Cubiscus

I am in economy , although if I went from international business class to premium rouge I'd be expecting some serious compensation.

I'd have gone with Westjet if I'd known there was a serious chance of the route being Rouge. Hopefully the route stays mainline until at least May.

After Burner

I would bet that you're safe this winter. If it does get rouged, just get a refund and buy Westjet tickets.

winnipegrev

It'll almost certainly stay mainline as they can't be rotating in/out Rouge 763s easily and YYC-OGG-YYC alone each day is horrible utilization. The plane comes in from YYZ/LHR/NRT for the OGG flight - none of which I imagine will be going Rouge.

WestJet puts Thomas Cook 757s YYC-OGG which are arguably worse than Rouge 763s. 17" width, 30-31" pitch narrowbody.

I agree I'd personally be more concerned about going from a pod to PR than from AC Y to Rouge Y.

Cubiscus

Problem with that is the price of the flights will have likely shot up since I brought in a sale (less than $1000 return for 2 of us).

Current WS price is nearly $1k each.

After Burner

Understood. I never book these flights more than a day or two in advance so I sometimes forget that other people actually plan ahead!

WildcatYXU

Technically he sat in Rouge Plus. While the seat is the same as Premium rouge, the price isn't.

Calliopeflyer

Yup, thanks for clarification.

peano

He said he sat in row 1. Is that not Premium rouge?

YEGTigger

Not on that route. YYZ/YUL-PUJ is served in an all-Y config. The first rows have the extra pitch but not a blocked middle seat or meal service. They are Rouge Plus. That's why the poster made the comment about the wine and pizza that they bought.

FlyerJ

I resemble that remark!

I no longer fly Rouge, and I now fly AC far less because Rouge has broken my loyalty.

But, yes, Rouge still angers me, and I still comment on it ... here, at work, at parties, and anywhere else that travel conversations come up. Yes, I'm bitter.

Is it illogical? Maybe. Probably, in fact!

But it's entirely genuine. So why??

1. AC has been my chosen airline for my entire life as a business traveller (minus a couple of years when my then employer entered into an agreement with CP). I was fiercely loyal to them year after year. Then, in a show of reciprocal loyalty, they yanked their service to me and replaced it with one in which I could no longer even fit in the seats. I've since moved my business, but I'm still angry.

2. When I contacted them about the "I no longer fit in your plane" issue, they provided a blunt response that made me feel even less valued -- essentially: tough, if you're tall and want to fit, pay up extra for Plus or Premium, or just wedge yourself in and suffer. No empathy attempted. No hint of even giving a rat's rear end. Just a demand of either shut up or give over your credit card number. I've since moved my business, but I'm still angry.

3. They caused me physical pain. No drama, no exaggeration, no hyperbole. My chosen carrier who I remained loyal to and promoted for years turned around and put me in seats that caused discomfort and pain. And they've made it clear that they just don't care. I've moved my business, but I'm still angry.

4. They Rouged my already-booked flights, and offered no concessions or compensation until public outcry and media pressure forced them to oh-so-generously offer refunds. But when I was Rouged, there was no feasible alternative on one flight, and another cost me even more $ out of pocket to switch. Thanks for your generosity and care for your valued customers, Rouge. I've since moved my business, but the extra money I had to fork out has yet to return to my bank account. (Obviously, it won't.). I'm still angry.

5. Air Canada has created the worst airline in North America. In my opinion, it's the thin edge of the wedge. They think we'll all just roll over and accept this garbage product. And IMO they're hoping we do. If we all just shrug our shoulders and quietly accept it, watch out. Kiss your knee space goodbye, and find a good chiropractor. I'm angry.

6. I sincerely question the safety of Rouge. When a portion of your passengers can't even sit straight, when they are wedged into seats with impossibly small legroom, I truly question the ability to evacuate an aircraft quickly and effectively. Sure, Rouge's seating is entirely legal and meets required safety standards. But which A319 do you think is safer? One with 120 seats, where seats are configured such that passengers can get in and out of their rows with relative ease? Or one with an additional 22 people crammed on board (but has the same number of doors)? That concerns me.

7. I've saved up Aeroplan points to take my family on trips. Heck, I've even changed banks so I could get more of those points to take my family on trips. Since I can't and won't fly on a Rouge 319, and those 319s are the new norm for many of those family destinations, that's all been devalued significantly. That makes me angry.

8. I believe that some at AC are being less than honest in their continued push to make people accept Rouge. They've gone from putting listick on the pig to, I believe, deceptive marketing ... with their claims of "more comfort" and creative photography showing passengers with gobs of legroom. They're making a bottom-of-the-barrel carrier sized for midgets out to be Virgin Atlantic. I doubt it's illegal, but I do find it to be deceptive and a bit sleazy. That makes me angry.

Without my longstanding relationship with Air Canada, no, I probably wouldn't care anywhere near as much about the above. I've never flown Quantas or AF or Aeroflot. If they were to Rouge themselves, it would be trivial to me. If Hyatt were to cut their room sizes in half and replace their mattresses with concrete slabs, I wouldn't be angry. Because I don't stay at Hyatt. But in the case of Rouge, I was fired as a customer by my airline after they caused me discomfort, cost me money, and disrupted my plans. And it still makes me mad.

No, I no longer fly Rouge -- at least not the 319s. And that's eliminated my loyalty to AC and Aeroplan. But I absolutely remain engaged in the debate about Rouge. And to your point, yes, I am bitter. It's been an awful year of travelling thanks to Rouge...

Calliopeflyer

Yes! Especially this last third of your post.

PointWeasel

I have managed to avoid being rouged to date, however, in my post-Christmas planning I came across HUX as a possible option for New Years.

Is AC 1610 actually rougeified? I thought the rougees were AC18XX.

Any insight? Has someone on FT actually flown this ex-YYZ route?

Frequentlander

These two points describe my experience with ACr precisely - and yes....It made me angry too. I'll fly ACr for the first time on Dec 21st YVR-HNL and on the 28th HNL-YVR......for the last time...EVER. Already looking at WS or AS for Hawaii next year. It will NOT be rouge.

ramsfan

I paid 40,000 points so not a business class fare. Maybe I could pick premium seat because I am SE. Anyway if you can fly row1 (which I did both trips) its fine. Certainly better or about the same as other discount airlines in Europe ( Wizz, Ryan, Monarch, and several others) and Asia ( Air Asia, Tiger) I have flown on relatively short flights.

So if you can sit in premium its ok. I do not have experience in row 21 and probably never will.

If my advice is only useful to those who can book premium, that's still useful.

winnipegrev

What part about 35" 17.5" wide Rouge Plus seats that as an SE you get for free you feel will be improved upon by taking WS?