Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airlines and Mileage Programs > British Airways | Executive Club
Reload this Page >

The 2023 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261 / UK261

Old Jan 1, 2023, 11:31 am
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: corporate-wage-slave
Link to the full original text of the regulations in PDF format

Downgrades: Mennens case - calculation formula is in this post
Brexit and Covid pointers: see post 8
Print Wikipost

The 2023 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261 / UK261

Old Apr 17, 2023, 2:02 pm
  #676  
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 4
Just out in a claim for BA0248 GIG-LHR from Saturday (15th April). Should be an open and shut case, but I was wondering how long BA are taking to respond to claims at the moment? Automated email says ' We are currently experiencing exceptionally high volumes, so you might have to wait a while for a response, however, we will aim to get back to you as soon as possible.' but there is no actual time frame mentioned.

Thanks
KMc101217 is offline  
Old Apr 18, 2023, 1:02 am
  #677  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 47
Data Point

30/12/22 - BA48 cancelled due to ground crew driving into nose gear on departure
2/1/23 - filed for cancellation compensation from BA under EC2611

1/4/23 - received notification of acceptance of claim

18/4/23 - compensation and expenses paid
In the time between filing and receiving acceptance, I received numerous "we're on the case" and "thank you for bearing with us" us emails, which dried up at week 8. Chased at week 8, 10, 12 with no acknowledgement. I had set aside time wb 10 April to file with CEDR when acceptance hit my inbox on 11/4.

Last edited by bookish; Apr 18, 2023 at 1:22 am
bookish is offline  
Old Apr 18, 2023, 2:00 am
  #678  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,469
Originally Posted by KMc101217
Just out in a claim for BA0248 GIG-LHR from Saturday (15th April). Should be an open and shut case, but I was wondering how long BA are taking to respond to claims at the moment? Automated email says ' We are currently experiencing exceptionally high volumes, so you might have to wait a while for a response, however, we will aim to get back to you as soon as possible.' but there is no actual time frame mentioned.

Thanks
4 months for my last 2.
tuonopepper is offline  
Old Apr 18, 2023, 6:40 am
  #679  
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 4
Originally Posted by tuonopepper
4 months for my last 2.
Thanks very much; thought we might be talking months rather than weeks
KMc101217 is offline  
Old Apr 18, 2023, 6:42 am
  #680  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,469
Originally Posted by KMc101217
Thanks very much; thought we might be talking months rather than weeks
Yup, i'd actually given up at 12 weeks and filed CEDRs which were being assessed when BA got in touch accepting the claims.

Ive got the CEDRs on hold pending actually seeing the money arrive then will close them down.
tuonopepper is offline  
Old Apr 18, 2023, 11:58 am
  #681  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,469
Originally Posted by Sigwx
Yes that would be a Menzies issue. if it was the terminal's baggage system or BRS then it would be a MAG issue. Loading is very much Menzies ball game.
Well they came back quick but are sticking to their line, CEDR it is:-

"As your flight was delayed due to issues with the breakdown of ground equipment at Manchester Airport, a high lifter for offload and loading of the aircraft. As this is equipment outside of our control, it means youre not eligible for compensation."

A
Sigwx likes this.
tuonopepper is offline  
Old Apr 18, 2023, 12:08 pm
  #682  
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: FL390 or the iron way
Programs: BA GGL
Posts: 1,951
Originally Posted by tuonopepper
Well they came back quick but are sticking to their line, CEDR it is:-

"As your flight was delayed due to issues with the breakdown of ground equipment at Manchester Airport, a high lifter for offload and loading of the aircraft. As this is equipment outside of our control, it means youre not eligible for compensation."

A
By that logic they could subcontract the crew to a separate limited company and then blame an "issue outside our control" if one of them called in sick!

Ground equipment is an inherent part of the operation of an air carrier and thus cannot possibly meet the first test of the "exceptional circumstances" exclusion from compensation.

Hopefully CEDR will give that short shrift, if BA don't change their mind in the meantime.
flarmip is online now  
Old Apr 18, 2023, 2:45 pm
  #683  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,469
I was thinking that, I guess they'd try and blame Finnair if one of the wet lease flights is delayed too :-)
tuonopepper is offline  
Old Apr 19, 2023, 6:46 am
  #684  
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Programs: BA Bronze :(
Posts: 66
A glimmer of hope for some perhaps - Our flight to Thessaloniki on the 7th was delayed by a lovely total of 3hrs and 1 minute due to baggage issues and then the plane going tech, claimed put in on the 11th and the money was in my account this morning. Very impressed! I was 100% expecting BA to give me the runaround.
ModestPointsCollector is offline  
Old Apr 19, 2023, 6:57 am
  #685  
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,319
Originally Posted by Sigwx
Given BA 48 departed on time I can't see how they used 'a start-up delay' as their excuse, but then neither am I surprised in equal measure.
it seem like the start up delay was for the plane at the LHR gate. TS mention that they get to the gate only around 20 mins later as the other plane is still at the gate.
mrblackthecat likes this.
sbs2716g is online now  
Old Apr 19, 2023, 7:22 am
  #686  
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,387
Originally Posted by sbs2716g
it seem like the start up delay was for the plane at the LHR gate. TS mention that they get to the gate only around 20 mins later as the other plane is still at the gate.
Yes on second reading Id agree, albeit poorly worded by them. Even still it is all in their control, they are aware of target start up times as they update, the stand plan for T5 is in their control too. If a lack of resources means a stand change cant be actioned and it is better to take the delay and subsequent mis connections, that is an operational decision on the day and one fully in the airlines control. Whilst they dont impose the start up delays, they are aware of them and have the latitude to work around them.

Should be a rapid enough approval through CEDR.
mrblackthecat likes this.
Sigwx is online now  
Old Apr 20, 2023, 1:23 am
  #687  
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Programs: IHG Plat, HHonors Diamond, SPG Gold,VS, BA.
Posts: 43
EC261 Reimbursement where only one ticket on a 2-4-1 downgraded to WT+

Hi FT. I was hoping some knowledgeable people on this thread might be able to help with a recent flight and how it might qualify for EU261 regarding downgrades as I’m struggling to get my head around this particular scenario.

I recently travelled to Japan on BA7/BA6 booked for 2 people in Club with an Amex 2-4-1 Voucher. The total cost paid was 180k Avios + 1103.92 + 2-4-1 Voucher (of which 530.12 was Gov/Authority/Airport Charges, and 573.80 was BA Fees/Surcharges)

Upon OLCI opening for the outbound, we were unable to check in. Arriving at the airport we were told the flight was oversold, we didn’t have assigned seats & were on ‘standby’ and the only way we would stay on the flight would be to accept a downgrade to WT+, however it would be likely that one of us would be able to be reinstated back to Club at the gate if we were willing to be split up.

We accepted as we had tight onward plans, and indeed at the gate one ticket was moved back to Club, while the other travelled downgraded into WT+ (in reality we shared our time on the flat bed).

When the downgrade was being offered, no reimbursement was offered on the spot but we given instructions to claim online. The return was unaffected.

What am I entitled to ask for here re: EU261? The split cabin and 2-4-1 voucher no doubt complicate things…

As the flight was over 3500km+, the EU261 reimbursement should be at the 75% level? My maths is:

1/ 75% of the Avios for the one way journey.

…however would this be 75% of 90,000 (assuming the 2-4-1 voucher has a nominal value of 90,000...) which would be 67,500 Avios?

…or 75% of 45,000 (as half of what I actually paid for that leg of the journey) - which would be 33,750?

2/ 75% of the YQ for the outbound leg in Cash.

This is complicated again by the 2-4-1 and booking at T-355 mean that I have separate tax calculations for the outbound, and adding the return when it was added at a later date by calling at 1am 2 weeks later.

…Would it be 75% * 0.5 (one leg) of the whole YQ return amount for 1 pax (286.90) - which is 107.59

…or 75% of the YQ amount for the outbound calculation for 1 pax (164.50 - which is higher ex-LHR) - which is 123.38

Any help with anyone of experience of claims regarding a 2-4-1 would be greatly appreciated! Many thanks.

P.S: If it makes any difference to the likely outcome considering I've read 2-4-1s are a bit of a grey area with BA and EC261 - it was actually my seat (as the person making the booking & payment) with my 2-4-1 voucher that was downgraded, meanwhile my wife's ticket (perhaps seen as the 'free' one on the voucher) remained in Club.
FlyingChris47 is offline  
Old Apr 20, 2023, 1:30 am
  #688  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 89
Apologies if this has been answered - I read the Wiki but didn't find an answer.

Last week I flew LHR-DFW-LAS, booked LHR-DFW in F (BA193), and DFW-LAS (BA1990 AA Codeshare) in J, all on one ticket.

BA193 was delayed about 2 hours (due to an engineering issue - plane had been in maintenance for 2 days and had an AC fault when the pilots boarded), and therefore I missed my connection. I was rebooked onto a later AA flight for the DFW-LAS into Y, as there was no J available for the rest of the day. I arrived at my final destination within 3 hours of my expected arrival time.

Am I entitled to any compensation for this, given that the downgraded segment did not start or end in the UK? If so, what percentage of ticket value is it? I don't particularly mind, but would be nice to get some compensation if I am entitled to it.

Last edited by thebilly_b; Apr 20, 2023 at 1:47 am Reason: Add reason for delay
thebilly_b is offline  
Old Apr 20, 2023, 1:42 am
  #689  
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold; Flying Blue Life Platinum; LH Sen.; Hilton Diamond; Kemal Kebabs Prized Customer
Posts: 64,561
Originally Posted by FlyingChris47
1/ 75% of the Avios for the one way journey.

however would this be 75% of 90,000 (assuming the 2-4-1 voucher has a nominal value of 90,000...) which would be 67,500 Avios?

or 75% of 45,000 (as half of what I actually paid for that leg of the journey) - which would be 33,750?

2/ 75% of the YQ for the outbound leg in Cash.

This is complicated again by the 2-4-1 and booking at T-355 mean that I have separate tax calculations for the outbound, and adding the return when it was added at a later date by calling at 1am 2 weeks later.

Would it be 75% * 0.5 (one leg) of the whole YQ return amount for 1 pax (286.90) - which is 107.59

or 75% of the YQ amount for the outbound calculation for 1 pax (164.50 - which is higher ex-LHR) - which is 123.38
Thank you for an admirably clear layout and precision on this, it makes it a lot easier to give a sensible reply though I may need to update this later after I've had more caffeine!

So personally I would regard the Companion Voucher as replacing the quantity of Avios concerned, so let's say your staring point is 360k Avios. One person affected only, so 180k. One direction affected, so 90K. Hence in my opinion it's 90k x 75%.

For the second question relating to cash, that indeed is complex, since APD is charged on the affected leg and BA is entitled to that money in order to pay HMRC. So strictly speaking you would split it by leg and charge that, so that looks like the 123 figure. I would actually claim 130 at this point, and if it gets to MCOL then the judge can reduce it a bit but s/he cannot increase the figure you claim.

I mention that since BA really struggles with this are and Mennens has made it more complicated. So you are doing the right thing here working out approximately what to look for - and you can also do a cash equivalent for the Avios - and look to what BA actually offers. I would take this to MCOL fairly soon on if BA doesn't get close to your figures. A key point to be made - since BA will be able to claim the CVs were used albeit in WTP, is that you would never have used a CV for WTP in any circumstances, and given a choice you would have retrieved the CV and replaced it with Avios.
corporate-wage-slave is online now  
Old Apr 20, 2023, 1:47 am
  #690  
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold; Flying Blue Life Platinum; LH Sen.; Hilton Diamond; Kemal Kebabs Prized Customer
Posts: 64,561
Originally Posted by thebilly_b
Am I entitled to any compensation for this, given that the downgraded segment did not start or end in the UK? If so, what percentage of ticket value is it? I don't particularly mind, but would be nice to get some compensation if I am entitled to it.
You are entitled to downgrade reimbursement (not compensation) but not - as I think you suspect - delay compensation, by dint of not being that late. It will not be a large sum of money due to being a short distance at the lower precentage rate compared to a long journey. The wiki will give you an example and the post above yours shows someone using the maths correctly, albeit on a redemption + CV trip. Because it is so small my usual advice is to contact BA Customer Relations, say this happened, but that you know that the refund would be quite a small amount and it would take some effort to calculate it accurately. Therefore instead of claiming the downgrade could CR offer some Avios instead please to cover the inconvenience? Anything over 10,000 Avios is probably a generous outcome.
thebilly_b likes this.
corporate-wage-slave is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.