Latest 717 rumor: DL deal in place
May 22, 2012, 2:20 pm
#136
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Nice if you can get seats A and C if you're traveling in a pair.At 31" my knees touch the (non-reclined) seat in front of me and it is VERY uncomfortable if the seat is reclined. At 30" my knees are buried into the seatback and the person in front of me is physically unable to recline.
I'm VERY glad DL is taking out a row of seats to turn what was an FL torture chamber into a pleasant DL experience. GREAT call Delta!
May 22, 2012, 2:24 pm
#137
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Just found this earlier before reading this thread.
http://www.bizjournals.com/mobile/da...html?ana=yfcpc
http://www.bizjournals.com/mobile/da...html?ana=yfcpc
May 22, 2012, 2:27 pm
#138
Join Date: Dec 2009
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Not sure what the height cutoff is, but at 6'5" the difference between a 30" pitch and a 31" pitch is HUGE.
At 31" my knees touch the (non-reclined) seat in front of me and it is VERY uncomfortable if the seat is reclined. At 30" my knees are buried into the seatback and the person in front of me is physically unable to recline.
I'm VERY glad DL is taking out a row of seats to turn what was an FL torture chamber into a pleasant DL experience. GREAT call Delta!
At 31" my knees touch the (non-reclined) seat in front of me and it is VERY uncomfortable if the seat is reclined. At 30" my knees are buried into the seatback and the person in front of me is physically unable to recline.
I'm VERY glad DL is taking out a row of seats to turn what was an FL torture chamber into a pleasant DL experience. GREAT call Delta!
Anyway, I still like the 717!
May 22, 2012, 2:28 pm
#139
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Will 3-4 CR2 flights be replaced with only 2 717s? They seat 110, so if it is truly capacity-neutral, it would seem that some smaller outposts will be negatively impacted by this change, even while they are upgraded to 2-class flights.
On the other hand, routes like DTW-ORD, ORD-ATL, ATL-DTW (which currently use a mix of MDs and DC9s), could possibly see an INCREASE in frequency if 717s replace the larger planes on these routes.
It will certainly be interesting to see how this "capacity-neutral" transition plays out!
May 22, 2012, 2:39 pm
#140
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So the real question is, if these are replacing CR2s and DC9s ON A CAPACITY-NEUTRAL BASIS (as the press release indicated they would be), what will be the impact on route frequencies that are currently served predominately by the planes that are being replaced?
Will 3-4 CR2 flights be replaced with only 2 717s? They seat 110, so if it is truly capacity-neutral, it would seem that some smaller outposts will be negatively impacted by this change, even while they are upgraded to 2-class flights.
On the other hand, routes like DTW-ORD, ORD-ATL, ATL-DTW (which currently use a mix of MDs and DC9s), could possibly see an INCREASE in frequency if 717s replace the larger planes on these routes.
It will certainly be interesting to see how this "capacity-neutral" transition plays out!
Will 3-4 CR2 flights be replaced with only 2 717s? They seat 110, so if it is truly capacity-neutral, it would seem that some smaller outposts will be negatively impacted by this change, even while they are upgraded to 2-class flights.
On the other hand, routes like DTW-ORD, ORD-ATL, ATL-DTW (which currently use a mix of MDs and DC9s), could possibly see an INCREASE in frequency if 717s replace the larger planes on these routes.
It will certainly be interesting to see how this "capacity-neutral" transition plays out!
ExpressJet™ Canadair Regional Jet 200 (CRJ) 1,496 50 Jet
Canadair Regional Jet 700 (CR7) 1,939 65 Jet
Canadair Regional Jet 900 (CR9) 2,104 76 Jet
Chautauqua Embraer 145 (ERJ) 1,956 50 Jet
Comair® Canadair Regional Jet 200 (CRJ) 1,496 50 Jet
Canadair Regional Jet 700 (CR7) 1,939 65 Jet
Canadair Regional Jet 900 (CR9) 2,104 76 Jet
Compass Airlines Embraer 170 (E70) 1,956 69 Jet
Embraer 175 (E75) 2,416 76 Jet
GoJet Canadair Regional Jet 700 (CR7) 1,939 65 Jet
Pinnacle Canadair Regional Jet 200 (CRJ) 1,496 50 Jet
Canadair Regional Jet 900 (CR9) 2,104 76 Jet
Shuttle America Embraer 170 (E70) 1,956 69 Jet
Embraer 175 (E75) 2,416 76 Jet
SkyWest Canadair Regional Jet 200 (CRJ) 1,496 50 Jet
Canadair Regional Jet 700 (CR7) 1,939 65 Jet
Canadair Regional Jet 900 (CR9) 2,104 76 Jet
Embraer 120 Brasilia (EM2) 1,496 30 Turboprop
Those are the regional flights. Apparently they will be migrating some routes to these 717s for more passengers and be flying more of the larger seating regionals.
All good for consumers and the airline alike for the most part. But smaller airports will likely see cutbacks even further as likely do pull out of more markets.
Last edited by adamj023; May 22, 2012 at 2:48 pm
May 22, 2012, 2:43 pm
#141
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Long live DC-9!!!! ^^^
May 22, 2012, 2:50 pm
#142
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Delta has Embraers in its regional flights which are excellent. And yes I presume as well the 717s will take over for the CRJ's and perhaps other types of craft that are remaining.
Apparently they will be migrating some routes to these 717s for more passengers and be flying more of the larger seating regionals.
Apparently they will be migrating some routes to these 717s for more passengers and be flying more of the larger seating regionals.
If their primary initiative is to get rid of 50 seat planes, but they are replacing them with CR9s or 717s, they would have to reduce frequency to avoid increasing capacity. I can't see them swapping out 4 daily 50-seat RJs (200 pax) with 4 daily 76-seat RJs (300 pax), much less with 110-seat 717s.
If they are upsizing equipment without increasing net capacity, they have no choice but to reduce frequency.
May 22, 2012, 2:51 pm
#143
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: ATL
Posts: 637
Airtran 717 N939AT, originally TWA 717 N432TW, was the last 717 built. If it comes to DL, it will mean Delta flew the very first DC-9-10 delivered and the very last DC-9/MD-80/MD-90/B717 delivered.
Those early Delta DC-9-10s found their way to Southern Airways, and some of those DC-9-10s eventually ended up as part of NW through the Republic acquisition.
ValueJet, AirTran's predecessor, was built on a fleet of DC-9s, some of which were former Delta DC-9-32s.
The Diesel-Niner's long history with DL has come full circle.
Those early Delta DC-9-10s found their way to Southern Airways, and some of those DC-9-10s eventually ended up as part of NW through the Republic acquisition.
ValueJet, AirTran's predecessor, was built on a fleet of DC-9s, some of which were former Delta DC-9-32s.
The Diesel-Niner's long history with DL has come full circle.
May 22, 2012, 2:59 pm
#144
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But they have been CUTTING capacity, and stated that these would be swapped in without altering route capacity (i.e. no net increase, right?).
If their primary initiative is to get rid of 50 seat planes, but they are replacing them with CR9s or 717s, they would have to reduce frequency to avoid increasing capacity. I can't see them swapping out 4 daily 50-seat RJs (200 pax) with 4 daily 76-seat RJs (300 pax), much less with 110-seat 717s.
If they are upsizing equipment without increasing net capacity, they have no choice but to reduce frequency.
If their primary initiative is to get rid of 50 seat planes, but they are replacing them with CR9s or 717s, they would have to reduce frequency to avoid increasing capacity. I can't see them swapping out 4 daily 50-seat RJs (200 pax) with 4 daily 76-seat RJs (300 pax), much less with 110-seat 717s.
If they are upsizing equipment without increasing net capacity, they have no choice but to reduce frequency.
May 22, 2012, 2:59 pm
#145
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This also represents another 88 Bombardier CSeries aircraft that won't get bought by Delta within the next decade.
(Oh, they might still buy some, to utilize the scope adjustment in the mooted pilot contract.)
(Oh, they might still buy some, to utilize the scope adjustment in the mooted pilot contract.)
May 22, 2012, 3:01 pm
#146
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CSeries is going to be had by undisclosed firms as well as firms like Republic operating as a regional. Considering the size of Republic's order and the fact they will enter service late, it is definitely possible that Delta Connection flights could be running on some of the Bombardier Cseries from Republic.
Last edited by adamj023; May 22, 2012 at 3:12 pm
May 22, 2012, 3:18 pm
#147
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I hope they do swap them 1:1, for the sake of those at smaller non-hub airports, but I fear that many will find themselves flying on nicer planes, but having to depart earlier and arrive later to make the same connections.
May 22, 2012, 4:10 pm
#148
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May 22, 2012, 4:27 pm
#149
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I wonder if Delta will keep the existing Recaro Y seats in Y that AirTran installed, or will Delta install their own Y seats such as the Weber 5751 or B/E Aerospace Pinnacle. The Recaro seats are already slimline, except I don't think the seat bottom slides forward while reclining like the Weber 5751 and B/E Aerospace Pinnacle.
May 22, 2012, 4:50 pm
#150
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I wonder if Delta will keep the existing Recaro Y seats in Y that AirTran installed, or will Delta install their own Y seats such as the Weber 5751 or B/E Aerospace Pinnacle. The Recaro seats are already slimline, except I don't think the seat bottom slides forward while reclining like the Weber 5751 and B/E Aerospace Pinnacle.