Dec 13, 2016, 11:12 pm
Last edit by: NWIFlyer
Routes to/from LGW*/LCY/STN are NOT affected. Only flights to/from LHR* are potentially affected. If you think you may be affected, post 2714 (click here) may be helpful.
*The LGW-JFK flight has seen a lot of cancellations for the current strike period.
Current strike period:
Next announced strike period:
Previous strike periods:
Routes affected:
As a possible indication, for the fifth strike period BA announced the following cancellations:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/27910044-post2131.html as well as flights to and from Doha on all affected days (17 - 20 February).
Mixed fleet routes are listed here, though note that other (non Mixed Fleet) flights from Heathrow are also being cancelled.
Note for context in terms of how many routes might actually be affected: there are about 4000 members of MF (of which ~2,700 are Unite members and therefore eligible to take industrial action) and 15,000 total cabin crew
Background Details from BA:
Strike 19th July-1st August
2nd August-16th August
Background Details from Unite:
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...ty-pay-levels/
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...refuses-talks/
Latest negotiating position:
Talks at ACAS in June appear to have failed, with a further two week strike commencing 1st July announced on 16th June.
Key upcoming dates:
Ballot results for industrial action:
*The LGW-JFK flight has seen a lot of cancellations for the current strike period.
Current strike period:
- None
Next announced strike period:
Previous strike periods:
- 25th December 2016 from 00:01 for 48 hours. (Strike action was suspended following ACAS discussions and revised offer.)
- 10th & 11th January 2017
- 19th January 2017 for 72 hours until 21st January
- 5th-7th & 9th-11th February 2017
- 17th-20th February 2017
- 22nd-25th February 2017
- 3rd-9th March 2017
- 16th-19th June 2017 (suspended pending further ACAS talks)
- 1st-16th July 2017
- 19th July-1st August 2017
- 2nd-15th August 2017
- 16th-30th August 2017
Routes affected:
As a possible indication, for the fifth strike period BA announced the following cancellations:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/27910044-post2131.html as well as flights to and from Doha on all affected days (17 - 20 February).
Mixed fleet routes are listed here, though note that other (non Mixed Fleet) flights from Heathrow are also being cancelled.
Note for context in terms of how many routes might actually be affected: there are about 4000 members of MF (of which ~2,700 are Unite members and therefore eligible to take industrial action) and 15,000 total cabin crew
Background Details from BA:
Strike 19th July-1st August
2nd August-16th August
Background Details from Unite:
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...ty-pay-levels/
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...refuses-talks/
Latest negotiating position:
Talks at ACAS in June appear to have failed, with a further two week strike commencing 1st July announced on 16th June.
Key upcoming dates:
- Latest negotiated position (@ 23rd Oct 2017) between BA & Unite to be balloted. Rumoured that the union is recommending acceptance.
Ballot results for industrial action:
- First ballot, November 2016: Yes 79.5%, No 20.5%
- Second ballot, December 2016: Yes 70%, No 30%
- Third ballot, March 2017: Yes 56%, No 44%, turnout 72%
BA 'Mixed Fleet' cabin crew dispute [agreement reached]
Jan 19, 2017, 6:41 am
#1756
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,663
Sadly for MF this strike was never going to work with the numbers involved. We all have sympathy with their cause but sadly this action has failed.
The crew report centre is so busy with crew today, both reporting and on standby, some are being sent home early due overcrowding. Crew on strike are tiny in number.
The crew report centre is so busy with crew today, both reporting and on standby, some are being sent home early due overcrowding. Crew on strike are tiny in number.
Jan 19, 2017, 1:24 pm
#1757
Join Date: Jan 2015
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 1,630
You may not be trying to bring down BA from within, but there are clearly other who have different motives (Why the hell don't the other fleets come out in sympathy). I can almost visualise certain contributors to this thread salivating over the prospect of further industrial action when the legacy crew are due for a pay rise (bet they won't be asking for industry average + 10%).
I suspect that support for industrial action is at best luke warm, and no doubt it won't be long before everyone returns to ACAS. From BA's point of view, I can understand how it might be difficult to negotiate with somebody if they won't tell you what they want. Unfortunately there is so much bad feeling out there towards BA, I don't think agreeing a pay rise is going to solve the underlying problems.
Jan 19, 2017, 1:34 pm
#1758
Join Date: Jan 2015
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 1,630
Jan 19, 2017, 1:43 pm
#1759
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
Posts: 34,339
Lite, the clear majority are behind you here and are very appreciative of the calm and professional way you have approached this thread. Even taking the time to answer what are trolling posts, you have represented not only yourself but the company well. 100% behind you and your colleagues.
Jan 19, 2017, 2:00 pm
#1760
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Dundee
Programs: BA Plastic. HH Diamond. Speedwell Bar Lifetime Platinum.
Posts: 1,426
Jan 19, 2017, 3:44 pm
#1762
Join Date: Oct 2008
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 887
I too support my MF colleagues in their efforts to improve their lot. I am however, struggling to see what the union believes they will achieve with further strikes. BA is bent on not bowing to this pressure and has gone to some lengthy measures to achieve that aim. Indeed MF can arguably be said to be a result of the determination of BA not to give in to industrial action.
The problem is not an isolated one as any pay deal awarded to MF will be the benchmark minimum percent that the next workgroup demands. So while MFare asking for more than 6p an hour more BA will view this in different terms.
No no one should be surprised at the loss of ST as this was and has long been a tactic that BA has used against strikers. Those who are unaware if this really should have done their homework. I'm not sure of the bonus situation maybe Lite can help, but these often have a no IA clause linked to them - again IF this is the case then those moaning about it are being disingenuous.
I hope you get a decent pay rise I really do, but I wonder who is winning with this IA, MF or Len McLusky who seems to be trying to, once again, make political hay and reestablish his credentials as a union hardliner.
The problem is not an isolated one as any pay deal awarded to MF will be the benchmark minimum percent that the next workgroup demands. So while MFare asking for more than 6p an hour more BA will view this in different terms.
No no one should be surprised at the loss of ST as this was and has long been a tactic that BA has used against strikers. Those who are unaware if this really should have done their homework. I'm not sure of the bonus situation maybe Lite can help, but these often have a no IA clause linked to them - again IF this is the case then those moaning about it are being disingenuous.
I hope you get a decent pay rise I really do, but I wonder who is winning with this IA, MF or Len McLusky who seems to be trying to, once again, make political hay and reestablish his credentials as a union hardliner.
Jan 19, 2017, 3:58 pm
#1763
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: JAX
Programs: Ex-BA/AA/CP/LY staff, BA Executive Club Blue, IHG Diamond, Marriott Silver, Chick-fil-A Red
Posts: 3,588
General McCluckCluck was the name he deservedly earned from me during the last BASSA fiasco.
No, but that was then and this is a different bargaining group, which doesn't affect what MF should be offered. Legacy fleets are being offered more this year (enough? don't know) but MF are not. Why? Unaffordable? No.
No, but that was then and this is a different bargaining group, which doesn't affect what MF should be offered. Legacy fleets are being offered more this year (enough? don't know) but MF are not. Why? Unaffordable? No.
Jan 19, 2017, 4:00 pm
#1764
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lsee...ature=youtu.be
With this in the public domain, at 28 seconds in 'us as Senior Cabin Crew Members, we have no right to fight for better terms and conditions and better pay'...
The dispute and resulting (current) action is about pay and pay alone, is it not?
With this in the public domain, at 28 seconds in 'us as Senior Cabin Crew Members, we have no right to fight for better terms and conditions and better pay'...
The dispute and resulting (current) action is about pay and pay alone, is it not?
Jan 19, 2017, 5:03 pm
#1765
Community Director
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Norwich, UK
Programs: A3*G, BA Gold, BD Gold (in memoriam), IHG Diamond Ambassador
Posts: 8,479
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lsee...ature=youtu.be
With this in the public domain, at 28 seconds in 'us as Senior Cabin Crew Members, we have no right to fight for better terms and conditions and better pay'...
The dispute and resulting (current) action is about pay and pay alone, is it not?
With this in the public domain, at 28 seconds in 'us as Senior Cabin Crew Members, we have no right to fight for better terms and conditions and better pay'...
The dispute and resulting (current) action is about pay and pay alone, is it not?
"This dispute is for both of us as customer service managers, this is about us having the right to bargain and at the moment we have no bargaining rights as Senior Cabin Crew members to fight for better Terms & Conditions and better pay."
Don't see how that is at all inconsistent with anything we've heard in the dispute. Pay and T&Cs are almost always inexorably linked.
Jan 19, 2017, 5:30 pm
#1766
Join Date: May 2014
Location: DMV
Posts: 2,092
Isn't it just a bit dishonest to hold up placards claiming they make 12k when in reality nobody working as BA cabin crew actually makes that. Not that the real salaries are fantastic but it's still propaganda. Perhaps because the real salaries are not really lower than what a lot of regular people in Britain make?
Jan 19, 2017, 10:16 pm
#1767
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Mexico City
Programs: Life Miles, Miles and more
Posts: 518
Isn't it just a bit dishonest to hold up placards claiming they make 12k when in reality nobody working as BA cabin crew actually makes that. Not that the real salaries are fantastic but it's still propaganda. Perhaps because the real salaries are not really lower than what a lot of regular people in Britain make?
Maybe those others on poor wages should consider whether they might have been better off with a union? I never get this bashing of people on very poor wages for trying to get better wages, bizarre. Almost always from people doing alright too. Takes all sorts I guess.
Jan 19, 2017, 10:41 pm
#1768
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Feb 2010
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold; Flying Blue Life Platinum; LH Sen.; Hilton Diamond; Kemal Kebabs Prized Customer
Posts: 63,846
Welcome to Flyertalk and welcome to the BA forum Angelo_oscuro, thank you for posting here and please make yourself at home here. My take is that it is largely about pay, but also to some extent about working conditions: in the case of flying the two are closely linked - if a location has a 2 night turnaround rather than 1 night then it is easier to work and the pay goes up. My perception is that a settlement on the pay issue would probably bring the industrial action to a swift end.
Jan 19, 2017, 11:17 pm
#1769
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: KSA
Programs: BA LTG, UA Gold, EK Silver, Hilton LT Diamond, Marriott LT Titanium, IHG Plat
Posts: 1,242
So what if they're not lower than what a lot of people in Britain make? Those wages are still a disgrace, basically impossible to live on in London, and what on earth is wrong with people using their legal rights to try and improve their working conditions?
Maybe those others on poor wages should consider whether they might have been better off with a union? I never get this bashing of people on very poor wages for trying to get better wages, bizarre. Almost always from people doing alright too. Takes all sorts I guess.
Maybe those others on poor wages should consider whether they might have been better off with a union? I never get this bashing of people on very poor wages for trying to get better wages, bizarre. Almost always from people doing alright too. Takes all sorts I guess.
A workforce doesn't magically appear and the market sorts out the wages and costs and businesses operate accordingly. As we have seen with the Dutch PM recently who is complaining that a Dutch painter on a building site is becoming a rarity as there is plenty of cheap Foreign labor taking his place resulting in lower taxes etc etc. The way things are at the moment there are plenty of people willing to work in less than stellar conditions for the pay that is on offer affecting everyone's way of life. No good complaining at BA but it is pretty obvious from votes around the world that people are finding the right way to find a solution to this problem.
Last edited by moral_low_ground; Jan 19, 2017 at 11:23 pm
Jan 19, 2017, 11:25 pm
#1770
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: somewhere north of stateside...
Posts: 4,153
Why do MF not strike on some downroute destinations? This would strand aircraft, as they would not have crew to operate the service back to LHR and disrupt the company's operations significantly more.
Realise that the crew would then have to get back to the UK, but perhaps targeted action where it would hurt the company back, with UNITE using union funds to fly the crew back commercially, would be a smart tactic.
Perhaps there are reasons that this is not possible/advisable, but I'm curious if this would be a good tactic.
Realise that the crew would then have to get back to the UK, but perhaps targeted action where it would hurt the company back, with UNITE using union funds to fly the crew back commercially, would be a smart tactic.
Perhaps there are reasons that this is not possible/advisable, but I'm curious if this would be a good tactic.