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UA Plays Dirty and Kicks Delta Out of Dallas-Love

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UA Plays Dirty and Kicks Delta Out of Dallas-Love

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Old Oct 1, 2014, 10:20 am
  #91  
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How many distressed folks here would be giving DL management kudos for a sharp business move if the roles were reversed?
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 10:47 am
  #92  
 
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Originally Posted by StayingHomeIsBetter
How many distressed folks here would be giving DL management kudos for a sharp business move if the roles were reversed?
All of them
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 10:51 am
  #93  
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Originally Posted by hazelrah
And Delta has close to 80% of the gates at ATL.
Are you aware of any airlines being prevented from starting or expanding service at ATL due to a lack of gates?
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 10:57 am
  #94  
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Originally Posted by StayingHomeIsBetter
How many distressed folks here would be giving DL management kudos for a sharp business move if the roles were reversed?
I don't particularly think it a sharp business move to underutilize your own assets merely to prevent someone else from getting a tiny sliver of a market. So, yeah, if DL were underutilizing LGA, for example, I wouldn't be giving them any kudos.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 11:05 am
  #95  
 
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Originally Posted by pbarnette
Are you aware of any airlines being prevented from starting or expanding service at ATL due to a lack of gates?
IMO DoJ and DoT thoroughly looked at the matter of the DAL gates and came to the correct decision.

Post #89 in this thread is spot on IMO and said it better than I could.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 11:26 am
  #96  
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Originally Posted by hazelrah
IMO DoJ and DoT thoroughly looked at the matter of the DAL gates and came to the correct decision.

Post #89 in this thread is spot on IMO and said it better than I could.
That isn't a response to my question. You stated that DL had a large majority of the gates at ATL, seemingly as a means of justifying WN's monopoly position at DAL. They are very different in that anyone could start service out of ATL if they wanted. There are no artificial constraints there.

The better analogy would be DL's position at LGA. I would assume that you feel the DOJ and DOT made the proper decision in giving DL a dominant position there?
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 11:44 am
  #97  
 
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Originally Posted by pbarnette
That isn't a response to my question. You stated that DL had a large majority of the gates at ATL, seemingly as a means of justifying WN's monopoly position at DAL. They are very different in that anyone could start service out of ATL if they wanted. There are no artificial constraints there.

The better analogy would be DL's position at LGA. I would assume that you feel the DOJ and DOT made the proper decision in giving DL a dominant position there?
I'm not going to say what you want me to say. I think DoT has all the data. That said it is a process, a negotiated process. Everybody gets their say- the airlines and the community, and DoJ comes to a decision based on data and input from the effected parties. It's a pretty open process. I wasn't necessarily thrilled with the LGA decision initially, nor was I thrilled with the DAL decision initially, but with time I think both are correct.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 11:49 am
  #98  
 
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Originally Posted by DiverDave
Seriously - Is that the best you can do? Delta suing over us US taxpayers subsidizing foreign airlines? Hawaiian Airlines joined the suit, by the way along with ALPA.

None of those airlines are disadvantaged startups, and do not need us taxpayers to subsidize their aircraft purchases. In fact, all of those airlines have significant cost advantages over Delta anyway.

Whether Boeing needs the subsidy is another discussion.

And by the way, you said regularly. I asked for links and you provided the one example.

David
Whether export credit financing is a subsidy or provides recipients a cost advantage is a valid discussion, though not germane to this discussion.

What is relevant is that Delta continues to sue foreign competitors because it wants to reduce or eliminate their head-to-head and indirect competition. Read the briefs to see their true intent.

Look at Delta's behavior with Norwegian as well.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 12:43 pm
  #99  
 
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How long has DAL been juggling its much sought after Tokyo International slots? HAL, UAL, AAL want the slot with actual plans to use it, you cannot say with a straight face that that is any less of a "game".
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 12:58 pm
  #100  
 
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Originally Posted by fly18725
.

Look at Delta's behavior with Norwegian as well.
While Delta may have been more vocal about it, the opposition to Norwegian was widespread across both the US and European carriers; UA and AA also joined in the opposition, as did AF, LH, etc.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 1:34 pm
  #101  
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Originally Posted by ROCAT
How long has DAL been juggling its much sought after Tokyo International slots? HAL, UAL, AAL want the slot with actual plans to use it, you cannot say with a straight face that that is any less of a "game".
If UAL were so concerned about slots at NRT, why did they dismantle their hub there? I doubt DL's slots are particularly sought after.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 1:39 pm
  #102  
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Originally Posted by fly18725
Whether export credit financing is a subsidy or provides recipients a cost advantage is a valid discussion, though not germane to this discussion.
Then why did you bring it up! You are the one that said they routinely sue and the sole example you provided is not germane?
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 1:40 pm
  #103  
 
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I really don't blame UA for this. To me, it's on the DOJ and the city of Dallas for picking VX for the two former AA gates. To me, VX has nothing to offer but to duplicate service that WN was already going to provide (SFO, LAX, DCA, LGA) with limited or no connecting possibilities for pax.

Also, for some reason Dallas seems to not believe in common use gates, which means everyone gets their gates as opposed to making the airport as efficient as possible.

UA can do what it wants with its gates. If it thinks that having a regional jet sit there for 90 minutes is what's best for their business, more power to them.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 1:55 pm
  #104  
 
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Originally Posted by SJC ORD LDR
I really don't blame UA for this. To me, it's on the DOJ and the city of Dallas for picking VX for the two former AA gates. To me, VX has nothing to offer but to duplicate service that WN was already going to provide (SFO, LAX, DCA, LGA) with limited or no connecting possibilities for pax.
Isn't at least part of the point to increase competition? By definition it would be a duplication.

I read some of the public comment afterwards and a lot of the frequent travelers in Dallas are elated that Virgin was selected.
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Old Oct 1, 2014, 3:51 pm
  #105  
 
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Originally Posted by pbarnette
If UAL were so concerned about slots at NRT, why did they dismantle their hub there? I doubt DL's slots are particularly sought after.
I said Tokyo not Narita.
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