First passenger, not a LX F passenger. However, United could sell you a LX F flight, on their ticket stock (ie not a codeshare), but the price was likely to be higher.

The problem with the UA/LX flights was that the boarding passes would sometimes print only with the LX flight number. So a person might have been ticketed on UAXXXX but the boarding pass would show LX38 (or whatever). The lounge agents wised up to this and started asking to see the ticket so they could determine the actual flight number. If that underlying ticket showed UAXXXX then access was denied.
LHR/MEL/Europe FF is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 4:20 am
  #69  
Moderator: SAS
Hyatt Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,125
Originally Posted by LHR/MEL/Europe FF
If I redeem through Lifemiles it will be issued on 134 stock (for Avianca). Only LH will issue their own awards/tickets on 220 stock.

The issue with lounge access was never the ticket stock, but rather the flight you had bought. If you bought a UA F flight on LX metal (ticketed as UAXXXX), then you were a United First passenger, not a LX F passenger. However, United could sell you a LX F flight, on their ticket stock (ie not a codeshare), but the price was likely to be higher.

The problem with the UA/LX flights was that the boarding passes would sometimes print only with the LX flight number. So a person might have been ticketed on UAXXXX but the boarding pass would show LX38 (or whatever). The lounge agents wised up to this and started asking to see the ticket so they could determine the actual flight number. If that underlying ticket showed UAXXXX then access was denied.
Thanks for clearing this up. I always thought Flight number and ticket stock were connected.
Nick Art is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 2:57 pm
  #70  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 789
Originally Posted by Nick Art
Thanks for clearing this up. I always thought Flight number and ticket stock were connected.
Yes, it seems like this is a really complicated issue and even the F lounge staff had to have a really good look to give me an answer. As I said previously, I was at ZRH that day anyway, so I went from SEN lounge to F lounge where I explained the situation and asked them to confirm whether I have lounge access.
1) it seems that when a pax presents himself/herself at the reception, the boarding pass is scanned and it is the computer who decides whether you have access or not. so they programmed the system to check all the criteria and if there is any doubt then staff will intervene by looking up the booking
2) the first staff I encountered had no clue how to answer my question. The staff at the LX lounges rotate (2 hrs shifts at each lounge) so its not like there are dedicated F lounge receiption staff. Also to be noted is that the F lounge reception staff are standing the whole time they are there. Staff at the common entrance to the SEN/Business lounge are sitting but not at the F lounge. Anyway, this man had no idea so he called over his supervisor. She came from the SEN lounge and I explained her the situation, showed her my booking, she looked it up in her system, checked flight number and ticket number and still had to have a good think before answering me. I kept reminding her that its a partner award and because of the involuntary change, I got booked onto LX F. I wanted to make sure that detail would not deny my access. When I mentioned I wanted to be sure because UA codeshare pax had so many problems and it seemed to be so complicated with LX, she repeated the whole spiel of how with UA codeshares, its UA who earns the revenue etc.
3) before giving me the answer, she went to a back office to consult with one more colleague, (risk averse!) and finally came back to say that in my case, I would be allowed into the lounge. Yes, it took THREE employees before I got my answer. LX really needs to simplify the rules, it shouldn't be that difficult. I was there at 16:00, and the lounge seemed completely empty, so its not like overcrowding seems to be such a problem. By the time I was done, it was time for one of the employees to rotate and go to the SEN/Business lounge reception.
rosenkavalier is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 3:03 pm
  #71  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 789
Originally Posted by LHR/MEL/Europe FF
If I redeem through Lifemiles it will be issued on 134 stock (for Avianca). Only LH will issue their own awards/tickets on 220 stock.
Funny thing, my original ticket was on 202 stock, not 134. I looked it up, 134 is indeed AV Columbia, and 202 is pre-merger TACA El Salvador. So I guess they kept the 202 stock as well and issue awards on 202? Can someone clarify?
rosenkavalier is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 4:26 pm
  #72  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: AU
Programs: former Olympic Airways Gold (yeah - still proud of that!)
Posts: 14,391
Originally Posted by rosenkavalier
LX really needs to simplify the rules, it shouldn't be that difficult.
It actually is very simple!

If you are ticketed as an LX or LH F passenger, you have F lounge access. If you are are first class passenger of another airline, even if that airline is flying you on LX or LH metal, you don't have access.

I accept many people don't agree with that concept, but that's a separate issue.
LHR/MEL/Europe FF is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2018, 4:29 pm
  #73  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: AU
Programs: former Olympic Airways Gold (yeah - still proud of that!)
Posts: 14,391
Originally Posted by rosenkavalier
Funny thing, my original ticket was on 202 stock, not 134. I looked it up, 134 is indeed AV Columbia, and 202 is pre-merger TACA El Salvador. So I guess they kept the 202 stock as well and issue awards on 202? Can someone clarify?
As far as I can recall all my tickets have been issued as 134. But then maybe I wasn't paying too much attention. Either way it wouldn't have been a problem. But your new ticket you say is 220 (LH?).
LHR/MEL/Europe FF is offline  
Old Jun 19, 2018, 6:46 am
  #74  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 789
Originally Posted by LHR/MEL/Europe FF
As far as I can recall all my tickets have been issued as 134. But then maybe I wasn't paying too much attention. Either way it wouldn't have been a problem. But your new ticket you say is 220 (LH?).
yes, its 220.
rosenkavalier is offline  
Old Jun 19, 2018, 7:53 am
  #75  
Moderator: SAS
Hyatt Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,125
Originally Posted by rosenkavalier
yes, its 220.
Were you able to find out your booking class? If not you could do so by entering your reference number into either the Lufthansa or Swiss App.
Nick Art is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.