goalie

What? And have folks think I'm a DYKWIA? (and thank you ^)

GUWonder

Congratulations, newer or older, on making the 40,000 on a memorable day, Memorial Day. Nice timing.

JDiver

Thank you. No change in my handle box...

GUWonder

I know. That's why I congratulated the 40,000 post mark.

ozstamps

I've been an "Evangelist" for 10 years or more, and agree with some others above, it always struck me a pretty dumb level name, but I did not put it in place. Randy did in the dim distant past well before my joining, and it stuck until now which is pretty amazing.

I have about 30,000 posts, none of them in OMNI when posts counted ... I have lost the plot as to whether they do or not these days, the policy has changed several times on that in the 14 years i have been here.

I was on TalkBoard for a couple of years, and recall it was discussed back then, and also got nowhere at that time. As like the above, there were 100 different views on whether to tinker with it and it all got too hard.

Since then, I can offer first hand evidence that many tiers DOES appeal to folks on Bulletin Boards.

I own a large non flyer, non travel connected board that has about 30 ranks with different tiers and baubles, that are obtained after 5, 10, 50, 100, 250, 100, 5000, 25,000, 50,000 etc posts.

Our largest poster has over a MILLION posts.

Trust me lots of folks DO focus on getting to a new tier.

I observe that occurring all the time.

Frequent Fliers are more 'status' conscious than this group and they in general WOULD chase a new tier or level.

The top 10 posts on that board are -

1221594
506706
322485
251539
90206
80525
67888
53109
50720
39412

You guessed it - there are new Bauble tiers at 500,000, 250,000 and 50,000 posts.

It would be good to see about a dozen tiers to start with here. It will never occur, from long experience here - I know that, but that is what I'd like to see. ^

Glen

SkiAdcock

The question is does it benefit FT to have folk simply chasing titles?

Cheers.

JDiver

If that's all they're doing, no, other than providing Internet Brands more grist for selling ads (and as that's life blood for the parent, that's not bad). But padded, truly vapid posts can earn everything from post deletion to member disdain and even enmity, so IMO there are some checks and balances in the system.

I think titles do have some relevance, particularly on a BBS catering to a group with at least a significant number who are invested in affinity programs with status; I also think most of us aren't extremely serious about these titles, there should be a bit of light heartedness involved, and that in the end, every member's positioning here depends on the quality of the information provided and treatment of other members (perhaps not in that order).

In the end, I like the idea of more degrees of titling; if the issue becomes tedious or contentious, then it's just not worth it. It's just not that weighty an issue, IMO.

ozstamps

It benefits the owners, as more folks visit, and are mindful to make regular posts. They are not "simply chasing titles" - they are adding posts with one sidebar they also get to a Gold or Emerald or Plutonium bauble by doing so. A VAST % of members here are Status motivated.

Costs zero to do, and all upside overall. To those who claim it does not matter to them, no change. That will not stop 50 more posts saying "I do not care, but ............. " @:-)

As I said, experience tells me it will never occur here. Far too logical a move.

Like some gun control in the USA .... most folks from the President down, would not mind it occurring, but no-one wants to initiate it. So we all accept it will never change.

Glen

SkiAdcock

I wouldn't say it will never change. I'm not sure that many people really notice or care about the titles, as they're more interested in their programs etc. As JDiver mentions, it's not that weighty/pressing an issue with people jumping up & down for it.

FWIW - I've been supportive of having some additional titles because I think there's too big a gap between 0 to 10,000 to 40,000. We don't need a gazillion though. The one thing I think most of us agree on is that Evangelist is just too dorky

Cheers.

beltway

Not to be too horribly OT, but I do notice occasional changes 'round these parts that make things better.

Case in point: the new "collapsed" display for wikis, in which the former regime -- show entire wiki OR hdie except for a small banner bar -- has given way to display of the wikis' first few lines. Given how amazingly epic some of the wikis are (looking at you, Citi AA 50K thread), this change is very welcome.

Given a choice between fixes such as this and implementing more "funny hat" post-count titles, I'd go with the former every time.

ozstamps

Easy to assume that, when there really is only 1 reasonably attainable level here at FT -- the weirdly named 'Evangelist'. And then 95% of members never have enough posts to ever get near it. So nothing to aim for here.

We had a vote in my days on TalkBoard to REMOVE post counts entirely, and all member titles be abolished and much of the arguments made on this thread were made then. It was soundly defeated.





Busy boards are busy, as lots of newer members post. They never aspire for 10,000 posts, but getting to 10 is something that often appeals and seems doable. Or 100 or 1000 etc. Savvy board owners realise this. Setting attainable level 1 at 10,000 posts is silly Sharon. Your stated position seems to be over 10,000 posts a new tier needs to be added, and the name Evangelist changed.

You need to look at the wider picture. 10,000 posts is not going to to EVER reached by most members.

In my experience owning a large board, once members get to 20 posts they are getting in the groove. Most boards have a huge % of members who make zero posts, or just 1 or 2 posts. Giving them a reason to stay posting is savvy.

You'd be quite wrong in your assumption that most members 'do not care' however, as my board proves. Margo also told me quite firmly the idea was silly, and that adults would not be interested.

She now fully concurs that the different levels attract many people to actively reach out for the next one. Someone on 10 wants to get to 20. Someone on 50 wants to get to 100. Someone on 430 is keen to get to 500, and a sparkling new bauble and level ... etc.

Ebay has shown us for 2 decades this WORKS.

We can all learn from THE most successful online retailer on this planet for the past 2 decades. They have had these star ratings in place since near day #1 and I figured I could learn from a success story, and can confirm they work VERY well on Bulletin Boards like this.





On FT on the other hand, there has never been anything to realistically aim at, so that is why you (and many others) feel no-one cares. That is wrong, trust me.

We have a thread there, where milestone post achievers can post, and whether it is 100, 500, 1000, 10,000, 100,000 or a MILLION posts, they are most conscious of aiming for milestones - and getting there. And celebrating it when they do.

ZERO downside to the board - those that truly do not care (very few in reality) ignore it, and those that do care post away merrily because of it. And there are far more more of the latter.

Those in the "if it ain't broke ..." camp would have us all still driving buggies, if they were in charge of life.

The fact this thread is over 2 years old proves to me, that nothing will change - except possibly the silly title "Evangelist" being replaced with another just as meaningless word. And even that word can't be agreed upon.

TalkBoard is supposed to be about moving FT forward, with some new ideas and initiatives now and again.

Unless this summary below of the past YEAR'S efforts is wrong, I cannot see that Talkboard has voted on ANY motion of ANY kind, for the first half of 2014? NO motions put forward by the entire Talkboard acting on input from the entire ~250,000 membership for a half year? Hard to believe.



Perhaps a more relevant thread might be - "In 2014 - do we need a TalkBoard?"

I recall voting on several motions each month during my tenure. I see 6 votes that May alone -

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/town-...l?daysprune=-1

One of them being that posts on OMNI did not count in overall post tally -

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/town-...g-forward.html

That motion got soundly DEFEATED, so for those that say post counts are meaningless to most, go back and read the heated public thread at that time! It was like the Battle Of Gettysburg.

"posts made in the "Omni" forum of Flyertalk do not count towards ones visible post count. This will not be implemented retroactively, but will take place if the motion passes on any new posts made in "Omni".

Glen

CMK10

Quite the post you just made and it definitely gave me some food for thought, though I think you were a little condescending for my liking. I will address one part specifically:

Believe it or not, we do have plenty of debate in our private forum, in fact I've made a few suggestions for ideas myself. However, nothing has yet come up amongst us, or from the TalkBoard Topics that an informal straw count showed there would be a majority aye vote on (though we are going to vote on a USA forum shortly). If I may quote one of my other board members:

"I've never believed that motion for the sake of motion is accomplishment."
- bdschobel

Wise words from a wise man.

ozstamps

Talkboard must have changed a lot in recent times then it seems.

It used to be that specific suggestions from members were acted upon, and voted upon, and in MANY cases not ratified.

In MANY cases. But there were votes.

"Majority Aye Votes" are not what you want, if the motion states "Motion that we close Flyertalk next month". Votes go both ways in life. Depends always on the WORDING of the motion.

Indeed in my TB tenure one NEVER knew in advance the exact final result of any vote, so things must have changed enormously with the stated "straw polls" now. Views of TB members OFTEN changed based on comments posted in the public forum. As should be the case.

I guess if there have been no votes on anything all year, you'll never get to test that in real time!

That is WHY one has review Boards - to vote on suggestions. One way or the other. If the USA Congress only put forward proposals to vote on it KNEW in advance would pass, you may as well be in Zimbabwe!

Otherwise Carol can simply make the occasional call needed, and close the Talkboard entirely, as it seems logical to do, if it is voting on nothing at all during the year, which is now occurring. And she then simply creates a "Trusted Traveller Forum" etc, etc, if she feels it is warranted etc.

If these days there needs to be prior consensus that something will be passed as you impute before a motion is made, and there have been no votes for 6 months, it either means nothing positive is being suggested from Talkboard, or nothing from the 250,000 members. Or both. Sad situation.

So instead of aimlessly discussing here for 2½ years with NO motion of any kind being put forward, whether to change the word "Evangelist" to another unspecified word, let me suggest that someone on TB puts forward this motion below.

Whether it gets voted in or not is hardly the point, and with all due respect to bdschobel (he IS an actuary after all!) - it IS at least a motion for 2014, raised by a member, to actually be discussed and voted on.

Motion - that Flyertalk adopt ten levels of member posting milestones, to be assigned automatically to member handles by the board software as each new level is attained, using different colored icons to be designed by IB staff. The ten post levels to be -

1 to 9 posts
10 to 49
50 to 99
100 to 499
500 to 999
1,000 to 4,999
5,000 to 9,999
10,000 to 24,999
25,000 to 49,999
50,000 to 99,999

Should this motion be passed, Talkboard will later determine the name levels (if any) to be given to each icon tier on user handles.


Only IF the motion is passed is there any need to discuss whether those names are Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Legend etc. Having that as part of initial motion will mean it will be bogged down for years in discussion. Like on ebay, it may be decided no wording needs appear at all, just the icons.

So over to the current Talkboard, to see if a proposer and seconder can be found for this motion, OR whether we try for a new world record of an entire year passing with no new Talkboard motions being voted on. We are half way there already. Over to our elected members.

Glen

tcook052

Inaction while awaiting a magical consensus before proceeding at the end of the day is still inaction. I'm with oz on this one as it's time TB became far more proactive on topics like this one lest we wind up in Nov. with a single TB vote having been held this year which is becoming a distinct possibility.

CMK10

How TalkBoard conducts its business these days is really a different topic for a separate thread. This is a different group from when you were on it and we have different styles of doing things. That said, I will continue to think about what you said and while I will not be making a motion for voting on ten tiers (as I frankly think that is way too many and also do not think we need icons which will hurt those of us who view FT on mobile devices and who pay for data), I will vote on the issue if someone does make it.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.