Terminal Dump at MAF after US Soldier attempts to bring bomb thru TSA checkpoint
Jan 7, 2012, 6:01 pm
#121
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Anything I can do to help. 
Can't say for sure, but your right about the military and how it deals with things. He's has a rough few months ahead of him. I sure feel sorry for him, but these are the responsibilities of being an adult along with the consequences of our actions.
Can't say for sure, but your right about the military and how it deals with things. He's has a rough few months ahead of him. I sure feel sorry for him, but these are the responsibilities of being an adult along with the consequences of our actions.
Jan 7, 2012, 8:05 pm
#122
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Having personally been the subject of one of those reunions I fully understand.
He was already in the country, had been for some time, when the C4 was discovered in his bag. He was passing from the non-sterile area (public area) into the sterile area through the TSA checkpoint when the substance was found. Plenty of military bases in Texas, it is very likely he never went through a TSA checkpoint prior to the day in question. I assume that is where you were headed, but it was not very clear.
He was already in the country, had been for some time, when the C4 was discovered in his bag. He was passing from the non-sterile area (public area) into the sterile area through the TSA checkpoint when the substance was found. Plenty of military bases in Texas, it is very likely he never went through a TSA checkpoint prior to the day in question. I assume that is where you were headed, but it was not very clear.
Further, the C4 was in the bag at that time - he grabbed the bag from his garage in NC to pack it with Xmas presents for his kids, BEFORE flying to TX.
It says so in the Reuters article on Yahoo:
Originally Posted by Reuters in the Yahoo article
Atwater grabbed the bag out of his garage for his Christmas-time trip from North Carolina to Texas as a carry-on and put his children's items in it, but he did not see the C-4 explosives inside, the affidavit said.
He said that he had not used any C-4 in training since his return to the United States.
When he left North Carolina on December 24, airport screening officers confiscated a smoke grenade from his bag, according to the affidavit.
He said that he had not used any C-4 in training since his return to the United States.
When he left North Carolina on December 24, airport screening officers confiscated a smoke grenade from his bag, according to the affidavit.
So, yes, Ron, your agency screwed up royally when it allowed a man to take FIVE POUNDS OF C4 onto a plane in NC. But at least it caught the smoke grenade that was in the same bag. Big catch! High fives all around! Woo-Hoo!
But don't think that I'm putting all of the blame on TSA for this one; Sgt Atwater is an abject moron for not noticing FIVE POUNDS of high explosives and a smoke grenade in his bag when he packed it full of Xmas gifts for his kids. Perhaps he thought the C4 and smoke grenade were stocking stuffers. Perhaps he mistook them for five pounds of chocolate and a bottle of wine for his significant other. Perhaps he thought the bag contained five pounds of juice boxes and a bottle of squirt cheese for the kids.
Or perhaps he took the squishy-boom and the grenade to TX with him to blow a hole in the back yard as some holiday entertainment for the kiddies, but his schedule didn't allow for it, so he took the C4 back with him, thinking, "They didn't see it in NC, they won't see it in TX on the way back." Obviously, the screeners in TX were a bit more observant than those in NC.
It's also scary to me that the Army doesn't track it's explosives better. When five pounds of C4 go off the reservation like this - how do we know that other soldiers aren't carrying the stuff away in baskets to sell on the black market? How many of those IEDs used on our troops in Afghanistan are powered by American explosives that were not properly accounted for like these five pounds?
Jan 7, 2012, 8:08 pm
#123
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It's also scary to me that the Army doesn't track it's explosives better. When five pounds of C4 go off the reservation like this - how do we know that other soldiers aren't carrying the stuff away in baskets to sell on the black market? How many of those IEDs used on our troops in Afghanistan are powered by American explosives that were not properly accounted for like these five pounds?
I wondered that too! Why don't they track it better.
Jan 8, 2012, 7:22 am
#124
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You don't have to DA its called Google -
He flew commercially from NC to TX and went through TSA where they found the smoke grenade, They missed the c4 though. Apology accepted......
Atwater was detained at the Fayetteville, North Carolina, airport on Dec. 24 when security agents found a military smoke grenade in his carry-on bag. Court documents don't specify — and transportation officials wouldn't say Tuesday — whether investigators now suspect C4 was in Atwater's bag then or whether he acquired it later.
Jan 8, 2012, 11:33 am
#126
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The longer the silence persists, the more it looks like Fayetteville missed something. Whether or not that's true, that's what it looks like.
They've had plenty of time to interview the TSOs on the checkpoint that day and to review tapes. I would have expected an almost immediate announcement from TSA indicating that they are confident the nasty stuff was not in his bag when he cleared that checkpoint.
I'm sure someone more astute than I will point out some reason why TSA would want to delay such an announcement ('on-going investigation', bla-bla), but I sure don't understand it. I can, of course, understand why they would not want to come forward and say they hadn't followed SOP and/or somehow missed the stuff when they found the grenade.
I find it pretty unsettling. As statistically unlikely as it is that anything's going to happen on a plane, it still shows that someone's more likely to get through a checkpoint with something nasty (and size-able! This wasn't some tiny little det**ator!) than they are to get through with a snowglobe (or cupcake).
It also reminds me that although I'm not allowed to wear rubber flip-flops through the checkpoint (could be something metallic in there) or shoes (could be nasty stuff embedded in the soles), we already allow our guys in uniform to wear boots through the checkpoint (if there's no metal in them). So much for 'risk-based' screening.
They've had plenty of time to interview the TSOs on the checkpoint that day and to review tapes. I would have expected an almost immediate announcement from TSA indicating that they are confident the nasty stuff was not in his bag when he cleared that checkpoint.
I'm sure someone more astute than I will point out some reason why TSA would want to delay such an announcement ('on-going investigation', bla-bla), but I sure don't understand it. I can, of course, understand why they would not want to come forward and say they hadn't followed SOP and/or somehow missed the stuff when they found the grenade.
I find it pretty unsettling. As statistically unlikely as it is that anything's going to happen on a plane, it still shows that someone's more likely to get through a checkpoint with something nasty (and size-able! This wasn't some tiny little det**ator!) than they are to get through with a snowglobe (or cupcake).
It also reminds me that although I'm not allowed to wear rubber flip-flops through the checkpoint (could be something metallic in there) or shoes (could be nasty stuff embedded in the soles), we already allow our guys in uniform to wear boots through the checkpoint (if there's no metal in them). So much for 'risk-based' screening.
Jan 9, 2012, 7:46 pm
#127
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Blogger Bob's Cupcake post explains why TSA missed Sargeant Atwater's 5 lbs of C-4
I'm sure someone more astute than I will point out some reason why TSA would want to delay such an announcement ('on-going investigation', bla-bla), but I sure don't understand it. I can, of course, understand why they would not want to come forward and say they hadn't followed SOP and/or somehow missed the stuff when they found the grenade.
Originally Posted by Blogger Bob
When you think about it, do you think an explosive would be concealed in an ominous item that would draw attention, or something as simple as a cute cupcake jar?
In short, TSA was unable to find Sargeant Atwater's 5 lbs C4 because the agency's Situational Awareness is completely flawed.
Jan 9, 2012, 7:57 pm
#128
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The announcement may also say that Pistole is resigning to "spend more time with his family" or some other similar nonsense. IMHO, the current presidential administration will fire him soon because he and his agency are too big of a political liability to have around going into the election.
Jan 9, 2012, 9:05 pm
#129
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It will be late on a Friday afternoon when TSA confirms that they missed the 5 lbs of C4. (Friday evenings are the slow point in the news cycle.)
The announcement may also say that Pistole is resigning to "spend more time with his family" or some other similar nonsense. IMHO, the current presidential administration will fire him soon because he and his agency are too big of a political liability to have around going into the election.
The announcement may also say that Pistole is resigning to "spend more time with his family" or some other similar nonsense. IMHO, the current presidential administration will fire him soon because he and his agency are too big of a political liability to have around going into the election.
The current administration obviously hasn't had any problem with Napolitano or Pistole or their policies for the last 3 years, I seriously doubt that this incident will cause much more than a minor ripple in their proverbial ponds.
As for this latest incident proving a liability, well, heck, it couldn't possibly be a bigger liability than the economy, the deficit, the debt, or the fact that the US Congress has to continuously have emergency sessions every two months to avert a government shutdown because they're at a complete political impasse on budget issues. I think they might even welcome such an incident, as a distraction from the bigger problems they've been facing.
Jan 9, 2012, 9:21 pm
#130
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It will be late on a Friday afternoon when TSA confirms that they missed the 5 lbs of C4. (Friday evenings are the slow point in the news cycle.)
The announcement may also say that Pistole is resigning to "spend more time with his family" or some other similar nonsense. IMHO, the current presidential administration will fire him soon because he and his agency are too big of a political liability to have around going into the election.
The announcement may also say that Pistole is resigning to "spend more time with his family" or some other similar nonsense. IMHO, the current presidential administration will fire him soon because he and his agency are too big of a political liability to have around going into the election.
Congress won't hold their feet to the fire to explain the first real, undeniable lapse of something besides 'weapons' that by TSA's own admission aren't enough to take a plane down. And TSA's not going to step up and admit that they're so focused on shampoo and water bottles and cheese and cupcakes and handwarmers and fake IDs and underwire bras and ostomy bags that they missed something serious.
At best, they will say that they're satisfied that Atwater intended no harm and that by confiscating the smoke grenade, they neutralized the threat because he no longer had a detonator.
Jan 9, 2012, 10:04 pm
#131
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Besides, the proposed expedited screening has been quickly signed into law by the President, without comments, when he returned from his Hawaii vacation earlier this month.
http://thehill.com/blogs/transportat...tary-personnel
With today's news that the White House Chief of Staff stepping down and POTUS busy with his election year State of the Union address in about 2 weeks, it seemed as if they wanted to keep a low profile. Meanwhile, the Green Beret has been released into the Army's custody on the way back to Ft. Bragg, NC
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/s...,6548917.story
Just wondering if the Sergeant T.S.A. was in the audience last month when POTUS gave an end of war & welcome home speech at Ft. Bragg.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/1...n_1148346.html
Bets, anyone, for reduced charges & subsequent plea bargaining or even dismissal of charges, and deferral to the military ... Afterall, he simply forgotten and cooperated with the authorities
Last edited by Letitride3c; Jan 9, 2012 at 10:15 pm
Jan 10, 2012, 7:38 am
#132
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Pshaw... [that's a noise of contemptuous dismissal]
The current administration obviously hasn't had any problem with Napolitano or Pistole or their policies for the last 3 years, I seriously doubt that this incident will cause much more than a minor ripple in their proverbial ponds.
As for this latest incident proving a liability, well, heck, it couldn't possibly be a bigger liability than the economy, the deficit, the debt, or the fact that the US Congress has to continuously have emergency sessions every two months to avert a government shutdown because they're at a complete political impasse on budget issues. I think they might even welcome such an incident, as a distraction from the bigger problems they've been facing.
The current administration obviously hasn't had any problem with Napolitano or Pistole or their policies for the last 3 years, I seriously doubt that this incident will cause much more than a minor ripple in their proverbial ponds.
As for this latest incident proving a liability, well, heck, it couldn't possibly be a bigger liability than the economy, the deficit, the debt, or the fact that the US Congress has to continuously have emergency sessions every two months to avert a government shutdown because they're at a complete political impasse on budget issues. I think they might even welcome such an incident, as a distraction from the bigger problems they've been facing.
Wonder when indefinite detention will be used for someone refusing a strip-search (electronic or real) at a checkpoint, or when it will be used to stifle someone like Schneier, or used to quell political opponents that seek to reduce onerous "security" requirements.
Jan 10, 2012, 8:52 pm
#133
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If he were "Muslim" in appearance (remember, we have folks who want to profile "Muslims" however they intend to characterize them), you can bet there would be folks claiming the first flight was a dry run to see if he could get it on the plane...
Jan 12, 2012, 6:21 pm
#134
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 52
WRONG! The smoke grenade was confiscated when he left NC, so he definitely transited a TSA checkpoint when he flew from NC to TX.
Further, the C4 was in the bag at that time - he grabbed the bag from his garage in NC to pack it with Xmas presents for his kids, BEFORE flying to TX.
It says so in the Reuters article on Yahoo:
Link to Yahoo article
So, yes, Ron, your agency screwed up royally when it allowed a man to take FIVE POUNDS OF C4 onto a plane in NC. But at least it caught the smoke grenade that was in the same bag. Big catch! High fives all around! Woo-Hoo!
But don't think that I'm putting all of the blame on TSA for this one; Sgt Atwater is an abject moron for not noticing FIVE POUNDS of high explosives and a smoke grenade in his bag when he packed it full of Xmas gifts for his kids. Perhaps he thought the C4 and smoke grenade were stocking stuffers. Perhaps he mistook them for five pounds of chocolate and a bottle of wine for his significant other. Perhaps he thought the bag contained five pounds of juice boxes and a bottle of squirt cheese for the kids.
Or perhaps he took the squishy-boom and the grenade to TX with him to blow a hole in the back yard as some holiday entertainment for the kiddies, but his schedule didn't allow for it, so he took the C4 back with him, thinking, "They didn't see it in NC, they won't see it in TX on the way back." Obviously, the screeners in TX were a bit more observant than those in NC.
It's also scary to me that the Army doesn't track it's explosives better. When five pounds of C4 go off the reservation like this - how do we know that other soldiers aren't carrying the stuff away in baskets to sell on the black market? How many of those IEDs used on our troops in Afghanistan are powered by American explosives that were not properly accounted for like these five pounds?
Further, the C4 was in the bag at that time - he grabbed the bag from his garage in NC to pack it with Xmas presents for his kids, BEFORE flying to TX.
It says so in the Reuters article on Yahoo:
Link to Yahoo article
So, yes, Ron, your agency screwed up royally when it allowed a man to take FIVE POUNDS OF C4 onto a plane in NC. But at least it caught the smoke grenade that was in the same bag. Big catch! High fives all around! Woo-Hoo!
But don't think that I'm putting all of the blame on TSA for this one; Sgt Atwater is an abject moron for not noticing FIVE POUNDS of high explosives and a smoke grenade in his bag when he packed it full of Xmas gifts for his kids. Perhaps he thought the C4 and smoke grenade were stocking stuffers. Perhaps he mistook them for five pounds of chocolate and a bottle of wine for his significant other. Perhaps he thought the bag contained five pounds of juice boxes and a bottle of squirt cheese for the kids.
Or perhaps he took the squishy-boom and the grenade to TX with him to blow a hole in the back yard as some holiday entertainment for the kiddies, but his schedule didn't allow for it, so he took the C4 back with him, thinking, "They didn't see it in NC, they won't see it in TX on the way back." Obviously, the screeners in TX were a bit more observant than those in NC.
It's also scary to me that the Army doesn't track it's explosives better. When five pounds of C4 go off the reservation like this - how do we know that other soldiers aren't carrying the stuff away in baskets to sell on the black market? How many of those IEDs used on our troops in Afghanistan are powered by American explosives that were not properly accounted for like these five pounds?
priorities are messed up.when they found the smoke grenade in NC, they should have dumped the rest of the bag out, in which case they would have found the C-4 as well.
Jan 13, 2012, 6:55 pm
#135
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,195
Still not holding my breath.