Earning and redeeming AA miles / upgrading on BA/IB; BA fuel surcharge (Oct 1, 2010)
Oct 1, 2010, 10:40 am
#106
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Mostly AUS or rural England
Programs: BAEC redundant Bronze, AAdvantage Lifetime PLT, CO, WN, B6
Posts: 6,526
Look at it another way - AAdvantage members have been getting a better deal than BAEC members for some considerable time. The playing field has just been leveled, though not in areas like SWU's - BAEC still lag behind AAdvantage members.
Oct 1, 2010, 10:41 am
#107
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Canada
Programs: AA LT Platinum, AX Cent so...Delta Plat, SPG Gold, etc..
Posts: 504
YVR-LHR just went up by 10x in fees/costs 
Crud!
Crud!
Oct 1, 2010, 10:43 am
#108
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 3,049
What I am seeing is significant enhancements for BAEC members both on their own airline and on ours, but for me at least, no improvements at all and a loss on award redemptions.
Very hard to see this with anything other than a glass half-empty perspective right now.
If this is the best AA could manage I'm not surprised they have so much trouble with negotiations elsewhere as well ...
Oct 1, 2010, 10:43 am
#109
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Benicia, California, USA
Programs: AA PLT,AS,UA PP,J6,FB,EY,LH,SQ,HH Dmd,Hyatt Glbl,Marriott Plat,IHG Plat,Accor Gold
Posts: 10,820
And while the lack of SWU redemption on BA is a drag, the point requirements to go from WT to WT+ and from WT+ to CW aren't bad--12.5K each way.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't we much better off in terms of travel options today than we were yesterday?
Oct 1, 2010, 10:44 am
#110
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Juan, PR
Programs: AAdvantage 1M/Exec Plat
Posts: 10
I for one, am excited!
Not the least of my reasons being that I am scheduled to fly on BA on Oct 14 from SJU-LHR-SIN and back, and I wasn't too happy about only getting 25% of the miles for such a long trip. Just in the nick of time!
Also, the addition of Iberia is great for me, as from SJU there is a direct flight to MAD which is a terrific option for connections into Europe without having to go through LHR.
Yay!
Also, the addition of Iberia is great for me, as from SJU there is a direct flight to MAD which is a terrific option for connections into Europe without having to go through LHR.
Yay!
Oct 1, 2010, 10:47 am
#111
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 3,049
You may have missed the requirement to be on full fare economy to do it and without the ability to double upgrade you can't get to CW from an economy fare of any type at all, you'd have to buy WT+
Oct 1, 2010, 10:48 am
#112
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,295
I really hope something like the WSJ picks up what a bait and switch this is regarding AA miles on BA. Something like:
"You can now use those hard-earned AA miles for BA flights, but with it comes a hefty price. Unlike before, you're now responsible for fuel surcharges of $$hundreds if you want to redeem your miles on BA flights anywhere in the world."
"You can now use those hard-earned AA miles for BA flights, but with it comes a hefty price. Unlike before, you're now responsible for fuel surcharges of $$hundreds if you want to redeem your miles on BA flights anywhere in the world."
Oct 1, 2010, 10:49 am
#113
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,767
On that we can clearly agree.
What I am seeing is significant enhancements for BAEC members both on their own airline and on ours, but for me at least, no improvements at all and a loss on award redemptions.
Very hard to see this with anything other than a glass half-empty perspective right now.
If this is the best AA could manage I'm not surprised they have so much trouble with negotiations elsewhere as well ...
What I am seeing is significant enhancements for BAEC members both on their own airline and on ours, but for me at least, no improvements at all and a loss on award redemptions.
Very hard to see this with anything other than a glass half-empty perspective right now.
If this is the best AA could manage I'm not surprised they have so much trouble with negotiations elsewhere as well ...
The only "bright" side is now deep discount fares on BA earn 100% miles. This may help some folks especially those in the West Coast that prefer the BA direct flights.
Oct 1, 2010, 10:50 am
#114
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,295
How is this different from before? Iberia has always been an option for mileage earning/burning. The significant change is regarding AA/BA.
Oct 1, 2010, 11:02 am
#115
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: DFW
Programs: AA 1M
Posts: 31,475
Oct 1, 2010, 11:04 am
#116
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: DFW
Programs: AA 1M
Posts: 31,475
Is AA now adding the fuel charge to it's flights as well as BA's?
I didn't see that in the announcement but am trying to put together an award trip next summer RDU-DFW-LHR out in F and back LHR-MIA-RDU also in F. Taxes and fees are coming up at $250 per passenger. I thought the max on AA was $182.50? Where does this come from??
I didn't see that in the announcement but am trying to put together an award trip next summer RDU-DFW-LHR out in F and back LHR-MIA-RDU also in F. Taxes and fees are coming up at $250 per passenger. I thought the max on AA was $182.50? Where does this come from??
Oct 1, 2010, 11:05 am
#117
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,295
US-India/Middle East -- not including AA ORD-DEL or using 9W, IT, GF, LY, RJ.
Bad:
via LHR using BA
Y = 45K + $$ YQ
J = 67.5K + $$$ YQ
F = 90K + $$$$ YQ
Better:
via HKG using CX
Y = 35K + 22.5 = 57.5K
J = 55K + 30 = 85K
F = 67.5 + 45 = 112.5
Best:
via NRT using JL and then possibly CX via HKG (I do not know the details of Asia Zone 1 to India routing rules)
Y = 25K + 22.5 = 47.5K
J = 50K + 30 = 80K
F = 62.5 + 45 = 107.5
Depending on what $$$$ and $$$ YQs are, if you value 17.5K AA less than $$$$ YQ, or 12.5K less than $$$ YQ, then you're better off with a TPAC routing in F and J, respectively. You also get a free stop anywhere in Asia Zone 1.
Bad:
via LHR using BA
Y = 45K + $$ YQ
J = 67.5K + $$$ YQ
F = 90K + $$$$ YQ
Better:
via HKG using CX
Y = 35K + 22.5 = 57.5K
J = 55K + 30 = 85K
F = 67.5 + 45 = 112.5
Best:
via NRT using JL and then possibly CX via HKG (I do not know the details of Asia Zone 1 to India routing rules)
Y = 25K + 22.5 = 47.5K
J = 50K + 30 = 80K
F = 62.5 + 45 = 107.5
Depending on what $$$$ and $$$ YQs are, if you value 17.5K AA less than $$$$ YQ, or 12.5K less than $$$ YQ, then you're better off with a TPAC routing in F and J, respectively. You also get a free stop anywhere in Asia Zone 1.
Oct 1, 2010, 11:06 am
#118
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 589
Still to come: higher fares
[deleted]
Last edited by wrose99; May 12, 2011 at 9:41 pm
Oct 1, 2010, 11:07 am
#119
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Benicia, California, USA
Programs: AA PLT,AS,UA PP,J6,FB,EY,LH,SQ,HH Dmd,Hyatt Glbl,Marriott Plat,IHG Plat,Accor Gold
Posts: 10,820
It also seems that the full fare requirement also applies to upgrading from WT+ to CW. At least that's what the language in the FAQs indicates. And the AA CSR who just tried to find upgrade availability for me seemed to encounter that requirement--he was given only one pricing option, the full fare one, when searching for upgrades. (My only small caveat here is that he was figuring all of this out as he was going along, so while he seemed quite competent I guess there's a small chance he missed something.)
I was under the impression that upgrading from WT+ to CW using BA miles could be done using a discounted WT+ ticket. If I'm right about that, then AA members are at a significant disadvantage in this regard.
Oct 1, 2010, 11:07 am
#120
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: DFW
Programs: AA 1M
Posts: 31,475
Don't forget that today's announcements were supposed to be the "enhancements" that would make you so happy and make the higher-fares pill easier to swallow. The real purpose of the ATI, is to increase profit for both airlines (not necessarily revenue). That is their obligation to their shareholders so I don't blame them for pursuing it.
It is an economic fact, not a theory, just as surely as evolution is a fact, not a theory, that when two major competitors in a market are allowed to collude on price and quantity offered, the result will be higher prices and reduced quantity. Since these two companies have other competitors in their market(s), the magnitude of the price increases will not be as high as it would have been if the two companies had a higher joint market share. But make no mistake about it, you will be paying for ATI via higher fares.
Whether that is a good or bad thing depends on your point of view. One could argue that AA cannot survive unless it can get higher fares. On the other hand if your goal is to fly cheaply to Europe on AA, you will find that a lot harder to do. Also, AA and BA need to channel as much of their pooled traffic as possible through LHR, where their joint pricing power will be strongly. If your goal is to fly direct to Europe on AA without connecting via LHR I believe that will be harder and harder to do in the coming years.
It is an economic fact, not a theory, just as surely as evolution is a fact, not a theory, that when two major competitors in a market are allowed to collude on price and quantity offered, the result will be higher prices and reduced quantity. Since these two companies have other competitors in their market(s), the magnitude of the price increases will not be as high as it would have been if the two companies had a higher joint market share. But make no mistake about it, you will be paying for ATI via higher fares.
Whether that is a good or bad thing depends on your point of view. One could argue that AA cannot survive unless it can get higher fares. On the other hand if your goal is to fly cheaply to Europe on AA, you will find that a lot harder to do. Also, AA and BA need to channel as much of their pooled traffic as possible through LHR, where their joint pricing power will be strongly. If your goal is to fly direct to Europe on AA without connecting via LHR I believe that will be harder and harder to do in the coming years.