What I mean is that with X, whenever you make a date change, the sector availability may not be there due to married segments logic. With O, if no space within 24 hours, I can make the stay just over 24 hours to get around the problem. Even ignoring married sector logic, it is certainly possible that individual sectors may not have D class on date I need. (Say IPC scl bog) .Ticket the scl as O allow more flexibility in date change.

​​​​​
It is especially bad on QR. One time, CX had to call QR to request the space (luckily, QR gave us the space). However, it makes the date change process more complicated.

I am aware that this has been discussed before but I would disagree that in those discussions "the consensus is that a ticket reissue is not supposed to trigger the $125 reroute fee". My impression of the discussion here and elsewhere is that a change from a transit to a stopover requires a reissue, which results in the $125 fee ,unless the agent or station is doesn't know they are supposed to charge the fee or is just se happy to have the reissue completed they forget or don't want to deal with it.

Based upon my experience and the previous discussions, I usually try to issue with all my ticketed points as stopovers (even ones where I am just transmitting) to provide greater flexibility and avoid reissues. If the cost of issuing as a stopover is much much greater that a transit I will on occasion book as a transit. I understand that this can result in a greater overall cost but it is one I am willing to take to avoid having to deal with an inexperienced agent or station trying to do a reissue.

It applies to most countries :).

There are generally higer monetary levels of +++ when a 'o' is involved because additional components are payable - rarely do any 'drop off'.

So if booked upfront as 'o's then with date/time changes the following often happens:

"x" to o - since booked as o originally, +++ is already correct. Often the agent will simply make the change as a re-validation.

o to "x" - easier for for agent to simply re-validate and not bother calculating refund of +++.

(Of course, if there's a UK 'o' in there, the APD can be rather significant and a refund may be desirable)

We're conflating separate issues. First issue: does the fact that a ticket is reissued mean the $125 fee is due? Second issue: Does a change from X to O (or O to X) fall within the meaning of "ticketed points change" and hence trigger the $125 fee? On the first issue, my recollection of the discussion is that if a reissue is being done for a simple change, let's say the airline code is changed on the exact same flight already ticketed, then the $125 fee is not supposed to be triggered. Some agents and perhaps some airlines interpret the rules differently and charge $125 but others do not.

This assumes that a revalidation is possible and reasonable. Some airlines (such as AA) never revalidate (possibly because they use Sabre which I've heard does not support revalidation). Some travel agents tell me that they are prohibited from revalidating an RTW fare, even after travel has started. Even when revalidation is possible, it may not be wise on an RTW because of the mix of airline systems. I'm told that if an Amadeus airline revalidates, the Sabre airlines may not see it and hence would see the ticket as not matching the reservation and could cancel space.

First issue -
The fare rule says 125USD is due if the ticket is ever re-issued. It does not give an exception for a re-issue that does not involve a re-routing. It only says that revalidation is permitted (without charge). However, in practice, we know that airlines frequently waive the 125USD fee when the re-issue does not involve a re-routing, because it should have been a revalidation instead of a re-issue, but revalidation does not always work due to system incompatabilities. Travel agents are however not able to waive it unless the plating carrier specifically tells them that a waiver can be given.

Second issue -
I agree that the term "CHANGES TO TICKETED POINTS" is vague and could have been better worded, but one must look at this entire section (context), not just a specific sentence. Revalidation is only possible when everything in the routing (including O/X) remains the same. If O/X needs to be changed, a revalidation cannot be done, and a re-issue is required, so there is no basis to waive the 125USD fee. Some agents may have (mistakenly) waived it, but this would not fall in line with the spirit of the rule. In fact, the first time "CHANGES TO TICKETED POINTS" appears, it is directly below "REROUTING PRIOR TO DEPARTURE." Again I agree that this is not very well structured, but I think it is clear that in this context "CHANGES TO TICKETED POINTS" means "REROUTING" (including any O/X change), or else there should be a second sentence that covers "REROUTING" without "CHANGES TO TICKETED POINTS."

System issue -
I believe in this day and age a revalidation across Sabre and Amadeus is very likely to be successful. At least, the chance that something would go wrong is much smaller than, say, 10 years ago (and when CX and JL were still using their in-house CRS). At least I have never seen a Sabre revalidation that didn't get carry over the Amadeus in the past few years, although I am not sure about vice versa. However, occasioanlly it is still possible that something might go wrong, and the best way to make sure nothing goes wrong is to always reissue.

I'm not sure how long I've been using xONEx and xCIRxx products, maybe 12-15 years? It's always been the case that changes to date, time, carrier are permitted without incurring the $125 fee, which has only been charged when the route is changed. Changing the carrier requires a reissue, I believe. Likewise, if one tickets a flight in L on a DONEx, and later D opens up or one switches to a flight that has D, the $125 fee has never been charged even though a change to booking code requires a reissue. The "AFTER DEPARTURE CHARGE USD 125.00 FOR NO-SHOW/REISSUE" wording can be read in context to mean reissue after no-show. People who know more than I do have explained that "CHANGES ARE PERMITTED PROVIDED TICKETED POINTS REMAIN THE SAME" means that it is not required to charge the $125 fee for a reissue if ticketed points remain the same, especially since elsewhere it says that changes are permitted to the ticketed points with a $125 fee.

General IATA rule is that a carrier can revalidate the ticket with a change to carrier, but a TA would have to reissue to change the carrier. Change to booking code can be done with a revalidation in both cases. But only if the taxes are unchanged of course.

.....

I guess AA's policy is to reissue for any and all changes - I was surprised with this since my previous xONEx experiences were with CX and QF where basic date/time changes were revalidations.


My first xONEx was actually with CX ex CMB and the 'ticket' was 5 books of 4 coupons (oh those were the days :) ). A schedule change mid travel* required a re-route half way through and they send me a new set of coupons (only those flights remaining). Other than that, all changes simply showed up online.


* Travel was taken over 12 months with lengthy mid point breaks.

I think we all agree that in most cases airlines do not charge the 125USD fee when they re-issue without re-routing. The line "CHANGES ARE PERMITTED PROVIDED TICKETED POINTS REMAIN THE SAME" is under the "revalidation" paragraph and beneath "rebooking," not under the "re-issue" paragraph. Revalidation is certainly free. My point is that a free re-issue without re-routing is already somewhat in the grey area per fare rule (and hence TAs may not be able to do it), and one shouldn't use this leeway due to technical difficulties to further argue that a change in X/O should be free because "TICKETED POINTS REMAIN THE SAME."

"AFTER DEPARTURE CHARGE USD 125.00 FOR NO-SHOW/REISSUE" means 125USD is charged if at least one of the two following occurs: No-show or re-issue. In this context, it says clearly below that "NO SHOW REQUIRES REBOOKING AT A CHARGE OF USD125.00" because it is possible to not re-issue the ticket and put you on the next flight, but 125USD still needs to be charged. This is certainly an OR not an AND.

The RJ RTW specialist told me that any change to carrier or booking code required a reissue.

Does anyone here have any experience with quick turns at KHI?

Would still be interested in thoughts/advice regarding a scenario I described earlier in post 2590