Speculation: Will AA continue to pull back in NYC?
#542




Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 3,734
That goes against what was mentioned in the video accompanying today's press release. JFK was briefly mentioned and AA's goal is to focus on business markets from JFK.
As for JFK, killing the ZRH route is not a great example of attempting to focus on business markets.
Seems very hard to work out any sort of strategy here. Clearly they want to focus trans-Atlantic flying through Philly, but route selection remains a mystery and I have no idea how they think they're going to maintain any sort of foothold on the NYC market by hacking away at the route network. Maybe they should just sell the JFK slots to United--I hear that they figured out leaving was a bad idea despite the strong presence at EWR.
#543
FlyerTalk Evangelist


Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: SoCal/ Central Europe
Programs: AA EXP/DL PLT/UA GLD/HY GL/HH GLD
Posts: 22,442
They were not serving JFK-FRA. And if the soon-to-be-axed seasonal PHL-FRA route was such a business route, it would not have been made a seasonal route a couple of years ago.
#544
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 1,309
They served JFKFRA briefly, VERY briefly, in the 1990s then around 2001 I think. Some people are still complaining that it is gone. Time to move on. And yes - if PHLFRA had been so successful year round, they would have kept it year round.
The point is, for the most part, flights to German business centers such as FRA and MUC are HIGHLY dependent on the German corporate point of sale. AA cannot touch it - they all go to LH and UA. There's a reason UA does well in FRA and MUC and the others have far less success. It's their relationship with Lufthansa. Germans are very brand loyal, and that's it.
The point is, for the most part, flights to German business centers such as FRA and MUC are HIGHLY dependent on the German corporate point of sale. AA cannot touch it - they all go to LH and UA. There's a reason UA does well in FRA and MUC and the others have far less success. It's their relationship with Lufthansa. Germans are very brand loyal, and that's it.
#545
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: New York
Programs: AA, CX, Hyatt, Marriott
Posts: 1,484
and now we are saying FRA is not a business route. While you are right in pointing out AA has never offered JFK - FRA, I believe posts above already answered the question: it is partly because AA that served the business routes with outdated AC which pushed business pax to UA/DL/*A/ST, not the routes per se not business.
#546


Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Austin, TX - AUS
Programs: AA Platinum, Hilton, Hyatt, IHG, Marriott
Posts: 1,649
The point is, for the most part, flights to German business centers such as FRA and MUC are HIGHLY dependent on the German corporate point of sale. AA cannot touch it - they all go to LH and UA. There's a reason UA does well in FRA and MUC and the others have far less success. It's their relationship with Lufthansa. Germans are very brand loyal, and that's it.
#547
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 1,309
They do, and AA does from DFW and CLT. DL does from markets that it owns (DTW and ATL) and is willing to deal with JFK. Maybe they have a corporate contract in NYC that helps it. Delta has also been in Germany for nearly 40 years and has worked at building a point of sale strength there to get some of the German point of Sale. AA has been trying for less time, and for the most part has failed to capture the German point of sale corporate market, for whatever the reason.
Not all airlines can be all things to all people, and you see that in the various decisions that each carrier has to make as they're figuring out how to most profitably allocate their resources.
Not all airlines can be all things to all people, and you see that in the various decisions that each carrier has to make as they're figuring out how to most profitably allocate their resources.
#548



Join Date: Sep 2016
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#549




Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: DCA
Programs: DL DM, AA EXP, various hotel
Posts: 2,231
Delta also has or has had flights to more German markets than AA has had consistently--TXL, STR, DUS in addition to MUC and FRA.
#550
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2006
Programs: AAdvantage PP
Posts: 13,913
What JFK routes will now be left in the Caribbean? Maybe just STT? Seems like domestic from JFK will be LAX, SFO, MIA with a once a day to/from SAN, SEA and LAS, token 1 or 2 a day to CLT, DFW, ORD and whatever remains of Eagle.
#551
Original Poster


Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
Programs: Delta Platinum, American Gold, JetBlue Mosaic 4, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Explorist, Hilton Diamond,
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I think they are increasing their frequencies to DFW to 4 a day. They also do flights like MCO, BOS (mainline, not eagle), DCA (mainline) from JFK.
#552




Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 3,734
I totally don't understand these. Is AA's target market here people from southern Queens and Long Island who have business in Dallas? Most people from the New York Metro area are going to prefer the plentiful LGA flights. Putting flights to a hub within the LGA perimeter at DFW seems like a huge waste of a JFK slot.
#553




Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: JFK, BUR, YVR
Programs: AC, AS (PLT), BA, DL, HH (G), MR (TIT/LTP), UA (*S), UScAAre (1,94MM), WN
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Well they just cut service to Frankfurt and added it to Dubrovnik, is the goal that Philly is supposed to focus on leisure markets by cutting business routes and not replacing them anywhere?
As for JFK, killing the ZRH route is not a great example of attempting to focus on business markets.
Seems very hard to work out any sort of strategy here. Clearly they want to focus trans-Atlantic flying through Philly, but route selection remains a mystery and I have no idea how they think they're going to maintain any sort of foothold on the NYC market by hacking away at the route network. Maybe they should just sell the JFK slots to United--I hear that they figured out leaving was a bad idea despite the strong presence at EWR.
As for JFK, killing the ZRH route is not a great example of attempting to focus on business markets.
Seems very hard to work out any sort of strategy here. Clearly they want to focus trans-Atlantic flying through Philly, but route selection remains a mystery and I have no idea how they think they're going to maintain any sort of foothold on the NYC market by hacking away at the route network. Maybe they should just sell the JFK slots to United--I hear that they figured out leaving was a bad idea despite the strong presence at EWR.
#554
Original Poster


Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
Programs: Delta Platinum, American Gold, JetBlue Mosaic 4, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Explorist, Hilton Diamond,
Posts: 5,116
I totally don't understand these. Is AA's target market here people from southern Queens and Long Island who have business in Dallas? Most people from the New York Metro area are going to prefer the plentiful LGA flights. Putting flights to a hub within the LGA perimeter at DFW seems like a huge waste of a JFK slot.
- Flagship lounge as a selling point for JFK to DFW to international passengers
#555




Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 3,734
I'm sure it happens amongst the FlyerTalk crowd, but I have literally never had a conversation with someone that would go to JFK vs. LGA in order to make a connection to DFW for an international flight because the lounge was nicer.

