New TSA requirements for address and DOB

Old Oct 22, 08, 8:47 am
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: May 2006
Programs: Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, DeltaMM
Posts: 514
New TSA requirements for address and DOB

Since I didn't see this issue in today's or yesterday's list of active threads, I am guessing that it hasn't been brought up yet/recently - I am sure this forum would have plenty to say about it. If I am wrong and this has lots of hits that I missed, just give me a blindfold and a cigarette and I'll take my punishment.

My local Fox news this morning reported that new TSA measures would be announced today which will require airlines to collect your full name, address and date of birth in order to make better comparisons with the no-fly list. This will be done "to reduce the instances of identity duplications" or some such drivel.

I know this is something that we've all heard could happen, but I hadn't heard until this morning that it would be announced officially today, and implemented some time next year.
krobbins is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 9:28 am
  #2  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Finally back in Boston after escaping from New York
Posts: 13,582
I have no problem with this approach. In fact, I have a better idea. In order to fly, you need your doctor to insert a small microchip in your arm, similar to the chip they put in pets so you can find them if they get lost. The chip will include all of your personal information and can be scanned at the WTMD, thus eliminating the ID checks and saving time. Combine this with the strip search machines and not only will we be 100% safe when we fly but we could also eliminate 2/3 of the TSOs, thus saving the taxpayers a fortune.

Mike
mikeef is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 9:31 am
  #3  
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: various cities in the USofA: NYC, BWI, IAH, ORD, CVG, NYC
Programs: Former UA 1K, National Exec. Elite
Posts: 5,485
If the TSA has terrorists' addresses to compare against, I have suggestion: Go there and arrest the terrorists!

Oh, sorry, that would reveal top secret information that must be kept secret from the terrorists: that we know where they live.
ralfp is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 9:32 am
  #4  
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Louisville, KY, US
Programs: QF Plat - OW EMD | DL Gold / Starwood Gold
Posts: 6,106
here's the scoop

http://www.tsa.gov/press/releases/2008/1022.shtm

Hot off the wire
SDF_Traveler is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 9:45 am
  #5  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: LAX/TPE
Programs: CO Platinum 1K, United 1K, SPG LT Platinum, National Executive Elite, Platinum TSA Hater
Posts: 38,873
I will be posting more about this soon - TSA/DHS has decided to take advantage of their lack of Congressional oversight, and ram through most of the key components of SecureFlight, and there is nothing anyone can do to stop them - including Congress.

SecureFlight (I will be posting the actual data points soon, as promised) is being designed as an informational loop-back to RealID. In a nutshell, you will be assigned an ID 'number', which will be connected to your PNR and tied to your name, DOB, address, social security number and other data points collected.

This data will then be tied to your RealID-secured license or other 'national ID' card you will be carrying. In short, there will be a number which will follow you everywhere, and be tied to all of your daily activities which could be tied to any of these data points, including credit card transactions, bank account activity, air travel, car travel (where you gas up, where you rent a car, etc.), etc. etc. etc.

The end game? The ability of DHS to create a comprehensive dossier on each and every one of us, following us through our daily lives, is becoming closer to reality.

The civil liberties issues aside, why should you care? DHS wants the next generation of RealID cards to include mandatory RFID chips - so while walking down the street, someone with a radio receiver tuned to these chips can strip off all your personal information, including name, address, social and your ID number - gee, I wonder what an identity thief could do with that information. I also wonder what those 'trustworthy' folks at DHS will do with all your personal information - especially if you're someone like a politician, wealthy or a celebrity.

I'm not sure how much effect it would have, but you could try 'poisoning' the database with random entries for your DOB and address and even social, but if we get to a point where everyone is either on the NFL or selectee list unless removed by the 'purity' of your data, then that could cause other complications for travelers. It would, however, leave DHS with a bunch of un-trackable garbage in their database.
bocastephen is online now  
Old Oct 22, 08, 9:53 am
  #6  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,718
A lot of apparently recent information here: http://www.tsa.dhs.gov/what_we_do/la...ght/qanda.shtm

Ironic how TSA PR pieces, including the current website, claim date-of-birth is optional:

http://www.tsa.dhs.gov/what_we_do/la...ght/qanda.shtm

but the actual final rule (see page 13) says it is mandatory: http://www.tsa.dhs.gov/assets/pdf/se...final_rule.pdf

These people really are the scum of the Earth.
studentff is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:04 am
  #7  
Suspended
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 4,952
Originally Posted by bocastephen View Post
I'm not sure how much effect it would have, but you could try 'poisoning' the database with random entries for your DOB and address and even social, but if we get to a point where everyone is either on the NFL or selectee list unless removed by the 'purity' of your data, then that could cause other complications for travelers. It would, however, leave DHS with a bunch of un-trackable garbage in their database.
I can become dyslexic very easily.
doober is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:07 am
  #8  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: DFW
Posts: 23,198
Originally Posted by bocastephen View Post
I will be posting more about this soon - TSA/DHS has decided to take advantage of their lack of Congressional oversight, and ram through most of the key components of SecureFlight, and there is nothing anyone can do to stop them - including Congress.

SecureFlight (I will be posting the actual data points soon, as promised) is being designed as an informational loop-back to RealID. In a nutshell, you will be assigned an ID 'number', which will be connected to your PNR and tied to your name, DOB, address, social security number and other data points collected.

This data will then be tied to your RealID-secured license or other 'national ID' card you will be carrying. In short, there will be a number which will follow you everywhere, and be tied to all of your daily activities which could be tied to any of these data points, including credit card transactions, bank account activity, air travel, car travel (where you gas up, where you rent a car, etc.), etc. etc. etc.

The end game? The ability of DHS to create a comprehensive dossier on each and every one of us, following us through our daily lives, is becoming closer to reality.

The civil liberties issues aside, why should you care? DHS wants the next generation of RealID cards to include mandatory RFID chips - so while walking down the street, someone with a radio receiver tuned to these chips can strip off all your personal information, including name, address, social and your ID number - gee, I wonder what an identity thief could do with that information. I also wonder what those 'trustworthy' folks at DHS will do with all your personal information - especially if you're someone like a politician, wealthy or a celebrity.

I'm not sure how much effect it would have, but you could try 'poisoning' the database with random entries for your DOB and address and even social, but if we get to a point where everyone is either on the NFL or selectee list unless removed by the 'purity' of your data, then that could cause other complications for travelers. It would, however, leave DHS with a bunch of un-trackable garbage in their database.
NAL. but could an request for injunction be filed in federal court asking to halt the implemtation of this rule until a hearing was held.

Seems like someone or some group would have concerns with this.
Boggie Dog is online now  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:36 am
  #9  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: LAX/TPE
Programs: CO Platinum 1K, United 1K, SPG LT Platinum, National Executive Elite, Platinum TSA Hater
Posts: 38,873
Originally Posted by Boggie Dog View Post
NAL. but could an request for injunction be filed in federal court asking to halt the implemtation of this rule until a hearing was held.

Seems like someone or some group would have concerns with this.
I asked our lobbyist this question - the law states that DHS can implement, at its sole discretion, any process, rule or procedure to ensure the security of the United States. Congress gave up its oversight of this process, and we would need to file a court injunction which could cost in the mid 5-figures to implement.

The only hope for right now is a well funded organization like the ACLU having its lawyers file the injunction.

Our lobbyist is trying to arrange for me to get on the 'lame duck' Homeland Security Committee docket post-election to testify on these matters, representing the interests of private frequent travelers. This will introduce me to the Committee (the makeup of which is likely to change when Congress reconvenes) and give me some practice testifying.

On the bright side - if Obama takes the Presidency, the most likely candidate for Secretary of Homeland Security is an individual who is known for having an interest in protecting civil liberties and privacy - the challenge will be undoing what the current group wants to ram through before they clean out their offices.
bocastephen is online now  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:46 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 57
So lie to them

How in any way does it affect the contract of carriage you are agreeing to with the airline?

Yes, they are obligated to compare names to the NFL, and whatever other lists they're directed to, and if said list has additional information that does/does not match up what happens?

You get flagged with SSSS or no ticket issued?

Again, what's the harm in lying to the airline about your birthdate if pressed for it? Not like they're a federal agent or anything that could get you in trouble legally.

Only impact I can foresee would be lack of a "positive non-match" to the NFL which could trigger haraSSSSment with your boarding pass (if you didn't edit & print one out at home) and further indecencies at the checkpoint.

*shrug*

I'm not going to say don't pursue this but since you're giving requested information to the airline (and I'm sure it'll be couched in such a way to make it sound like it'd be illegal to give them false information but I'd doubt it) but then we're to the point of having to get a legal opinion on the parsing of the CofC and how it related to any government directives towards security.

*boggle*

SecureFlight/RealID it is.
What's the phrase again? "Quick! Jesus is coming! Look busy!" but in this case I think it should read" Quick! TSA is coming! Look threatening!"


Fetch
bfetch is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:48 am
  #11  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,718
Originally Posted by bocastephen View Post
On the bright side - if Obama takes the Presidency, the most likely candidate for Secretary of Homeland Security is an individual who is known for having an interest in protecting civil liberties and privacy -
Is that name public or something you can reveal? (I'm not at all enthused about an Obama Presidency, except for this issue, on which the hope of some action or change in mentality could warm me up quite a bit.)
studentff is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:49 am
  #12  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 126
I'm glad this is coming out now. Perhaps the media will pick up on it, the American people will wise up, and perhaps, in 12 days, they'll vote in some new politicians who will stop this nonsense.

I'm not sure what they want to replace the Constitution with....the Bible or the Neo-Conservative manifesto. Or a combination of the two.
fbrown627 is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:51 am
  #13  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: DFW
Posts: 23,198
Question

Originally Posted by doober View Post
I can become dyslexic very easily.
I always get confused when stating dates, military style, american style or eurpoean syle.

I think I may be very confused for the next year or so. Old age, don't ya know. Think I will also adopt the Icelandic naming conventions for all future records.
Boggie Dog is online now  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:54 am
  #14  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,718
Originally Posted by bfetch View Post
Again, what's the harm in lying to the airline about your birthdate if pressed for it? Not like they're a federal agent or anything that could get you in trouble legally.
If airline checkin agents are required to verify and correct DOB from photo-ID when they see it, then lying won't do any good unless you can always avoid actually showing your ID to an airline employee. Once the airline gets a DOB linked to your FF account, especially if verified by an employee, it will probably be hard to change. I've been known to occasionally check a bag, and I've been known to frequently change my flight at the checkin counter due to standby or irregular ops, and both seem to trigger a photo-ID check (at least on UA).

Oh, and I can see TSA's solution to "close" the lying loophole. Print your DOB on your boarding pass, and make the TDC verify it just like your name. It's not like TSA cares at all about passenger identity-theft vulnerability anyway.
studentff is offline  
Old Oct 22, 08, 10:55 am
  #15  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 57
Not to devolve this to an Omni thread...

Originally Posted by studentff View Post
Is that name public or something you can reveal? (I'm not at all enthused about an Obama Presidency, except for this issue, on which the hope of some action or change in mentality could warm me up quite a bit.)
But whether you're enthused abou a candidate or not I'd think it's rather plain that the GOP's attitude towards terrorism and "Protectin' Amurikah" would be a stronger, more harsh crackdown on any perceived allowance of civil liberties when 'homeland security' (puke) is involved.

The fact the Democratic candidate hasn't been explicit in how he intends to handle terrorism vis-a-vis civil liberties doesn't mean he intends to follow the same blindly laid path of Skeletor & his minions.

Granted, if he does post-election victory then there's definitely a reason there to not support him in his re-election bid in 2012 studentff.



But I am curious who bocastephen is intimating with his statement...Conyers? Bill Richardson? Dodd?
bfetch is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread