marriott charges resort fees and parking for award stays though. Marriott also has a history of devaluing their points much faster than any other program.

Marriott also has hundreds of nice and/or convenient hotels I want to visit, which is the most important consideration here. I think the point is it�s best to try to earn and redeem in all three major hotel currencies. The best way for Hyatt is Chase, Hilton is either Amex or hotel stays (buying points outright at .5 cents also works), Marriott is hotel stays

I know we're on the Hyatt forum, but some people really seem to disregard this. There are SO MANY wonderful Marriott properties - yes, there are many more games at the corporate level, but still, it's the hotels where we're resting our heads, not the conference rooms of executives.

Sure, if you're only looking at the biggest US markets, you might think Hyatt wins. In my opinion, Hyatt wins pretty easily in NYC, but Marriott has solid options, too, at the higher end. But, in another large market, San Francisco, Marriott blasts Hyatt out of the water with great properties like the St. Regis, Palace, Westin St. Francis, and Marriott Union Square. All Hyatt has in SF are a couple of Hyatt Regencies, a poorly-reviewed Grand Hyatt, and a really nice airport hotel. Hyatt is known to be sorely lacking in choices in LA. Hyatt's situation in Boston is ridiculously bad. Chicago is more of a wash - lots of good Marriott and Hyatt properties. Hyatt is lacking across Florida, except for The Confidante and Grand Cypress. In my opinion, these larger markets suffer from the lack of true high-end Hyatt options. The fact that there are only 3 urban PHs in the US is ridiculous. The Thompson brand helps, but Hyatt really needs to expand its luxury footprint in urban markets, rather than focus solely on resort expansion in California.

If we open it up wider to smaller cities, the only cities that come up to mind where Hyatt likely wins are Denver (lots of good choices) and Wichita (the well-reviewed HR seems to beat out an odd lack of Marriott choices).

I haven't had a reason to do a mass transfer from Chase, but that day may be coming. "Historically" I'd planned to use Chase points to transfer to SQ (or possibly BA, depending on the exact situation), but the pandemic blew all of that up (I haven't had a reason to fly overseas since 2019, and a specific planned use of points/miles for late in 2020 [helping family attend a wedding in India] didn't materialize so I've ended up with some larger-than-planned balances floating around in various places).

Yeah, I'd agree with this. I live in SF, and if I didn't, you couldn't pay me to stay at some of the Hyatts in this city--all overpriced and underwhelming (they suck). It's telling that the only Hyatt in SF I'd ever consider staying at is at the airport.

HNL comes to mind where, in my view, all the Hyatts there are just horrible. No idea if Marriotts would be better, but it can't be worse. Suffice it to say, I will never stay at a Hyatt anywhere in HI again, and just pay the king's ransom for something where at least I know I'll be getting something for my money.

PS - I did try the Hilton Waikiki Village or something - that was much better than any Hyatts.

1. The Marriotts in HNL are much better.
2. The lack in SF seems to be more of a consequence of Hyatt focusing more on expanding their resorts that are prohibitively hard to get to, especially with constant fires.

The point of my post was to look at Hyatt from the lens of someone international who might be more likely to only travel to the largest US markets. I think the domestic crowd probably knows how and where Hyatt lacks. Giving this a solid thought in the shower, I'm still not sure how anyone could defend Hyatt's footprint. There is such room for improvement - they really should invite me to a development meeting.

Of course, I'd agree with you here.

Obviously, by my actions the WOH program suits my needs better than the others, which isn't to say it will for others. I learned a long time ago that the art of negotiation often entails offering the other party something they value where you don't to leverage the best possible result--in my case, it's the footprint, or lack thereof. Naturally, anyone for whom the footprint matters--or if your travel is primarily HNL or SFO--I'd imagine any other program would likely yield better results than Hyatt's.

I suppose that being a Hyatt loyalist (again, I'm using this word very loosely here) doesn't mean I'd turn a blind eye to their shortcomings either. I'm from the school where one ought not mince words and just tell it like it is. And, when a brand--Hyatt or otherwise--falls short, I'm certainly not going to pretend it doesn't.

Many don't understand me and you wont be the first or the last
It was a generalization about overpricing redemption's aggressively.3 x plus the cost of inflation is a big deal IMO if you put that in perspective.
Not a direct comparison of best or worst programs.
Hyatt to their credit for the moment has award pricing that will be about the same now as most others on aspirational properties cat 7 etc
Just to be clear this was not meant to be at all a post saying I hate Hyatt's program.I'm a huge fan.

We all earn or transfer our points in a variety of different ways.There are numerous examples where an airport property is 12,500 points with Marriott
in a full service property vs Hyatt House @ 8 to 10k
Marriott wins hands down for elites.There is simply no one program that has it all.One should keep an open mind.
Diversifying by having various programs to redeem from makes all the difference in the world
In some of the lesser major markets I still see very good value with Hyatt over others. However value too can be perceived very differently by everyone

Diversification is key!

The challenge is for people who are at the cusp of reaching Globalist. In those cases, I think it's worth suffering through a few mediocre stays to achieve it. Otherwise, the Explorist tier is a joke (esp with club closures).

I have been a free agent for years, until Hyatt made it ridiculously easy to become a Globalist last year. I will enjoy it while I can, and as much as I love being a Globalist with Hyatt, I recognize that experience without it is probably no different than if I were staying at the other chains.

For my purposes, the shifting of some Cat 7s to Cat 8s (didn't they say this wouldn't happen?) repricing from 25K - 30K to now 40K - 45K is a pretty big friggin deal. So, how's that off peak crap working out for the aforementioned Cat 7s to 8s? Good? At least when WOH was just focusing on the PC branding, it was just corny and didn't actually cost me anything tangible. Now, it has.

PS - Oh, even forgot about PH Sydney going to Cat 8. Probably forgot about many others since the past couple of years I've been more of an Isolationist than a Globalist.

Reaching lifetime Globalist status years ago was a major turning point
as was turning lifetime Titanium at Marriott
It allowed me to become a free equal opportunity agent with no pressure to achieve status
just like Lifetime Plat status with American
If I was starting out in my 20s now I wouldn’t bother reaching lifetime status unless my company was reimbursing
However if I were close by all means then I highly recommend going for it.
The pressure to earn status goes away and you enjoy more often than not where you stay
because you chose for experience not trying to reach a night threshold

The other reason I remain a Hyatt fan when I travel is trust.When a stay has been bloody awful they have almost always stepped in and had my back
For that reason alone I may choose Hyatt over others if I may be uncertain what I am getting elsewhere
It’s stressful when any hotel ruins your stay

Hard agree with 777 on this - Hyatt Corporate has been great for me in regards to resolving issues. Friendly and efficient and generous. Although, truthfully, I have also experienced the same with Marriott generally.

IMO the lack of any material improvements in the program for such a massive devaluation
clears the runway to stay less with Hyatt
Don’t plan to be hitting the 100 nights a year routinely like the good old pre pandemic days

They have made redemption less desirable
and made me lose interest in the major draw breakfast as clubs closed & restaraunt offerings
have declined since the pandemic at least for now
Despite my disliking IHG I had some great opportunity with Kimpton and InterCons in the past few months
with deeply discounted reward redemptions @ 20% off and 4th night free over the past number of months.
Elite Status is offered to anyone with a pulse that is still breathing much like Hilton

Aa for Park Hyatt Sydney the higher redemption cost going forward and the current word on the street
of a new less WOH friendly management has me likely not returning very soon

Appreciate the echoing of my thoughts.I find Marriott incredibly stressful to do business with
even before I get to their hotels
In the event of a failed stay with Marriott I’ve had to call corporate execs to step in to fix issues
who have been thier decades
Something I’ve almost never had to do at Hyatt

After the SPG merger Marriott elite customer service never recovered in my experiences
.But some of their hotels are must stays like the Sheraton Grand in Sydney
where I would argue outperforms for my needs the Park Hyatt Sydney for a fraction
of the price and redemption costs.Getting a suite upgrade is fairly easy too on average

My passion for the Park Hyatt Sydney was it’s unique setting and a passionate previous
management and team devoted
to the guest experience who have all since moved on sadly.I anxiously await updates from
the Hyatt community here on this iconic property otherwise

For me, dealing with Marriott in any way has been disappointing, at best. I'm still unsure how it is one is consistently charged for cancelled reservations, resulting in an unfortunate and regrettable incident with a property in HK where I had to threaten a chargeback unless my card was credited within 48 hours. While the property in question certainly weren't to blame and they'd probably assumed I was making it up to get out of the reservation, it nonetheless created a needless conflict where I'll likely never return to that property, given how face is important for dealings in SE Asia. This I blame entirely on Marriott and, personally, I've gained virtually nothing from their takeover of SPG--zero. Oh, wait, I did take advantage of one of their travel deals where I had been able to get some bonus UA miles or something, and just let the hotel portion expire.

Yeah, agree with you here. The PH Sydney was, had been, fabulous and one of the few properties where my family absolutely adored. Now, I suppose I'd consider paying $$ for it, but not after some of the stuff I've read on here. Perhaps, I'll, assuming the Cat 7 free night is adjusted to include 8s, try it and see for myself how bad the erosion has been. Also, the Sheraton CDG is one where I'll pay $$ just to stay in the airport, and I still think I'm Bonvoy Plat or something.