bennos

Eh, it's more like flying on a 737 for 12 hours. (I flew AF's seat plus config on the UD, which is 3x3 at 34".) Still not my first choice... if I had to fly DL Y/EC internationally I'd try to route to a twin aisle, or maybe just sit in a regular Y exit row.

RealHJ

+1

The best seating on the best aircraft gone. And plus, it seems so wasteful to do this so shortly after spending so much to put in the new seating, to rip it out yet again and put in Y seats...only to a few years later retire the planes anyway.

Why didn't DL then just leave the 2+2 WBC seats on the UD and sell those as true premium economy (something between economy and business, not just the same seats with slightly more legroom)? Now that would have made sense: much lower capex and a truly distintinct product on the UD.

Still hoping that it's not true - it just doesn't seem very logical or a good investment to me, but then again, with so many variables at play, may be to DL it really does work out as a positive.

k2

Pilots and FAs unhappy - of course they are - we're talking 3x as many bodies in the same space. More competition for the lavs. FAs will have more pax to serve. The overhead bin situation will be a nightmare. But I speculate the real reason they're unhappy, the same reason many here hate it: bye bye freebie (NRSA) inventory.

Will I miss the ride up there, no doubt - it was hands down the finest in DL's fleet. But downstairs is fine.

Now, as a stockholder (which I'm not) I'd have to scratch my head a bit. DL dumped a boatload of $ refitting these planes and they're already ripping stuff out. There hasn't been a macro change in J spending over that time, so how did DL get the data so wrong just a short time ago?

Deadtail

Why does the ratio matter on international planes...or are you just typing things.

rylan

Why does it not matter? If anyone wants to use their global upgrades, it certainly matters a lot. It also matters if you want to get a reasonable priced ticket, instead of only an 8k C ticket being available.

Oh and just what do you think thats going to do to award inventory? Think its hard now to get a BE seat at low?

Deadtail

So you think that the number of seats available for upgrade on a flight is dependent on the number of BE seats on the plane?

motytrah

I wouldn't be surprised if the 744 pilots had a heads up. It's a very small pilot group that's the most senior and fenced. When you start pulling planes out of service for retrofits it's going to be a deal for them. I wouldn't be surprised if they are given a bit more deference compared to other groups.

sky303

I still don't get why people are talking in absolutes. At this point, this is nothing more than a rumor put forward by some people who belong to groups known for unreliable gossiping. I'm pretty sure pilots and FAs are very low on the totem pole of insider knowledge when it comes to aircraft reconfiguring and refurbishment. This is a management and customer experience decision, not FlightOps or IFS.

jdrtravel

Correct me if I am wrong, but the cost of the new seats is much more in the seat itself than in the labor to install it, right? So if Delta does remove these seats, they could still be installed on other a/c in future mods or purchases, right? Or do these only fit on the 747's.

Bonheur

As a delta FA I have heard this rumor for a couple of months now. There indeed IS a communication from senior management to the pilots regarding this possible change - and the wording was they "may" replace BE with EC seats on the upper deck. Not that it was decided, but it was being looked into. I know this because I read it myself. So insomuch that it is being discussed - it is not a rumor, but is true.

From what I can gather, though, there seems to be a disconnect with what the communication says "may" and what the line 747 pilots are saying - which is that it's happening. I've asked over a dozen guys in the past few weeks and they all say the same thing. As a FA I agree that my group will be the last to know. ha.

That said, a couple of things here that I felt were inaccurate. First, if anyone thinks any Delta pilot or FA doesn't take cockpit security very seriously, they are mistaken. Especially on the UD, which is so separate from everyone else. If this mod should occur, I envision a cage situation similar to what has been installed on the newly modified A330s.

Second, nothing about reconfiguring the UD makes the pilot's jobs "harder." In fact it doesn't have any bearing on their job at all. I would even argue that it doesn't make FAs jobs harder either - 2 FAs setting up the galley for and then serving 14 BE pax a 4 course meal isn't any more or less difficult than those same 2 FAs serving 40 passengers a drink and a (one course) coach meal. Serving the BE pax is probably more work, actually. I know the service would be over much quicker if it were EC. But there are pluses and minuses to both. I would be fine with either - no matter what being on the UD is easier than the MD from a FAs point of view. (since you are in your own little world up there.)

Personally, I hope they don't do it because I know how much certain HVCs value being able to travel in BE on the UD. Plus I don't believe any UD EC configuration would be comfortable for the passengers. For me it has nothing to do with what would be "easier" for me - but what would be better for our customers. Believe it or not.

ANstar

Having a look at the old JAL seat map, they put 66 economy pax on the upper deck.

http://www.jal.co.jp/en/aircraft/conf/744.html

motytrah

I flew that JL config over a decade ago. Wasn't a bad deal as 1) there were hardly any folks up there 2) The 15 year scotch poured from a real large bottle. 3) A giant box of self service snacks laid out in the galley. 4) Attentive crew that did things like clean the bathrooms a couple times during the flight.

jdrtravel

Over a decade ago is the mythological past of airline history.

Bonheur

While that looks like no fun, the highest number I've heard for EC on the UD is 40-50ish. (Again..rumors.) I guess it will depend how many they can squeeze up there with the EC seat pitch. I can say, I seriously doubt delta will add a number that means that the increase in passenger count would require an additional FA. So the overall pax # would be a consideration.

HongKonger

Keep dreaming.