How many times have you been upgraded on AF/KL ?
May 4, 2018, 12:24 pm
#736
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: DUS, BRU, POA
Programs: Skyteam E+ (FB PfL), Latam Black, LH MM, Iberia plus, HH: Diamond, Marriott Bonvoy: Plat
Posts: 1,124
May 4, 2018, 2:01 pm
#737
Join Date: Feb 2017
Programs: flying blue
Posts: 75
The chance of getting free upgrade from KLM is extremely small. Since a month ago, KLM started offering discounted paid upgrade on each flight as soon as there are still seats available, the more the seats available in business class, the lower is the price. In the past they only offer discounted upgrade if economy is over booked, but now they do it on all the flights even if economy is not full and that offer applies to all kinds of economy class tickets. I flew couple of time KLM business class in the past 2 years and business class was ALWAYS FULL. So, frequent flyers can forget about free upgrade. For my work I usually fly within EU and I’m fine with economy comfort ( free for platinum). I fly 2 times a year AMS-HKG private and I make sure that I book early bird business class offer, usually around 1800 euro. Good deal! Free upgrade from KLM is gonna be history unfortunately!
May 4, 2018, 2:09 pm
#738
Join Date: Feb 2017
Programs: flying blue
Posts: 75
I'm also under the impression that KL became much better at managing their yield on medium-haul recently but from my observations, it seems that the rule of upgrading the elites when Y is full is well respected on KL. The only thing I'm not sure is what order of priority is given among the Platinums: do they discriminate on fare or how long they've been plat for example?
If anyone can get an outstation gate agent to talk about the instructions they have...
If anyone can get an outstation gate agent to talk about the instructions they have...
May 4, 2018, 2:31 pm
#740
Join Date: May 2012
Location: AMS
Programs: BA KL LH Hilton Marriott
Posts: 1,233
I'm also under the impression that KL became much better at managing their yield on medium-haul recently but from my observations, it seems that the rule of upgrading the elites when Y is full is well respected on KL. The only thing I'm not sure is what order of priority is given among the Platinums: do they discriminate on fare or how long they've been plat for example?
If anyone can get an outstation gate agent to talk about the instructions they have...
If anyone can get an outstation gate agent to talk about the instructions they have...
May 4, 2018, 2:38 pm
#741
Join Date: May 2012
Location: AMS
Programs: BA KL LH Hilton Marriott
Posts: 1,233
The chance of getting free upgrade from KLM is extremely small. Since a month ago, KLM started offering discounted paid upgrade on each flight as soon as there are still seats available, the more the seats available in business class, the lower is the price. In the past they only offer discounted upgrade if economy is over booked, but now they do it on all the flights even if economy is not full and that offer applies to all kinds of economy class tickets. I flew couple of time KLM business class in the past 2 years and business class was ALWAYS FULL. So, frequent flyers can forget about free upgrade. For my work I usually fly within EU and I’m fine with economy comfort ( free for platinum). I fly 2 times a year AMS-HKG private and I make sure that I book early bird business class offer, usually around 1800 euro. Good deal! Free upgrade from KLM is gonna be history unfortunately!
Like you I also snatch the good long haul Business deals, and like you I am happy with my free Exit Row seats within Europe (I prefer these over Economy Comfort as I am not usually in a rush to disembark and the space is better). But within Europe I definitely often get lucky with upgrades to Business.
May 4, 2018, 3:56 pm
#742
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 14,352
A colleague and I were once waiting in line behind a pax who turned out to be a sportsman of some distinction. I had never heard of the guy, but the KL agent was apparently a devotee of that particular sport. As soon as he had left, she called the gate and asked the agent to make sure this pax got an upgrade, mentioning that she was a great fan, bla bla bla. While she was arranging this important matter she kept the two of us waiting. As we were conversing in Danish, it probably never occurred to her that I understood every word she was saying in Dutch.
I have been the beneficiary of such upgrades myself too. I once arrived in the lounge with a girlfriend (no status) who was afraid of flying, and it showed. The lounge dragon asked what was wrong, and expressed her sympathy. A few minutes later she came over with two J class boarding cards. On the return flight a week or so later we were miraculously upgraded as well. These were longhaul flights.
So . . . strings can be pulled, and stuff happens.
Johan
May 4, 2018, 4:08 pm
#743
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 14,352
On shorthaul flights, I rarely see a full J cabin, despite the movable divider. On my regular commute the cabin is mostly not even half full. Last week there were only three of us in the minimum two rows.
It may well be that longhaul J load factors have increased over the years, but I do see empty seats. Usually not many, but business class is definitely not ALWAYS FULL.
Johan
May 5, 2018, 1:00 am
#744
Join Date: Feb 2017
Programs: flying blue
Posts: 75
A couple of full flights doesn't prove much, and certainly not that business class is ALWAYS FULL.
On shorthaul flights, I rarely see a full J cabin, despite the movable divider. On my regular commute the cabin is mostly not even half full. Last week there were only three of us in the minimum two rows.
It may well be that longhaul J load factors have increased over the years, but I do see empty seats. Usually not many, but business class is definitely not ALWAYS FULL.
Johan
On shorthaul flights, I rarely see a full J cabin, despite the movable divider. On my regular commute the cabin is mostly not even half full. Last week there were only three of us in the minimum two rows.
It may well be that longhaul J load factors have increased over the years, but I do see empty seats. Usually not many, but business class is definitely not ALWAYS FULL.
Johan
Last edited by Sharon Chan; May 5, 2018 at 2:21 am
May 5, 2018, 2:11 am
#745
Join Date: Feb 2017
Programs: flying blue
Posts: 75
This is (partly) true for long haul (it has been much more than a month). But for short haul it's a different story. Nobody bites at the upgrade offers within Europe because the price is high and the product does not really justify it. What price would you pay for a gin and tonic and an upgraded sandwich? Potentially a little more space, but if you are in an Exit Row and lucky enough to have an empty middle seat then there is more space than in Europe Business.
Like you I also snatch the good long haul Business deals, and like you I am happy with my free Exit Row seats within Europe (I prefer these over Economy Comfort as I am not usually in a rush to disembark and the space is better). But within Europe I definitely often get lucky with upgrades to Business.
Like you I also snatch the good long haul Business deals, and like you I am happy with my free Exit Row seats within Europe (I prefer these over Economy Comfort as I am not usually in a rush to disembark and the space is better). But within Europe I definitely often get lucky with upgrades to Business.
Last edited by Sharon Chan; May 5, 2018 at 2:20 am
May 5, 2018, 2:19 am
#746
Join Date: Feb 2017
Programs: flying blue
Posts: 75
Yet they sometimes upgrade pax at their discretion for reasons of their own.
A colleague and I were once waiting in line behind a pax who turned out to be a sportsman of some distinction. I had never heard of the guy, but the KL agent was apparently a devotee of that particular sport. As soon as he had left, she called the gate and asked the agent to make sure this pax got an upgrade, mentioning that she was a great fan, bla bla bla. While she was arranging this important matter she kept the two of us waiting. As we were conversing in Danish, it probably never occurred to her that I understood every word she was saying in Dutch.
I have been the beneficiary of such upgrades myself too. I once arrived in the lounge with a girlfriend (no status) who was afraid of flying, and it showed. The lounge dragon asked what was wrong, and expressed her sympathy. A few minutes later she came over with two J class boarding cards. On the return flight a week or so later we were miraculously upgraded as well. These were longhaul flights.
So . . . strings can be pulled, and stuff happens.
Johan
A colleague and I were once waiting in line behind a pax who turned out to be a sportsman of some distinction. I had never heard of the guy, but the KL agent was apparently a devotee of that particular sport. As soon as he had left, she called the gate and asked the agent to make sure this pax got an upgrade, mentioning that she was a great fan, bla bla bla. While she was arranging this important matter she kept the two of us waiting. As we were conversing in Danish, it probably never occurred to her that I understood every word she was saying in Dutch.
I have been the beneficiary of such upgrades myself too. I once arrived in the lounge with a girlfriend (no status) who was afraid of flying, and it showed. The lounge dragon asked what was wrong, and expressed her sympathy. A few minutes later she came over with two J class boarding cards. On the return flight a week or so later we were miraculously upgraded as well. These were longhaul flights.
So . . . strings can be pulled, and stuff happens.
Johan
Last edited by Sharon Chan; May 5, 2018 at 2:25 am
May 5, 2018, 3:00 am
#747
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,935
May 5, 2018, 4:16 am
#748
Moderator: Aegean Miles+Bonus
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: AMS / ATH
Programs: AFKL Plat, A3 Gold
Posts: 7,342
Using such upgrade to KLM business one gets all those things. I very much agree that the in the air experience is only slightly improved (though being able to guaranteed stow your hand luggage & to be the first of the plane is nice!), but the services on the ground should definitely be counted. When you have a long time to spend at the airport the lounge access can be very useful for example.
The sad part is that this doesn't apply much to frequent flyers, as they get many of those services for free anyway. Therefore you could even say that such upgrade is actually more valueable to regular pax, than to frequent flyers!
May 5, 2018, 1:11 pm
#749
Join Date: Feb 2017
Programs: flying blue
Posts: 75
Flying C is more than just that though. People flying Easyjet are happy to spend 20 euro for priority boarding and a better seat, as well as 20+ euro for lounge access through Priority Pass. Which doesn't even come with priority security.
Using such upgrade to KLM business one gets all those things. I very much agree that the in the air experience is only slightly improved (though being able to guaranteed stow your hand luggage & to be the first of the plane is nice!), but the services on the ground should definitely be counted. When you have a long time to spend at the airport the lounge access can be very useful for example.
The sad part is that this doesn't apply much to frequent flyers, as they get many of those services for free anyway. Therefore you could even say that such upgrade is actually more valueable to regular pax, than to frequent flyers!
Using such upgrade to KLM business one gets all those things. I very much agree that the in the air experience is only slightly improved (though being able to guaranteed stow your hand luggage & to be the first of the plane is nice!), but the services on the ground should definitely be counted. When you have a long time to spend at the airport the lounge access can be very useful for example.
The sad part is that this doesn't apply much to frequent flyers, as they get many of those services for free anyway. Therefore you could even say that such upgrade is actually more valueable to regular pax, than to frequent flyers!
May 5, 2018, 4:06 pm
#750
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: Flying Blue Plat, Air Europa Silver, IHG Plat, Accor Plat
Posts: 1,011
Of course exceptions can happen, but ground agents do have guidelines to follow. Same like on board, pursers can still give free upgrade to pax at certain circumstances (Few years ago, I was upgraded once on AMS-HKG to C due to drunk pax next to me). But in general, ground agents do follow the procedures.
Obviously, for staff to be able to bend the rules they need to have a justifiable reason. "I like the passenger" is not enough.