WBurcham

No, the fare is an HUP. That means that it books into "A" if A inventory is available. Otherwise it's an H fare. It is NOT a "complimentary" upgrade. That inventory would be booked into V/X.

humanoid94

In the old NW days, FTers used to point out this problem often to NW management. In my mind, the two biggest issues with NW's posting was this discount F problem, and the "through flight posting" whereby flights with the same flight numbers would earn only the direct mileage (despite the fact that practically all the time there was a change of planes). The NW FTers never made a whole lot of progress on either of the issues, hopefully, the new Delta will be more receptive to these concerns.

DLATL777

Alright, I finally bit the bullet and read carefull through the whole thread. Let me make sure I got this straight;


First, I have ALWAYS gotten 1.5MQM credit on ALL of my DL flights that booked straight into F, ever. This was irrespective of whether or not it was an -UP fare (I used to never bother and look). Point blank if it booked into A, and I sat in First, I got the 1.5MQM.

Are you telling me that effective immideatly, any -UP fare that books into A will only get 1.0MQM? Or, was this a one time problem that effected the OP and has thus spurred on the preceeding discussion?

Thanks for the clarification. If its the former, Im going to be pretty upset.


P.S. I know this was discussed before and is most likely a completely unrelated issue, but booking some M fares this afternoon it appears DL was trying to only give me 1.0MQM. This is just a website glitch, correct?

nebraskaboy

Well put - enable the CSRs to 'make it right'. Anyone with a little bit of common sense can see that this is not right. So a couple of mistakes are made by the CSRs here and there during the integration process of awarding somebody more MQMs than they deserved (assuming they can 'make it right')..... isn't the lifetime value of you Medallion members worth more than standing behind these ongoing IT issues and pushing your best customers away????

Evan!

I am fighting DL right now about an A fare I bought through delta.com (006 stock). Selected my FC seats (upon booking, not in anyway could be a PM UG as I bought this fare a month out). Got an email confirming my itin denoting A fare. Flew in FC on NW metal FLL>DTW>LAX. Got only 1X the miles and MQMs not 1.5X. Now DL is claiming I only bought a "Q-up" fare. ???

Q was never part of the outbound and L was the fare on the inbound (upgraded ).

I checked delta.com and A fares earn 1.5 MQMs and SkyMiles for both Delta metal and NW metal. So they can't claim that I was buying an NW A fare (because of NW metal) which isn't the same as A fare on DL.

Each lob back and forth between me and Delta takes forever and always has a prelude of "we are really swamped".

troyintn

I wonder what will happen Jan 1. A lot of people make statues by segments. The system has been goofy for 3 months or more. I am sure they get a lot of calls now, but starting January 1 everyone will since that is how some people make it.

DiverDave

Airlines afraid of bad publicity, are you kidding? This is 2009. Fuggedaboutit unless you can create a witty youtube video.

I doubt any credit card company is going to side with this customer in a chargeback dispute such as this. The customer paid for transportation in the F cabin, and got transportation in the F cabin.

You may argue the lost value of the miles, but it would not be reasonable to refund the full ticket price for that.

David

motytrah

You are far better making a complaint to the DOT for deception and unfair practices. The DOT has been quite willing to prod and fine DL. Courts actually have very little authority over airline practices. However, the DOT has the ability to fine airlines with having to go through the hassle of the courts.

Robert Leach

No, he did not. He paid either a) Discounted F (which is what I consider -UP fares to be, even though the airlines do not) or b) Coach with a "free" upgrade to F.

No way he paid "full F."

Having said that, after reading through this thread, to quote Yoda, I sense a change in the force. I have flown on more A-inventory fares of all types than I care to count, and all of them have awarded 1.5 MQM. Changing that rule represents a radical departure from Delta doctrine, whether intentional or unintentional.

vasantn

Some of them have, in fact, awarded 2x MQMs (pre-2004). Or was it "base miles" then?

I've got to believe this is unintentional and will be fixed.

ocdb8r

YES, but skymiles earning is based on the FARE BASIS, not the fare class actually flown. If the latter was the case we would receive NO miles when upgraded as the tickets are booked into a non earning class once the upgrade clears.

I fully understand the difference, YOU apparently do not understand how mileage earning works. Looking at the first letter of the fare basis code WILL always tell you what mileage will be earned (assuming of course that DL had their charts in order).

I'm not trying to defend DL here, but these whining threads have to contain SOMEthing of use to the community as a whole. I was simply trying to point out that other flyers can avoid this issue by examining the fare rules before purchasing. I have said repeatedly I think the OP should be given the 1.5X miles.

MrAndy1369

That actually doesn't make sense. I've been rebooked from L into Y in IRROPS, and got 1.5x. I flew on Y, but booked on L. I should have gotten only 1.0x according to your assertion. Can you clarify?

Opositive

I'm not sure where you learned about consumer law but I think you had better do a little more studying before you try to give any more advice.

The fact is that sellers have an legal obligation to disclose the terms they are offering in a reasonably accessible manner and in language which an average consumer can easily understand. This is particularly true when there is significantly unequal bargaining power between the seller and the consumer - like when somebody buys a $600 ticket from a multi-billion dollar airline.

One part of my receipt says "Booking Class: F".

Another part says "MSN NW X/MSP NW EWR264.19HR00UPRQ NW X/DTT NW MSN264.18HR00UPRQ USD528.37END ZP MSNMSPEWRDTW XF MSN4.5MSP4.5EWR4.5DTW4.5".

Which of these two do you think meets the legal requirement of disclosure in terms the "average consumer" can understand?

Some here suggest that DL met their disclosure requirement by giving me a web link labeled "Change and Cancellation Rules" and expecting me to know I had to click on that link to see that I wasn't actually buying an F class ticket.

Other have suggested that if I did click on that link I should have somehow known that "HR00UPQ" was plain language for "You don't get 1.5X MQM's on this flight".

Honestly, you've got to be crazy if you think either of these "disclosure methods" meets the legal requirements demanded under consumer protection laws. If Delta is selling you an H-up then they have to tell you plain and simple that it's an H-up so you can make an informed decision about whether to buy it. They can't call it an F ticket in big letters on the purchase page and receipt and then disclaim that statement in cryptic code under an ambiguous web link.

I'm pretty confident in my position on this one. It's just a matter of how far I need to take it before I get satisfaction. Hopefully the polite letter they'll be getting today will do the trick and I won't have to use any really harsh language with them.

I'm an MM with more than a decade as a PM - most of it in full fare TATL and TPAC BE seats. You'd think I'd be able to get a little respect out of Delta, wouldn't ya?

OPos.

Opositive

What DL tells me is that the UP fares will not get 1.5X MQM's unless they are based on Y, B or M. In my case the fare was based on H so they are only giving me 1X. It's not going to happen in every case. Just when the fare basis is below YBM.

I went back and looked at my history and I too have ALWAYS gotten 1.5X MQM's on every flight I ever had in A or F. I have not cross checked to see what the fare basis was on all these flights so it's possible all of them were in YBM. I agree, though, I NEVER had to worry about getting the miles bonus when the ticket said A or F in the past.

OPos.

kimmielou01

Wow - I booked my husband and I to SYD in BE and I just checked and it's ticketed as "I" - does that mean I won't get the bonus miles for BE?