Boarding Lane Etiquette
Mar 12, 2007, 3:50 pm
#46
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Home
Posts: 2,707
Actually, I'd like to add to my response:
The idea of cutting in line simply because you're elite...welll, it's:
"A perfect example of a "me! me! me!" response. I like this, I don't like that...
The idea of this thread was not just about feet on someone else's armrest, or banging on a chair (or going in front of people in line)... it's about respect for others - something that after all these posts you still haven't gotten (much like you haven't gotten the "sleeping on the plane" idea). ....This is about the 20-30 pax around you and having some respect for them. It's the idea of not doing onto others what you wouldn't want done to you. If we all make small efforts to respect each other flying can be a great experience for everyone. If, on the other hand, you have no consideration for other pax because YOU want to put YOUR feet up, or tap your feet, or keep the window shade open (or pull rank to cut in line) in utter disregard for other pax - that's when you become the passenger that all of us respectful...flyers resent."
The idea of cutting in line simply because you're elite...welll, it's:
"A perfect example of a "me! me! me!" response. I like this, I don't like that...
The idea of this thread was not just about feet on someone else's armrest, or banging on a chair (or going in front of people in line)... it's about respect for others - something that after all these posts you still haven't gotten (much like you haven't gotten the "sleeping on the plane" idea). ....This is about the 20-30 pax around you and having some respect for them. It's the idea of not doing onto others what you wouldn't want done to you. If we all make small efforts to respect each other flying can be a great experience for everyone. If, on the other hand, you have no consideration for other pax because YOU want to put YOUR feet up, or tap your feet, or keep the window shade open (or pull rank to cut in line) in utter disregard for other pax - that's when you become the passenger that all of us respectful...flyers resent."
Secondly, if you are not happy with the situation you have a couple of choices. Either fly enough to earn elite rank on Northwest where you can take advantage of this perk (or not - if you prefer), or continue to stand in the economy line.
Mar 12, 2007, 3:51 pm
#47
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 386
FC always boards first, then when no more FCs are available for boarding, switch to elite line, when elite line is empty, switch to general line, when elite walks up on red carpet, scan him on next scan. Over time, it will become natural behavior.
Mar 12, 2007, 3:55 pm
#48
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Cows in Berkeley?....Moooo!
Programs: Fly Amtrak, Go Greyhound! I'm often wrong but always sincere.
Posts: 7,102
I use this perk a LOT....as I never check baggage and dont want my overhead filled by Y pax in row 27 who puts his backpack in the first available bin.
Now, to throw a twist into this...what happens when the g/a calls F and elites and both sides are filled? I have seen this a few times...and the pax on the elite side at once had acted as if their elite was better then other pax elite!!!
Now, to throw a twist into this...what happens when the g/a calls F and elites and both sides are filled? I have seen this a few times...and the pax on the elite side at once had acted as if their elite was better then other pax elite!!!
The whole issue seems pretty simple to me. Open elite line first, open general boarding second, keep elite lane open throughout boarding process, period. Works for Continental very well!
Mar 12, 2007, 3:57 pm
#49
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: MSP
Programs: Lapsed DL North PE, now nothing
Posts: 701
For me there is something just plain wrong with cutting in line. I see it differently than other perks although I do understand that others do not. The only time I would find "cutting" acceptable would be for someone who is infirm or handicapped, and really is suffering by waiting for the rest of the queue. Otherwise, It just seems wrong for any airline to offer this as a "perk" to their customers, regardless of how much they spend.
Does anyone know if this practice occurs in the UK? The English are so intense about their queuing that I would imagine a chorus of "tsk, tsk" if some elite member tried to make use of it.
Perhaps this is just cultural? To some people, because it is a published perk it is acceptable. For others, including myself, it is never acceptable and shouldn't be a perk.
Does anyone know if this practice occurs in the UK? The English are so intense about their queuing that I would imagine a chorus of "tsk, tsk" if some elite member tried to make use of it.
Perhaps this is just cultural? To some people, because it is a published perk it is acceptable. For others, including myself, it is never acceptable and shouldn't be a perk.
Mar 12, 2007, 3:59 pm
#50
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Michigan's west coast
Programs: Delta Skymiles PM
Posts: 97
All I can say is:
To NW get it right ! It's called education/training of your people.
To the one's who don't like it...then don't use it and quit complaining about the one's that do.
To non-elites in line too bad you must really have a problem when FC is called first and you probably don't understand that procedure either.
To one's who don't use because they don't think it's right or fair do you also say no to your EUA's as well ?
Personally it's just another perk that I have spent time, energy and money to earn and I think that's worth something. As a rule I always do my best to be at the gate when called. However there have been times with a short connection time or late arrival that I'm thankful for this perk.
To NW get it right ! It's called education/training of your people.
To the one's who don't like it...then don't use it and quit complaining about the one's that do.
To non-elites in line too bad you must really have a problem when FC is called first and you probably don't understand that procedure either.
To one's who don't use because they don't think it's right or fair do you also say no to your EUA's as well ?
Personally it's just another perk that I have spent time, energy and money to earn and I think that's worth something. As a rule I always do my best to be at the gate when called. However there have been times with a short connection time or late arrival that I'm thankful for this perk.
Mar 12, 2007, 4:32 pm
#51
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: MSP
Programs: Fallen Plats, ex-WN CP, DYKWIW; still PAL Premier Elite & Hilton Diamond
Posts: 25,419
They're in their line, we're in ours. No one is "cutting".
As far as the UK (where NW has how few flights/day?) is concerned, I don't care.
The elite lines are well (even better) implemented in AMS where they come between the non-elite line & BP scanner. In AMS elites (at least Golds and Plats, never tried it as a Silver) can also use the roped-off WBC entry point and avoid the long lines for the stupid questions at the pre-gate screening.
As far as the UK (where NW has how few flights/day?) is concerned, I don't care.
The elite lines are well (even better) implemented in AMS where they come between the non-elite line & BP scanner. In AMS elites (at least Golds and Plats, never tried it as a Silver) can also use the roped-off WBC entry point and avoid the long lines for the stupid questions at the pre-gate screening.
For me there is something just plain wrong with cutting in line. I see it differently than other perks although I do understand that others do not. The only time I would find "cutting" acceptable would be for someone who is infirm or handicapped, and really is suffering by waiting for the rest of the queue. Otherwise, It just seems wrong for any airline to offer this as a "perk" to their customers, regardless of how much they spend.
Does anyone know if this practice occurs in the UK? The English are so intense about their queuing that I would imagine a chorus of "tsk, tsk" if some elite member tried to make use of it.
Perhaps this is just cultural? To some people, because it is a published perk it is acceptable. For others, including myself, it is never acceptable and shouldn't be a perk.
Does anyone know if this practice occurs in the UK? The English are so intense about their queuing that I would imagine a chorus of "tsk, tsk" if some elite member tried to make use of it.
Perhaps this is just cultural? To some people, because it is a published perk it is acceptable. For others, including myself, it is never acceptable and shouldn't be a perk.
Last edited by MikeMpls; Mar 12, 2007 at 4:40 pm
Mar 12, 2007, 4:53 pm
#52
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: LAX/BOS/HKG/AMS/SFO...hmm, I need a life.
Programs: United1K, AA ExPlAAt, DL MM/Gold, Hilton Diamond, Avis First
Posts: 13,316
Actually, I'd like to add to my response:
The idea of cutting in line simply because you're elite...welll, it's:
"A perfect example of a "me! me! me!" response. I like this, I don't like that...
The idea of this thread was not just about feet on someone else's armrest, or banging on a chair (or going in front of people in line)... it's about respect for others - something that after all these posts you still haven't gotten (much like you haven't gotten the "sleeping on the plane" idea). ....This is about the 20-30 pax around you and having some respect for them. It's the idea of not doing onto others what you wouldn't want done to you. If we all make small efforts to respect each other flying can be a great experience for everyone. If, on the other hand, you have no consideration for other pax because YOU want to put YOUR feet up, or tap your feet, or keep the window shade open (or pull rank to cut in line) in utter disregard for other pax - that's when you become the passenger that all of us respectful...flyers resent."
The idea of cutting in line simply because you're elite...welll, it's:
"A perfect example of a "me! me! me!" response. I like this, I don't like that...
The idea of this thread was not just about feet on someone else's armrest, or banging on a chair (or going in front of people in line)... it's about respect for others - something that after all these posts you still haven't gotten (much like you haven't gotten the "sleeping on the plane" idea). ....This is about the 20-30 pax around you and having some respect for them. It's the idea of not doing onto others what you wouldn't want done to you. If we all make small efforts to respect each other flying can be a great experience for everyone. If, on the other hand, you have no consideration for other pax because YOU want to put YOUR feet up, or tap your feet, or keep the window shade open (or pull rank to cut in line) in utter disregard for other pax - that's when you become the passenger that all of us respectful...flyers resent."
Mar 12, 2007, 4:56 pm
#53
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: MSP
Programs: Lapsed DL North PE, now nothing
Posts: 701
My point was that our differences may be cultural, and for that reason it is of interest how they treat this in the UK. We are talking about etiquette here, which is a cultural thing. IMHO, what they do at AMS is of less interesting as to my knowledge Holland is not nearly as queue-obsessed as the UK. The UK makes a useful extreme for comparison purposes.
While there clearly are at times "two lines" it would seem logical that most people (whether by ignorance, or not) would see this practice as cutting into a line that has a single endpoint: the airplane. I haven't taken a survey, but this seems a likely outcome. And although you are not responsible for their ignorance, and may not care how they feel, by cutting in line as allowed you are likely creating resentment. If you don't care, you don't care. I do care, and I won't do it.
While there clearly are at times "two lines" it would seem logical that most people (whether by ignorance, or not) would see this practice as cutting into a line that has a single endpoint: the airplane. I haven't taken a survey, but this seems a likely outcome. And although you are not responsible for their ignorance, and may not care how they feel, by cutting in line as allowed you are likely creating resentment. If you don't care, you don't care. I do care, and I won't do it.
Mar 12, 2007, 4:58 pm
#54
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: RHI. The Northwoods.
Programs: Everything and everywhere. Officially a nomad
Posts: 1,125
Mar 12, 2007, 5:04 pm
#55
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 386
If you know about it, and don't like it, don't fly NW.
If you know about it, and do like it, fly NW.
Either way, a pax accepts it (implied consent) because he/she continues to give NW money by using their service.
It is acceptable because it ain't against the law, and potential pax know the terms in advance and have ultimately chosen to fly NW.
It's the same fairness in that some folks get a 5% rate on a loan and other's 18%. They signed up for the agreement. It is only unfair when one party changes the contract terms after the other party signed up. Which incidently, is similar to what happens when NW GA's fail to recognize the elite line or process it accordingly.
Mar 12, 2007, 5:06 pm
#56
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: MSP
Programs: Fallen Plats, ex-WN CP, DYKWIW; still PAL Premier Elite & Hilton Diamond
Posts: 25,419
The transition from the departure lounge into the jetway tended to be a free-for-all because the employees positioned to monitor it had no teeth. Last time I was there (Oct. 31) it was improved a bit because the had added staff at the jetways to deal with duty free liquids.
Mar 12, 2007, 5:06 pm
#57
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: MSP
Programs: Lapsed DL North PE, now nothing
Posts: 701
Let me address the question about why the cutting perk is different than pre-boarding, EUA, FC, pre-boarding drinks, etc.
(1) Pre-boarding. The GA makes a general announcement indicating that elites may pre-board. This is clearly stated and the average person can understand it.
(2) All FC and EUA related perks are also easy to understand. As far as people in the gate know, you may have purchased those services. You were given a ticket with that info on it. It is generally understood that FC costs more, and that you get more when you pay more. Again, easy to understand.
Being able to jump to the head of the queue due to status is not explained by the GA and, as the OP showed us, not necessarily even understood. It is reasonable to conclude that many in the line do not understand why you get to go first. It is easy to conclude that they may be offended by something that is culturally offensive in many other settings. Again, their ignorance is not your fault and you may not care.
(1) Pre-boarding. The GA makes a general announcement indicating that elites may pre-board. This is clearly stated and the average person can understand it.
(2) All FC and EUA related perks are also easy to understand. As far as people in the gate know, you may have purchased those services. You were given a ticket with that info on it. It is generally understood that FC costs more, and that you get more when you pay more. Again, easy to understand.
Being able to jump to the head of the queue due to status is not explained by the GA and, as the OP showed us, not necessarily even understood. It is reasonable to conclude that many in the line do not understand why you get to go first. It is easy to conclude that they may be offended by something that is culturally offensive in many other settings. Again, their ignorance is not your fault and you may not care.
Mar 12, 2007, 5:11 pm
#58
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: MSP
Programs: Lapsed DL North PE, now nothing
Posts: 701
I actually have to leave to catch a flight so I can't discuss this with you in detail. But your quote above is exactly why I couldn't disagree with you more. I see a difference between what is legal/illegal and what is right/wrong. In my eyes this is a right/wrong situation. Implied consent doesn't mean I have to like it.
Mar 12, 2007, 5:13 pm
#59
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 386
Being able to jump to the head of the queue due to status is not explained by the GA and, as the OP showed us, not necessarily even understood. It is reasonable to conclude that many in the line do not understand why you get to go first. It is easy to conclude that they may be offended by something that is culturally offensive in many other settings. Again, their ignorance is not your fault and you may not care.
It is why I don't use the elite carpet (mainly due to GA's sporadic behavior which is a contributing factor to pax misunderstanding). A person having to plead with a GA for line treatment does not a perk make. A perk should reduce my stress, not the other way around.
It is the flaw that NW must to correct to make the program a success.
Mar 12, 2007, 5:16 pm
#60
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 386
I actually have to leave to catch a flight so I can't discuss this with you in detail. But your quote above is exactly why I couldn't disagree with you more. I see a difference between what is legal/illegal and what is right/wrong. In my eyes this is a right/wrong situation. Implied consent doesn't mean I have to like it.
We each signed up for it.
I fly out tomorow and I won't be using the line either, but for differing reasons.
Have a good flight!