MillennialMiles

I thought if you book the "Flexible J" reward instead of "Lowest J" reward you would obtain access to the SS as those would be booked into the J, C, D, Z, P bucket instead of award I bucket. Guess we will find out once the SS opens again in 2021.

yvr76

So given that you can book all fare types now, do they book into the respective classes as well? Or is it Standard X, Flex X, Latitude X, and then Business Lowest I, and then there is an exception for Flexible J that books into regular buckets?

gospelle

My Flexible Business class reward fare for YVR-SYD is fare code "I". Not sure where this idea of flex reward access to Signature Suites Lounge started, but I think it's not supported by any facts.

canadiancow

If I-space is available, lowest and flexible both book into it. If only Z is available, both will book into Z. It's the fare basis code that determines what you're entitled to.

The idea came from Mark Nasr making an obviously incorrect comment at the press event, which was then picked up by bloggers.
These bloggers generally don't know nearly enough about AC to question things like this.
But due to lack of sufficient details directly from AC, these bloggers became the primary source of information for everything, and here we are with this unsubstantiated rumor.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/aeropl...rd-redemption/

That was clearly written by someone who has zero knowledge of AC's branded fares. Flex and Business Flexible are not the same thing.

https://viewfromthewing.com/air-cana...oplan-program/

VFTW was a bit better here, but regardless of whether Business Flexible includes access, there is simply no way that Latitude will, so I don't particularly trust these statements at all, until AC actually mentions something.

The current access rules don't make sense with redemptions, because you can get business lowest in J, and business flexible in I. They'd need to rewrite the rules to discuss fare basis, rather than fare class, and change the actual entry terminals to follow that pattern (which would also eliminate IRROPS rebookings of I/R from gaining entry).

YOWgary

​​​​​​I know as many as eight people anywhere in the world, who would feel confident dismissing a public announcement about the new Aeroplan from Air Canada's VP of Loyalty as "obviously incorrect", and they're all on FT.

I think you're right about the Latitude part at least, but then again I only count myself among the "that doesn't sound right, let's follow up on that" crowd.

canadiancow

You're a blogger. Why not email him and ask?

And let's be clear. This was not a "public announcement". This was a remark he made to a bunch of press at a private event. People make incorrect remarks all the time. But when the press have no idea what they're talking about, it never occurs to them that it might be incorrect. There was a 2 (?) week embargo. They had weeks to follow up with any questions, but as far as I know, none of them thought it sounded even remotely implausible.

And on the Latitude front, then what about PY Flexible? It doesn't make sense that flexible Y would get in but not flexible PY. Not that either of those situations makes any sense given the marketing around the SS.

YOWgary

Honestly? Covering that detail just plain hasn't been high on my priority list, it's a pretty niche outcome that only a fraction of AC passengers even know they should be considering. Heck, I'd be curious to know what percentage of actually-eligible paid-J passengers actually use the Suite.


It was an event whose sole purpose was to publicize the details of the new Aeroplan program. I agree that the embargo left ample time to follow up that detail, but my point is that *knowing* that that's a detail that requires follow-up assumes that your average journalist or blogger has the same depth of detailed Aeroplan knowledge that really only exists among a few dozen fanatics here on FT, a few of whom probably know the program in deeper detail than Mark Nasr does.

More to the point, look how many hyper-fanatics here on FT didn't just automatically dismiss this as impossible.

I'm just saying that in this case, "it should have been obvious to anyone that this was wrong" might be expecting too much.

canadiancow

I do not dismiss "business flexible" as being impossible. I think it's quite possible. There's just no documentation on it.

So talking just about Latitude, if we replace "anyone" with "anyone who understands what the Signature Suite is and what Latitude is", I stand by it.

I'll also take a step back, and say it might have just been something poorly worded on Mark's part. I wasn't there. I don't have a quote.

But it could have been "Latitude bookings have no change fees. Same for business flexible. Oh and that gets you into the Signature Suite too." A little ambiguous, but would easily explain the reporting on it.

yvr76

If reward bookings are to act like revenue with the exception of accumulation it would make sense that all business reward fares have access, or none of them if you're still going to restrict to revenue/cash only (my preference is the latter). But to allow just flexible business rewards is really confusing.

Merlin666

I had a look at the new Flight Reward Chart and the level of devaluation is difficult to assess as the flights are now all distance based one way. I redeemed two mini RTWs in First for 120k and more recent two Business roundtrips to Europe for 110k, and on first glance it looks like these kinds of trips now require substantially more points. Has anyone actually calculated levels of devaluation for some common trip scenarios?

YOWgary

Yes, several of us have. Is there any particular math you're trying to get to, or are you just looking to tell yourself How Bad Things Have Gotten? Honestly, whether the new program represents a huge improvement or a total disaster *really* depends on where you're trying to fly and what status you hold. In my personal view, the new program is much worse for SEs, but massively better for 75Ks, with everyone else falling in between.

YYZ-LHR got a lot worse if you're an SE, while YVR-TYO got a lot better for everyone. YHZ-YYZ-YVR-SYD has gone way up, while TLV-IST has cut almost in half.

I'm not sure what you're referring to when you talk about 90K business round-trips to Europe in the context of a devaluation. The previous cost of NA-Europe in J was a fixed 110K round-trip, so are you telling us you've booked cheaper trips since the changeover?

tcook052

Seen & noted in an email today from Aeroplan:

Starting today, Aeroplan Members making new eligible international round-trip bookings until and including January 31, 2021 with Air Canada, will receive complimentary Manulife COVID-19 Emergency Medical and Quarantine Insurance, underwritten by The Manufacturers Life Insurance Company (Manulife). Travel must be completed by April 12, 2021.

YOWgary

Mark Nasr reached out to me today and confirmed that "Business Flexible and First Flexible awards will, indeed, have Signature Suite access if the passenger is departing on AC in Business class from YYZ or YVR. In the rewards world, it has nothing to do with the booking code - it's all in the branded fare selection".

He also noted that they're not making any mention of this on the booking engine because the Suites are currently closed.

canadiancow

Good to hear. Definitely not Latitude though

YOWgary

...aren't you glad a diligent blogger followed up on that?