eponymous_coward

Some discussion by FrequentMiler:

http://frequentmiler.boardingarea.co...esults-are-in/

http://frequentmiler.boardingarea.co...middle-finger/

He seems to be coming to the conclusion that for a lot of people, there is additional value in the redemptions, and the places that get hurt are more on the margins.

Of course, FlyerTalkers are experts on arbitraging those margins, so naturally we're complaining loudly.

iahphx

Yeah, while most of us are hurt by the new rules, it probably pleases most "typical" Honors members. Just like how Southwest's transition to a revenue-based program played out. Let's face, it you're Joe Salesman who's earned some points and wants to use them for his annual vacation, it could be incredibly frustrating to use your points in the old system. If you had any clue as to what your points "were worth," the majority of Hilton hotels were significantly overpriced to redeem for. Now, the system is much "fairer." It's not good for people like me -- who just stayed elsewhere when I couldn't get "a deal" at Hilton -- but it seems good for the more-occasional-less-sophisticated-and-less-deal-seeking traveller.

iahphx

Be careful looking at the tripadvisor hotel availablity: in their zeal to monetize, sometimes hotels go missing from their lists. I just had a Hilton in Helsinki disappear (even though it was "ranked" the number six hotel in town). If not for Hotel Hustle, I wouldn't have found it.

The watchword is double-check on a few sources if you want to comparison shop.

iahphx

So I guess the thing to do now is periodically check your future-date Honors away stays and rebook if the prices go down (kind of like what you should be doing with Southwest airline award bookings)? Would a promoted nationwide or regional sale likely reduce the award prices of many Honors hotels, or would that not be a rate that would impact the points rate?

I am getting weird results as a result of this move. Like in a lot of hotels, having 2 people in the room makes the award more expensive than 1 person.

Happy

The Hilton in Helsinki proper is at the "Strand" and is not the most convenient location especially if you are relying on public transportation, using the ferry between Helsinki and Tallinn and the trams.

There is one other Hilton that is quite far on an island and a resort property if IIRC. That one could be a "value" because it was a 60K property but due to the revenue-based value, can be had for 30K in one of the dates we were looking at. However due to its location we opted for Raddison Blu instead even though that means no free brekkie. But Helsinki is not as expensive as Stockholm and certainly much cheaper than Oslo. You can get very reasonable hot foods at the supermarkets. I would rather be at a location where we can walk around the center of the town versus a location must use transportation.

That Hilton might not shown on TripAdvisor as Helsinki because the place it is located at, technically speaking is NOT Helsinki but an island nearby! Though the island is connected to the main part of the town via bridge/road.
Oh yes, this particular Hilton ranked quite high on the list too but I do not remember the actual rank.

The best location chain hotels are the Radisson Blu's. One is right by the main train station and the other is 1/2 miles away, next to a metro station and a shopping mall.

Happy

Because in some parts of the world, hotels rates are based on each person. This is particularly true in Northern Europe and in Japan the 2 parts of the world I have seen such.
Go to revenue bookings you will see the rates are based on SINGLE person. This is NOT limited to Hilton because it is how the locations custom charges are. IHG hotels have had such plenty of times when booking Pay Stays but on Reward nights due to it is still a "chart", you do not get charge additional points for 2 persons. Since Hilton has gone revenue base, it is ONLY NATURAL that the points required for 2 persons would be More Than one person. Nothing weird about it once you understand the reason behind it - your points worth a set value then just divided the value against the rates which are HIGHER for 2 persons, Pretty Simple.

On the other side of the coin, when there are sales like 30% off chain wide, all participated hotels would have their pay rates reflecting the discount - naturally the points required would be the result of dividing the set value of the point from the ongoing rates, hence the point level would go down when the rates go down. Why there is even a question?

chrism20

Checking regularly and cancel/rebook if necessary is now definitely the way to go. They now need to be treated in the same way as flexible reservations imo.

Re the sales I don't think it will change the points as I'm sure points required is worked out on the HH flexible cash rate and the sales are usual x% off the flex rate.

ChinaShrek

Until Hilton makes award reservation non-refundable like the legacy carriers have made award bookings for flights (or you can pay a fee to get your miles/points back).

dinotoon

Is anyone else having issues with the 5 night free award?

I have 350,000 points and I'm trying to book 10 nights at a 40,000/night property.

With the 5th night free, it should be 32,000 points per night (320,000 total) - but it won't take off the 5th and 10th night points and moves
me to the money and points page so I can pick the combo of points and money I want to use.

Any idea how to just use points and get them to deduct the free nights? This was never an issue before.

serpens

Are you sure it's a 40,000 points per night property? If it's now a 50,000 points per night property (courtesy of the recent enhancement), then you are already seeing the discounted price.

Note that with 5th night free, you still see a charge for every night.

If you have any doubts about the points per night required, you could log out, clear cookies (I don't know if that matters, but it shouldn't hurt), and check the hotel without logging in.

ozztraveller

I just checked and it is working fine. The only thing I know of is if you are not logged in or the hotel is not allowing award stays for one night or more. Try checking another hotel and see if you get the same result.

I always check dates and prices before logging in so you can see the discount has been applied.

iahphx

They MIGHT do that to prevent gaming, but I doubt it. The hotel industry doesn't really embrace non-refundable rates. And I don't think most members will play the game. I would think the small "loss" they'll take on rebookings will be written off as "member engagement."

Also, if the systemwide sales DON'T reduce award prices, there won't be an obvious time to rebook. It would be more random, and less popular.

GUWonder

Award night cancellations close-in to stay actually may save Hilton Corp money. Discouraging such cancellations would make no rational sense except as a way to increase breakage in customer accounts.

Happy

I have seen the past Winter Sale rates were cancellable up to 3 days before arrival. in fact I used it at Hilton Capital Grand at Abu Dhabi in January - canceled an award booking at 30K and rebooked a $99 room about 5 days before arrival.

So it is not a fully flexible rate but with very small difference.

In any case at the current scheme, the room would cost 20K pts if it works.

Regardless whether the point level would be repriced or not, I think everyone should always check what are the cash rates versus the point level once the travel plan is very much fixed and very close in.

I also dont believe Honors would make award bookings non-refundable because that is NOT an industry standard. Not to say Honors would never go that route but the chance of it to go that direction is relatively small.

It always pay to check your cancelable bookings on hotels and rental cars.

chrism20

Yes it's clear from looking online and I'm sure Lauren also said somewhere that points per night are calculated using the HH discount flexible booking so any sale price (which is usually a discount from the flexible or HH discount flexible booking price) is not going to affect the points per night rate on awards regardless of how flexible the sale rate is as that is not the rate that is used to calculate the rewards night cost.

I also cannot see rewards nights going to non cancel at this time. But it wouldn't surprise me if things were tightened up at some point in the future to something like the restrictions on your sale rate that you mention.