New Amanresorts, GHM & Ahn Luh Development (2014 Edition)
May 6, 2014, 5:33 pm
#166
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL DM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,341
I do think we will see some changes, and ones that will not please more than a few on this forum.
But, for goodness sake it's just a collection of luxury properties.
May 6, 2014, 6:26 pm
#167
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: La Jolla, California
Programs: KrisFlyer Gold, SWA CP
Posts: 1,124
May 6, 2014, 7:12 pm
#168
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: IAD/DCA
Posts: 31,797
aman was a unique concept.
'family' - hmm
'unless' - not stopping discount entirely
discounts are not necessarily the biggest deal (could upgrade instead)
'credit' - might be most interesting choice, tough to interpret
what do people think good owners of aman hotels would do if there were brand problems? i think they would go independent, and retain staff and practices. this is where it can be great that aman is GM centric.
if it would take ~2 years, not sure zecha will start another company like maha. kind of related, does anyone know what the amanresorts succession planning was and if it has been removed? (could be yes/no whether removed or not.)
there is still GHM (with its own problems, owned by who) and ahn luh. (and this thread's subject of GHM / ahn luh as well)
http://sg.linkedin.com/pub/ajai-zecha/34/177/643
2013 GHM >
jun 18 - sakala
jul 9 - taiwan
sep 11 - maldives
GHM losses > http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/21741360-post337.html
http://sg.linkedin.com/pub/asanka-pe...?trk=pub-pbmap
Akasa / Vilasita definitely ajai zecha, presumably this as well >
may 23 2012 >
may 12 2013 >
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/luxur...ch-2014-a.html >
Lukasz Prendke / Monika Prendke
still tim weiland in beijing? http://cn.linkedin.com/in/timweiland
'family' - hmm
'unless' - not stopping discount entirely
discounts are not necessarily the biggest deal (could upgrade instead)
'credit' - might be most interesting choice, tough to interpret
what do people think good owners of aman hotels would do if there were brand problems? i think they would go independent, and retain staff and practices. this is where it can be great that aman is GM centric.
if it would take ~2 years, not sure zecha will start another company like maha. kind of related, does anyone know what the amanresorts succession planning was and if it has been removed? (could be yes/no whether removed or not.)
there is still GHM (with its own problems, owned by who) and ahn luh. (and this thread's subject of GHM / ahn luh as well)
http://sg.linkedin.com/pub/ajai-zecha/34/177/643
Ajai Zecha
Director of Development General Hotel Management Ltd
April 2013 – Present (1 year 2 months)
Director of Development General Hotel Management Ltd
April 2013 – Present (1 year 2 months)
jun 18 - sakala
jul 9 - taiwan
sep 11 - maldives
GHM losses > http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/21741360-post337.html
http://sg.linkedin.com/pub/asanka-pe...?trk=pub-pbmap
January 2013 – Present General Hotel Management Ltd Assistant to Director of Development
December 2009 – Present Akasa Management Private Limited General Manager
May 2007 – Present Akasa Private Limited Financial Controler
February 2003 – Present Vilasita Holdings Private Limited Country Manager
December 2009 – Present Akasa Management Private Limited General Manager
May 2007 – Present Akasa Private Limited Financial Controler
February 2003 – Present Vilasita Holdings Private Limited Country Manager
December 2012 – July 2013 Townhouse Holdings Financial Controler
does anybody know who are the GMs at ASP and Amanfayun these days? Ms. Ridefar and I are considering a quick trip this fall, but are a little concerned because these two properties seem to get more mixed reviews than any other two Aman properties, both here and on Trip Advisor (I know…). Anyway, quality GMs in place would go a long way to mitigating my worries; they do seem to make the difference.
Lukasz Prendke / Monika Prendke
still tim weiland in beijing? http://cn.linkedin.com/in/timweiland
Last edited by Kagehitokiri; May 19, 2014 at 12:52 pm
May 6, 2014, 10:58 pm
#169
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Here, there … you know how it goes.
Posts: 1,518
I should probably go back and edit my post to read:
"Within most of the luxury traveling world, this Aman sale/takeover has made not a ripple"
I readily admit I may be missing some of the subtext in the posts on this thread.
I suppose my only point is that we all ought to show a bit of patience. As I tend to tell those with whom I work, "Don't panic now … there's plenty of time for that later"
May 7, 2014, 6:52 am
#170
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: my heart is on the shores of the north Italian lakes
Programs: LX Senator Lifetime, Relais&Chateaux Club5C, ex ! "Amanjunkie", ex LHW LC, hate chain hotels
Posts: 2,515
Nothing is eternal. something new will appear
at the NEW Aman.P.S.: Do Como hotels have the potential to become the big hit ? Read good things about the lady from SIN owning it.
P.S. P.S.: Also the Relais & Châteaux are heading downhill with a new president who still has to show his capabilities and a heavy turnover within the member properties.
Last edited by RichardInSF; May 7, 2014 at 9:28 am Reason: remove political commentary
May 7, 2014, 7:42 am
#171
formerly known as deathscar
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: Virtuoso | Four Seasons Preferred Partner | Rosewood Elite | Hyatt Prive - and more
Posts: 2,096
May 7, 2014, 8:08 am
#172
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Enroute to ? & likely flying in ' A ':)
Programs: TPPS, UA, EK ...; Marriott BONVOY , HH, GP, GC..
Posts: 4,217
Exactly the contrary of what Aman stood for. I was always impressed that they managed to treat all guests with the same kindness and attention. AZ once stated to me: "Every guest is a VIP". Possibly now it is better to be Russian and preferably not gay to be welcome at the NEW Aman.
at the NEW Aman.Went terribly wrong indeed! I saw it coming.
But we FTalkers are (for most of us) not the really big spenders, but are wary travellers who wisely spend our hard earned money.
P.S.: Do Como hotels have the potential to become the big hit ? Read good things about the lady from SIN owning it.
..
About the same sentiments .
Located an email which I sent to one of the older / retired GMs some years back ! Going full circle yet again or worse ?
"
Since my first stay at Amanpuri in '89 ( usually give about a year for teething problems ) , I have been very critical that what AZ started should not be adulterated.
It was pretty bad at certain points e.g. ..
& hope the new owners of AMANresorts will be in synch with AZ and will be willing to do the necessary to uphold Aman standards. As you know, some Amans need to be worked on .. "
Déjà vu
COMO has potential , bought Begawan Giri but we have not stayed at since .
Also took over Point Yamu which was AZ linked ..
Not Aman style - very hip , Philippe Starck but good service , enthusiastic - hopefully not because we were with the GM , etc .
So just maybe for many . She ( CO ) does have a range of hotels ( as differentiated from the family part and / or husband's )
Last edited by RichardInSF; May 7, 2014 at 9:30 am Reason: remove political commentary
May 7, 2014, 8:13 am
#173
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: IAD/DCA
Posts: 31,797
May 7, 2014, 8:38 am
#174
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Enroute to ? & likely flying in ' A ':)
Programs: TPPS, UA, EK ...; Marriott BONVOY , HH, GP, GC..
Posts: 4,217
I did write " .. yet again or worse ?
" As this a public forum , it takes quite a bit to be mindful to sensitivities ..
Just appreciate AZ being bold & pioneering ; giving / sharing with us this manner of understated luxury getaways yet always sympathetic to the environment / surrounds . Providing locals with employment , etc & continuing with charitable work wherever an Aman is .
Whatever his shortcomings & for still trying as an octogenarian !!
Last edited by FlyerEC; May 7, 2014 at 8:46 am Reason: Add info
May 7, 2014, 8:50 am
#175
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: IAD/DCA
Posts: 31,797
Last edited by Kagehitokiri; May 9, 2014 at 7:32 pm
May 7, 2014, 9:34 am
#176
Moderator: Luxury Hotels and FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palo Alto, California,USA
Posts: 17,857
Once again, I have had to step in to remove a political discussion best held in the Omni forum.
Please do not restart this part of the discussion again or I may have to hand out suspensions (a very rare need in this forum!).
RichardInSF, moderator, luxury hotels
Please do not restart this part of the discussion again or I may have to hand out suspensions (a very rare need in this forum!).
RichardInSF, moderator, luxury hotels
May 7, 2014, 9:43 am
#177
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: La Jolla, California
Programs: KrisFlyer Gold, SWA CP
Posts: 1,124
I do have serious reservations about the direction of Aman given how AZ was treated, but that is a very different issue.
------------------------
PS -- Now I must eat my words. I gave my GF the following list of options for the 4th of July:
Amangani, Jackson Hole
Four Seasons, Jackson Hole
Twin Farms, Vermont
St Regis, Aspen or perhaps Little Nell, or Hotel Jerome
Hyatt Lake Tahoe
Montage, Deer Valley
Inn of the Five Graces, Santa Fe
Inn at Lost Creek Telluride
And she choose Amangani. So my 'boycott' of Aman didn't even last 24 hours. PC -- book 'pulo. We'll know soon if the new management team is killing Aman-as-we-know-it. You'll have plenty of time to cancel.
-------------------------
------------------------
PS -- Now I must eat my words. I gave my GF the following list of options for the 4th of July:
Amangani, Jackson Hole
Four Seasons, Jackson Hole
Twin Farms, Vermont
St Regis, Aspen or perhaps Little Nell, or Hotel Jerome
Hyatt Lake Tahoe
Montage, Deer Valley
Inn of the Five Graces, Santa Fe
Inn at Lost Creek Telluride
And she choose Amangani. So my 'boycott' of Aman didn't even last 24 hours. PC -- book 'pulo. We'll know soon if the new management team is killing Aman-as-we-know-it. You'll have plenty of time to cancel.
-------------------------
Last edited by RichardInSF; May 7, 2014 at 6:44 pm Reason: delete politcal discussion
May 8, 2014, 9:17 am
#178
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Dublin
Posts: 188
As someone who doesn't follow these things very closely, could someone give me the Cliffs Notes version of why Aman ownership has been such a soap opera? How come they could never attain corporate stability given their margins etc.
May 9, 2014, 7:32 pm
#180
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: IAD/DCA
Posts: 31,797
aman hotel owners can still do whatever they want for zecha
i wonder if zecha never owned much of aman, and it was others (3 or more parties besides vaturi and zecha) who decided to sell to vaturi 5 years after aman launched
vaturi debt led to colony takeover, and seems to have been passed to lee hing. (lee hing also used debt to acquire.) then debt passed to DLF. (not sure whether DLF used debt to acquire.) unfortunate timing for both lee hing and DLF acquisitions. not sure re debt passing to new owner. quotes re latest transaction indicate new owners used debt to acquire.
silverlink / amanresorts >
oct 31 2013 conference call EBIDTA >
2012 $16m
2013 $20m "should be almost targeting about"
lee hing annual reports >
2002-2005 discuss world events impacting travel
2003-2007 discuss the Note (2006 page 46)
2004 pages 43-45 detailed silverlink finances for 2004/2003
2005 pages 62-63 detailed silverlink finances for 2005/2004
2006 pages 56-57 detailed silverlink finances for 2006/2005
(operating expense breakdown plus tax and sizable interest)
2007-2008 seem to include how they accounted for sale
before buy >
http://www.lexpert.ca/magazine/big-s...al-trial-1226/
sources >
http://www.scmp.com/article/328749/l...ys-hotel-chain
http://quotes.morningstar.com/stock/s?t=XHKG%3a00068
http://quote.morningstar.com/stock-f...2e0b47ce9a3b0f
http://www.irasia.com/listco/hk/leehing/
sale - http://202.66.146.82/listco/hk/leehi...nt/a071128.doc
http://quote.morningstar.com/stock-f...ca6d7342d3173d
http://www.dlf.in/dlf/financial_arch..._q4_fy0809.pdf
the Note >
DLF selling >
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/12413686-post879.html
sep 2009 article anonymous "options to fully or partly exit"
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/19806862-post225.html
apr 2010 article anonymous "DLF given till Feb 2010 to Mr Zecha to bring strategic partner"
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/13977977-post81.html
may 2010 article official "looking at potential investors"
jul 2010 - FY2009-2010 "explore the possibility of a strategic partnership"
jul 2010 - apr>jun 2010 Q1FY2011 "explore possibilites for strategic partnerships"
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/20229144-post13.html
late 2010 - increased stake from 89.92% to 94.78% article with official quotes suggests step towards sale
sometime during apr 1 2011 > mar 31 2012 (i think early on) they increased stake to 100%
technically was a year later it officially changed from partners to sale
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/20847639-post48.html
was official that announced sale to "zecha" couldnt get financing
vaturi debt led to colony takeover, and seems to have been passed to lee hing. (lee hing also used debt to acquire.) then debt passed to DLF. (not sure whether DLF used debt to acquire.) unfortunate timing for both lee hing and DLF acquisitions. not sure re debt passing to new owner. quotes re latest transaction indicate new owners used debt to acquire.
silverlink / amanresorts >
Silverlink's current liabilities exceeded its current assets on December 31, 1995 and 1996
net profit after taxation before deduction for minority interests approximately
1998 $3,429,778
1999 $5,806,558
estimated net profit
[2000 $7mm]
profits after taxation approximately
2001 $10,346,000
2002 $3,273,000
loss
2003 $14.0 million
2004 $6.1 million
net loss of Silverlink...after taxation and extraordinary items
2005 $8,534,000
loss [very complicated]
2006 $26.6 million
[sinonet/argent losses etc look even higher]
since the Group’s acquisition of Silverlink, Silverlink has been loss making
31 December 2006 Silverlink net current liabilities approximately $38 million
2007 loss after tax $18.3 million
2008 total cash outflows of Rs. 10,404.82 lacs
2009 total cash outflows of Rs. 437.14 lacs
2010 total cash outflows of ` 513.57 lacs
2011 net cash flows ` 958.16 lacs
2012 net cash outflows of ` 403.14 lac
2013
[1 lac/lakh is about $2,000 - but hasnt always been?]
net profit after taxation before deduction for minority interests approximately
1998 $3,429,778
1999 $5,806,558
estimated net profit
[2000 $7mm]
profits after taxation approximately
2001 $10,346,000
2002 $3,273,000
loss
2003 $14.0 million
2004 $6.1 million
net loss of Silverlink...after taxation and extraordinary items
2005 $8,534,000
loss [very complicated]
2006 $26.6 million
[sinonet/argent losses etc look even higher]
since the Group’s acquisition of Silverlink, Silverlink has been loss making
31 December 2006 Silverlink net current liabilities approximately $38 million
2007 loss after tax $18.3 million
2008 total cash outflows of Rs. 10,404.82 lacs
2009 total cash outflows of Rs. 437.14 lacs
2010 total cash outflows of ` 513.57 lacs
2011 net cash flows ` 958.16 lacs
2012 net cash outflows of ` 403.14 lac
2013
[1 lac/lakh is about $2,000 - but hasnt always been?]
2012 $16m
2013 $20m "should be almost targeting about"
Amanresorts
Marjorie Kinnan Rawlings once said, “A woman has got to love a bad man once or twice in her life to be thankful for a good one.” I have been responsible for so many bad deals that I know when to be thankful for a good one that comes along.
Just as Eleanor Clark appreciates the noble oyster, so I say that if you don’t love life, you can’t enjoy an Amanresort. Approximately 70,000 Aman junkies will attest that it is all too easy to fall in love with heaven on earth.
Heaven, it has been said, knows how to put a proper price upon its goods. But from our point of view, it is better to view this stake in Amanresorts as a short-term deal because it takes the considerable creativity and talent of an Adrian Zecha to make and maintain the marvelous magic that is Amanresorts. Although I like to think of myself as an artist (especially the “hardship” of making the site visits), shareholders and guests will do better if the job is handed over to true professionals.
Tan Boon Seng
Chairman
Hong Kong, 10 April 2001
Marjorie Kinnan Rawlings once said, “A woman has got to love a bad man once or twice in her life to be thankful for a good one.” I have been responsible for so many bad deals that I know when to be thankful for a good one that comes along.
Just as Eleanor Clark appreciates the noble oyster, so I say that if you don’t love life, you can’t enjoy an Amanresort. Approximately 70,000 Aman junkies will attest that it is all too easy to fall in love with heaven on earth.
Heaven, it has been said, knows how to put a proper price upon its goods. But from our point of view, it is better to view this stake in Amanresorts as a short-term deal because it takes the considerable creativity and talent of an Adrian Zecha to make and maintain the marvelous magic that is Amanresorts. Although I like to think of myself as an artist (especially the “hardship” of making the site visits), shareholders and guests will do better if the job is handed over to true professionals.
Tan Boon Seng
Chairman
Hong Kong, 10 April 2001
2002-2005 discuss world events impacting travel
2003-2007 discuss the Note (2006 page 46)
2004 pages 43-45 detailed silverlink finances for 2004/2003
2005 pages 62-63 detailed silverlink finances for 2005/2004
2006 pages 56-57 detailed silverlink finances for 2006/2005
(operating expense breakdown plus tax and sizable interest)
2007-2008 seem to include how they accounted for sale
before buy >
http://www.lexpert.ca/magazine/big-s...al-trial-1226/
sources >
http://www.scmp.com/article/328749/l...ys-hotel-chain
http://quotes.morningstar.com/stock/s?t=XHKG%3a00068
http://quote.morningstar.com/stock-f...2e0b47ce9a3b0f
http://www.irasia.com/listco/hk/leehing/
sale - http://202.66.146.82/listco/hk/leehi...nt/a071128.doc
http://quote.morningstar.com/stock-f...ca6d7342d3173d
http://www.dlf.in/dlf/financial_arch..._q4_fy0809.pdf
the Note >
probably most information ive ever found on aman >
http://www.hkexnews.hk/listedco/list...0031024044.pdf
http://notice.singtao.com/ADMA/00068...eehing0508.pdf
http://www.hkexnews.hk/listedco/list...0031024044.pdf
http://notice.singtao.com/ADMA/00068...eehing0508.pdf
more history, with legal/financial "translation" >
http://www.legal500.com/developments/11752
http://www.legal500.com/developments/11752
The convertible loan notes were to be issued as part of a complex fund raising exercise which involved creditors extending varying loan amounts to Silverlink in exchange for convertible loan notes which contained extensive rights to control the affairs of Silverlink.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/12413686-post879.html
sep 2009 article anonymous "options to fully or partly exit"
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/19806862-post225.html
apr 2010 article anonymous "DLF given till Feb 2010 to Mr Zecha to bring strategic partner"
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/13977977-post81.html
may 2010 article official "looking at potential investors"
jul 2010 - FY2009-2010 "explore the possibility of a strategic partnership"
jul 2010 - apr>jun 2010 Q1FY2011 "explore possibilites for strategic partnerships"
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/20229144-post13.html
late 2010 - increased stake from 89.92% to 94.78% article with official quotes suggests step towards sale
sometime during apr 1 2011 > mar 31 2012 (i think early on) they increased stake to 100%
technically was a year later it officially changed from partners to sale
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/20847639-post48.html
was official that announced sale to "zecha" couldnt get financing
Last edited by Kagehitokiri; May 30, 2014 at 1:28 am