Latest 717 rumor: DL deal in place
Jul 9, 2012, 4:35 pm
#256
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It's official PR from DL!!!
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/delta-...123000394.html
Jul 9, 2012, 4:45 pm
#257
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Quote:
88 Boeing 717s are joining our fleet starting in 2013! That’s 5,280 more seats .....
I thought the total number of seats would be about the same after the 100/200's are replaced. Won't most of the "new" seats be middle seats? How is that an improvement?
88 Boeing 717s are joining our fleet starting in 2013! That’s 5,280 more seats .....
I thought the total number of seats would be about the same after the 100/200's are replaced. Won't most of the "new" seats be middle seats? How is that an improvement?
Jul 9, 2012, 5:16 pm
#258
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Jul 9, 2012, 5:27 pm
#259
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The Boeing 717s will primarily replace small 50-seat regional jets on a capacity-neutral basis. The 110-seat aircraft will feature new, fully upgraded interiors, with 12 First Class seats, 15 Economy Comfort seats and in-flight WiFi throughout the aircraft. Seats in Economy will be arranged in a 2-3 configuration with just one middle seat per row.
Jul 9, 2012, 5:46 pm
#260
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So by my count, they are losing 4,130 RJ seats and 2,280 mainline seats while adding 9,680 new mainline seats. This is a net gain of only 3,270... and ONLY if no other mainline planes are taken out of service beyond the 19 DC9s (which I highly doubt).
From the thread CHA CHA CHA, Delta mainline returns to Chattanooga:
You're both close, but the process is spelled out very meticulously in the new Tentative Agreement, and works in a very specific order. For every 1.25 small narrowbody planes (717) that arrive at mainline, the company can place one new 76 seater at DCI (up to a total of 70 new 76 seaters). However, the addition of a 76 seater automatically triggers the requirement to remove 2.7 50 seat RJs. (as the mumber of 76 seat RJs increases, the ratio of 50 seat RJs required to be removed increase to 4.6:1). So for practical purposes, the arrival of 717s triggers the arrival of 76 seaters which triggers the removal of 50 seaters.
Jul 9, 2012, 5:54 pm
#261
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I used to fly on Midwest's 717's all of the time out of MCI. Looks like DL will take over on this for me. I have not flown on a 717 since 2008, so when DL starts their service on them in 2013, it will have been five years for me. Probably longer since DL will probably not dump the 717's into MCI any time soon. They would be great to MSP, DTW, or MEM. I think something bigger is needed for MCI-ATL, so I believe that the 757's, MD-90's, and MD-88's are best for that route.
Jul 9, 2012, 6:02 pm
#262
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I'm not sure about their math on this one... Isn't DL replacing DC9s with the 717s? Plus they are putting in 70 76-seater RJs, pulling 2.7 50-seaters for every 1 76-seater put into service.
So by my count, they are losing 4,130 RJ seats and 2,280 mainline seats while adding 9,680 new mainline seats. This is a net gain of only 3,270... and ONLY if no other mainline planes are taken out of service beyond the 19 DC9s (which I highly doubt).
So by my count, they are losing 4,130 RJ seats and 2,280 mainline seats while adding 9,680 new mainline seats. This is a net gain of only 3,270... and ONLY if no other mainline planes are taken out of service beyond the 19 DC9s (which I highly doubt).
Also, I have no idea how or if the math works out, but I thought the utilization of the last few DC9s was pretty low, with some sitting around as spares.
Jul 9, 2012, 6:38 pm
#263
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Flew ATL-ROA last Friday. As I ducked into the CRJ's hatch (literally, being 6'3", I'm always overly cautious when entering small craft) the FA said something along the lines of " You won't need to do that early next year, they'll be running a bigger plane on this route." I guess she was referring to this topic?
Jul 9, 2012, 6:38 pm
#264
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Is it just me....
The other issue in this is the changes in aiport charge fees. Delta isplanning on replacing 50 seat aircraft on more popular routes with about 100+ seat aircraft (depening on deign and first/business split options)
First class was generally nonexistant on small 50 seatler aircraft. This allows them to have first and business class seatoptions.
From a cost/schedule standpoint your are basically replaceing 2 aircraft with one---this is a cost savings on the airline.
From Southwests standpoint they 717s were leased from boeing...not purchased sothey are subleasing these plans out.
What I have started to see with Southwest is that they have removed Airtran from some airports and replaced the routing with 737s. For example many of the routes to seattle have been "phased out" and replaced with Southwest routes.
With the pilots this probably involves some retraining and certifying them on 737s and Southwest lease/buy new 737.
Southwest did this deal as a way to expand and get the gates in key markets domestically and add a few international vacation destination airports. Some of the airports Southwest may pull out of or downgrade service to like one flight a day.
In terms of the plane usage it likely means they get into more hub/spoke design in their routing of planes.
The other issue in this is the changes in aiport charge fees. Delta isplanning on replacing 50 seat aircraft on more popular routes with about 100+ seat aircraft (depening on deign and first/business split options)
First class was generally nonexistant on small 50 seatler aircraft. This allows them to have first and business class seatoptions.
From a cost/schedule standpoint your are basically replaceing 2 aircraft with one---this is a cost savings on the airline.
From Southwests standpoint they 717s were leased from boeing...not purchased sothey are subleasing these plans out.
What I have started to see with Southwest is that they have removed Airtran from some airports and replaced the routing with 737s. For example many of the routes to seattle have been "phased out" and replaced with Southwest routes.
With the pilots this probably involves some retraining and certifying them on 737s and Southwest lease/buy new 737.
Southwest did this deal as a way to expand and get the gates in key markets domestically and add a few international vacation destination airports. Some of the airports Southwest may pull out of or downgrade service to like one flight a day.
In terms of the plane usage it likely means they get into more hub/spoke design in their routing of planes.
Jul 9, 2012, 7:00 pm
#265
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Flew ATL-ROA last Friday. As I ducked into the CRJ's hatch (literally, being 6'3", I'm always overly cautious when entering small craft) the FA said something along the lines of " You won't need to do that early next year, they'll be running a bigger plane on this route." I guess she was referring to this topic?
TRI gets a -9 as well in addition.
Jul 20, 2012, 4:58 am
#266
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Southwest paying for refurbishment
http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2...or-delta.html/
Southwest is paying the $100 million needed to repaint the 88 jets and redo their interiors.
“For us to make a deal with Delta, we agreed to pay those conversion costs,” Southwest chairman and CEO Gary Kelly said Thursday on Southwest’s Q2 earnings call.
Southwest is paying the $100 million needed to repaint the 88 jets and redo their interiors.
“For us to make a deal with Delta, we agreed to pay those conversion costs,” Southwest chairman and CEO Gary Kelly said Thursday on Southwest’s Q2 earnings call.
Jul 20, 2012, 6:33 am
#267
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http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2...or-delta.html/
Southwest is paying the $100 million needed to repaint the 88 jets and redo their interiors.
“For us to make a deal with Delta, we agreed to pay those conversion costs,” Southwest chairman and CEO Gary Kelly said Thursday on Southwest’s Q2 earnings call.
Southwest is paying the $100 million needed to repaint the 88 jets and redo their interiors.
“For us to make a deal with Delta, we agreed to pay those conversion costs,” Southwest chairman and CEO Gary Kelly said Thursday on Southwest’s Q2 earnings call.