Alex_I

- Since its birth Starwood program was providing somewhat lower returns/kickbacks through their frequent guest program vs. competitors. But marketing was great and bonuses were generous and announced often. Today, the bonuses are rather comparable or even worse than competition and there is further program devaluation. Sorry Starwood, LifeTime status, new suite upgrade rewards, and slick website are not a substitute for a continuing devaluation of the program.

dsquared37

Considering the hotel decides if they'll offer a C&P rate do you really think they'll offer one if it will cost them money?

Exactly.... they won't offer it if they feel they could sell if for full price.

3Cforme

SPG could take some of the sting out of this by making award stays more desirable: a room type/non-smoking guarantee that would apply to awards (free night and C&P) as well as paid rooms.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/starw...l#post11694212

(If I have missed that enhancement in the three years since Starwood Lurker's post, regrets.)

chemist661

A couple years ago, I was checking hotels in Milan. For 5*, the hotels that came up was the Westin & another much more expensive property. I bid on Priceline less than the cash amount ($90 IIRC) of C+P. No need to use points. ^ As predicted, I got the Westin Milan. Of course, I did my homework on BFT & BB boards. The Zurich Marriott was the same thing for off season. Much less expensive on PL. Looks like PL will be even more a viable option in the future.

With the devaluation, we are now putting spend on our Sapphire Preferred cards instead of the Starwood AMEX. We now only use the AMEX at Costco where only AMEX is accepted.

Bottom line: For us, the devaluation directed our daily spend to CSP instead of Starwood AMEX. That will cost them some merchant fees. Devaluation to C+P now, what is next?

Altaflyer

This would be nice but seriously doubt we will see it!

escapefromphl

PL & Hotwire will be the biggest benefactors of this change. I don't mind paying a bit over the PL or Hotwire price to get my benefits, but one need to do the maths.

I still maintain they should have created another tier, more points and cash for medium occupancy periods and left the lower C & P prices in for the lowest occupancy, perhaps a smaller increase in price would have been OK. Either way the market will speak.

Vulcan

I see hotels already blacking out C & P, I presume to await higher pricing as of March 5.
For instance, I live 60 miles North of TPA and frequently stay at the Sheraton Suites TPA airport if I have an early AM departure. As a level 2, it used to be 1600/$30. It will go to 2000/$35. This is not a deal breaker for me and I will still utilize it at the 2000/$35 level. BUT, BUT, BUT there is now no availability as far out as one can see for any C & P rooms. Availability was always excellent.
This seems to be just another game the hotels play.

RogerD408

Just curious for those looking at upcoming C&P rates, is the lack of availability across the board for ALL future dates, or just dates after Mar 5? Although I don't like it, I can understand pulling the rate for dates after 3/5, but still take what they can get before then. And this tactic will guarantee increased availability after 3/5, given there is NONE right now. Mandating some level of participation would be good, even if only one room at a time.

escapefromphl

I can see C&P availability post 3/5.

Vulcan

As far as Sheraton Suites at TPA hotel goes, it is all dates, from today on.

Edited to add: SPG says in it's announcement " you can book at the current rate until March 5..." and then the hotels negate the value of that announcement with a blackout. Something is wrong.........
It is possible that *wood never thought that the hotels would do this?

3rdworldresident

TOTALLY AGREED!!!

And their category will be up too!!!

Sucks

travelswithmyself

I just checked a couple of places I stayed in last year and all still show large swathes of C&P for Jan & Feb.

All three properties in SG, W Bali, Sheraton Kuta Bali, Laguna Bali, Westin Taipei, W Taipei.

Perhaps those that look blacked out are really just sold out. Taken up by FTers cashing in their points before the new rates and up-categorisation takes place. That seems very likely to me :P

I'm a bit saddened by the ~25% incr especially since I used it a lot to book large family vacations, but maybe we shouldn't over-react until we see what the result of the new scheme is.

dsquared37

Unless they are anticipating a category jump and prefer to withhold the C&P availability until then.

I find this highly unlikely. Using Aloft Bangkok, where there was excellent availability throughout the year, there is now no C&P dates through the end of the year. The chance that 300 days of C&P were booked up is nil.

cxn

I agree. A friend was going on about his C&P stay at the aLoft BKK so I booked two nights and there was no problem finding dates open. After this was announced, no more to be seen.

I cant find any C&P rates for San Diego for the month of June where before this was easy to find.

Hotels arent dumb, they are pulling the rates to get more $$$ from Starwood once the new rates kick on. On top of that, if they move UP a CAT they will get an extra bonus.

Like others, C&P was the right balance of stays/$$. With this downgrade, it might not make sense anymore, esp for longer stays where you get 5th night free on points alone.

I bet if Hotels could they would pull all availability for points and wait for the upgrade in CAT.

moefl

With spg raising both the points portion and the cash portion, bringing the points portion closer to a standard ALL points redemption, what is stopping spg from coming out next month with a points increase as well for an ALL points redemption?
ie, what is stopping them from just devaluing a cat 3 to 10,000 points, and a cat 4 to 12,000 points ect?
This is just awful.