Delta/KLM to codeshare with Jet Airways (9W) to/from India
Dec 15, 2015, 8:57 am
#16
Join Date: Aug 2013
Programs: UA- 1K, DL-DM, AA-G, BON-T
Posts: 337
I think SkyTeam ++ (ie., VS,9W) should have ONE European hub. Now there are more hubs than Indian destinations.
I think DL as an adult should decide between KL/AF/VS/9W who will serve India.
Goal should be to serve more US-India one-stop options. Not to have more transit hubs.
Indian passengers like things in this order.
1) Young FAs(of particular type),
2) Non-stop/one-stop to their own City (they don't like to stop at another Indian hub)
3) Latest Hollywood Movies
4) Low fares (low priority)
5) Good food (low priority)
This is the prime reason ME3 are successful and every one else is failing.
For US/EU legacies to capture that market you have to serve non-stop to their city with Young FAs and IFE loaded with latest Hollywood movies.
IMHO VS is the only carrier has chance to do well in India. LGW is better because it is cheaper than LHR.
I think DL as an adult should decide between KL/AF/VS/9W who will serve India.
Goal should be to serve more US-India one-stop options. Not to have more transit hubs.
Indian passengers like things in this order.
1) Young FAs(of particular type),
2) Non-stop/one-stop to their own City (they don't like to stop at another Indian hub)
3) Latest Hollywood Movies
4) Low fares (low priority)
5) Good food (low priority)
This is the prime reason ME3 are successful and every one else is failing.
For US/EU legacies to capture that market you have to serve non-stop to their city with Young FAs and IFE loaded with latest Hollywood movies.
IMHO VS is the only carrier has chance to do well in India. LGW is better because it is cheaper than LHR.
Dec 15, 2015, 9:10 am
#17
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: New York, New York
Programs: AA Gold, Alaska MVP; Free Agent Super Duper Diamond Treasure Chest ;)
Posts: 4,682
Dec 15, 2015, 9:19 am
#18
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: New York, New York
Programs: AA Gold, Alaska MVP; Free Agent Super Duper Diamond Treasure Chest ;)
Posts: 4,682
Wow these are some sweeping generalization. I would say in general Indians want FAs that are caring, nice and understand service (i.e. asking for something doesn't mean the FA is doing them a favor). They want to be treated with respect at the connection point (this was always AF's big issue - Indian pax to the US are usually highly educated and reasonable affluent - the thought of people confined in an airport over night during IRROPs because the government thinks they are going to stay illegally to clean toilets shocks middle class indians. And I totally disagree on just one hub for BOM & DEL (other sites totally agreed). But BOM and Del need at least a nonstop connection to CDG, AMS and LON. Skyteam needs to offer options. The days of indians being happy to depart at 2:30am are over. Some want it some don't. The evening 9W CDG-BOM flight is great for people finishing business in Europe
I am one of those who really liked DL's late night departure from BOM, though. One arrived at the airport after a nice dinner, get on the flight, connect in AMS and be in NYC by early afternoon. Very convenient.
I miss that flight.
Dec 15, 2015, 10:55 am
#19
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 430
Wow these are some sweeping generalization. I would say in general Indians want FAs that are caring, nice and understand service (i.e. asking for something doesn't mean the FA is doing them a favor). They want to be treated with respect at the connection point (this was always AF's big issue - Indian pax to the US are usually highly educated and reasonable affluent - the thought of people confined in an airport over night during IRROPs because the government thinks they are going to stay illegally to clean toilets shocks middle class indians. And I totally disagree on just one hub for BOM & DEL (other sites totally agreed). But BOM and Del need at least a nonstop connection to CDG, AMS and LON. Skyteam needs to offer options. The days of indians being happy to depart at 2:30am are over. Some want it some don't. The evening 9W CDG-BOM flight is great for people finishing business in Europe
Not all ME3 planes are new, mostly those on turn around flights to subcontinent are very old 772s/332s. Indian carriers have brand new planes.
Food service always not great, there are frequent complaints about lack of choices on ME3. Indian carriers seems to do better with food service.
ME3 airports are congested with long layovers and IROPS handling is no better. Indian airports are winning all awards, yet Indians complain about their own airports.
AF may be saving few Euros by saying French immigration didn't issue transit visa to Indians, but Indians are not treated any better by UAE/Qatar immigration.
All I am saying VS is better equipped to compete with ME3 and DL should concentrate just on VS. They have new 787s. FAs are good.
VS already has service to DEL and BOM. VS or 9W can start service to other larger cities in India.
AF serving India is absolute waste. No one is going to miss KL either. TUI (arke) may be better option if AMS hub is a must.
If KL couldn't operate an MD11 to Indian stations, something is wrong with their cost structure, nothing to do with yields. India is a developing country, so don't expect high yields.
If EU3 lost their way to India, let EuroWings, Norwegian, TUI or Thomson take over, why drag this issue forever.
Dec 15, 2015, 12:48 pm
#21
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: New York, New York
Programs: AA Gold, Alaska MVP; Free Agent Super Duper Diamond Treasure Chest ;)
Posts: 4,682
Dec 16, 2015, 6:48 am
#22
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 430
Just stop reading 1969 Farmer's Almanac and read latest news.
AFAIK DEL,BOM,BLR,HYD and CCU have most modern terminals and won awards more than once. MAA also has modern terminal but of seems to suffer from quality issues. All are built over last few years.
When was the last time US or Europe built a new terminal???
AFAIK DEL,BOM,BLR,HYD and CCU have most modern terminals and won awards more than once. MAA also has modern terminal but of seems to suffer from quality issues. All are built over last few years.
When was the last time US or Europe built a new terminal???
Dec 16, 2015, 7:04 am
#23
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: LHR
Programs: DL DM 2MM, BA Bronze, Various Hotels
Posts: 10,187
Just stop reading 1969 Farmer's Almanac and read latest news.
AFAIK DEL,BOM,BLR,HYD and CCU have most modern terminals and won awards more than once. MAA also has modern terminal but of seems to suffer from quality issues. All are built over last few years.
When was the last time US or Europe built a new terminal???
AFAIK DEL,BOM,BLR,HYD and CCU have most modern terminals and won awards more than once. MAA also has modern terminal but of seems to suffer from quality issues. All are built over last few years.
When was the last time US or Europe built a new terminal???
Dec 16, 2015, 7:49 am
#24
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: CMH/CVG
Programs: DL
Posts: 484
Anyone seen the timing of the new 9W flight AMS-DEL? Hoping it gets in early enough to make onward connections in India instead of having to overnight like the current AF and KL options. Much prefer going through DEL over BOM, but the overnight is no fun.
Dec 16, 2015, 8:10 am
#25
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: New York, New York
Programs: AA Gold, Alaska MVP; Free Agent Super Duper Diamond Treasure Chest ;)
Posts: 4,682
Its a late evening arrival and early a.m. departure. Not much good for connecting on the arrival.
Dec 16, 2015, 8:38 am
#26
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,417
SIN T3 is also fairly new. IIRC there are newish secondary airports near IST, SVO, KUL, and BKK. Duluth, Green Bay, and Milwaukee have new(ish) terminals; I think the same is true of GSP. Parts of SAN and RDU are new.
Dec 16, 2015, 9:43 am
#29
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL/DFW
Programs: Delta PM, SPG Platinum, Marriott Titanium, AVIS Preferred Plus
Posts: 388
Just stop reading 1969 Farmer's Almanac and read latest news.
AFAIK DEL,BOM,BLR,HYD and CCU have most modern terminals and won awards more than once. MAA also has modern terminal but of seems to suffer from quality issues. All are built over last few years.
When was the last time US or Europe built a new terminal???
AFAIK DEL,BOM,BLR,HYD and CCU have most modern terminals and won awards more than once. MAA also has modern terminal but of seems to suffer from quality issues. All are built over last few years.
When was the last time US or Europe built a new terminal???
Why can't we have direct flights from JFK to BOM, DEL and MAA?
Dec 16, 2015, 9:44 am
#30
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 430
We have a winner here. Berlin puts entire advanced western industrial world to shame.
DTW is almost 20 year old. ATL F is a 10+ gate extension. Not a great achievement. Sure airlines can hub everyone in the south through Atlanta to achieve the number, it doesn't make the airport better.
What about LGA? Is there is an award for an airport hosting most homeless?
When will LHR get third runway? 50 years later. T5 was conceived in 1985, started in 2002 and completed in 2012, Euros 4.3 Billion.
Developing countries are doing much better with aviation infrastructure than developed nations. There is no way spin it.
DTW is almost 20 year old. ATL F is a 10+ gate extension. Not a great achievement. Sure airlines can hub everyone in the south through Atlanta to achieve the number, it doesn't make the airport better.
What about LGA? Is there is an award for an airport hosting most homeless?
When will LHR get third runway? 50 years later. T5 was conceived in 1985, started in 2002 and completed in 2012, Euros 4.3 Billion.
Developing countries are doing much better with aviation infrastructure than developed nations. There is no way spin it.