Crying baby in club world??
May 29, 2012, 2:02 am
#76
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: North of Carlisle
Programs: BAEC Silver
Posts: 1,538
I had a woman with the worst case of flatulence I have ever encountered. It was our first CW flight - 8hours of hell from LGW to MCO. The whole cabin was affected but guess who the CC were looking at in a very accusing way, it wasn't her because women don't do that sort of thing ...give me a crying baby any day
Last edited by mike&co; May 29, 2012 at 2:08 am
May 29, 2012, 2:44 am
#78
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: LHR / IAD
Programs: BA/AA/UA
Posts: 2,955
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/13/he...tosterone.html
Bizarre, huh! Frankly the study raises more questions than it answers. For example, what happens to absentee fathers? (They get more sleep 
)
Testosterone was measured when the men were 21 and single, and again nearly five years later. Although testosterone naturally decreases with age, men who became fathers showed much greater declines, more than double that of the childless men.
And men who spent more than three hours a day caring for children — playing, feeding, bathing, toileting, reading or dressing them — had the lowest testosterone.
And men who spent more than three hours a day caring for children — playing, feeding, bathing, toileting, reading or dressing them — had the lowest testosterone.
)
The study did not examine specific effects on men’s behavior, like whether those with smaller drops in testosterone were more likely to be neglectful or aggressive. It also did not examine the roles played by other hormones or whether factors like stress or sleeplessness contributed to a decline in testosterone.
May 29, 2012, 3:05 am
#79
Fontaine d'honneur du Flyertalk
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Morbihan, France
Programs: Reine des Muccis de Pucci; Foreign Elitist (according to others)
Posts: 19,180
This is an old chestnut that will return as long as FT exists. It will never be resolved as the parents who post here usually claim that their children/babies would never do any such thing - and I have no reason to doubt them.
For the umpteenth time I lay the blame entirely on the parents. They come in two categories - the people who really do their best and those that could care less and do nothing to calm or discipline their children. The former get my absolute backing and help as much as possible. The others I have to go an speak with. Let me specific - we had a child in CW who was quite appalling the other day. The parents completely ignored her. All they wanted to do was watch the AVOD. Amongst her more charming traits, Mademoiselle decided that seat belts were not for her and arose from her seat as we taxied onto the active runway. Her Father lifted his head from his paper on hearing the PA that a crew member gave where he had been buried during the safety briefing and had to belt after her and drag her back to her seat in which she said at the top of her voice that she did not d*mnwell wish to go.
Her loveliness went on at full volume and on and finally I had a deputation in the galley before the bar service even began asking me to do something about it. I think that the Mother had cottoned on and had got the child to sit and was laying down the law. At which point the child clearly mouthed back and the Mother threatened and the child smacked the Mother in the mouth. I do not know who was more shocked her or I. The child was rushed into the toilet and I have to say that we did not have too much trouble afterwards. See what I mean?
Last week I had parents who were in different parts of the cabin thanks to BA's ridiculous seat selection policy. They had a baby - you would not have known that there was one. The Mother was breast feeding and was extremely discrete about it. I had no diffculty persuading the man sitting opposite to swap with the husband - and not because he had any problem with the baby - he was a Dad and thought that the family should be together. We do have some really nice people flying with us sometimes.
For the umpteenth time I lay the blame entirely on the parents. They come in two categories - the people who really do their best and those that could care less and do nothing to calm or discipline their children. The former get my absolute backing and help as much as possible. The others I have to go an speak with. Let me specific - we had a child in CW who was quite appalling the other day. The parents completely ignored her. All they wanted to do was watch the AVOD. Amongst her more charming traits, Mademoiselle decided that seat belts were not for her and arose from her seat as we taxied onto the active runway. Her Father lifted his head from his paper on hearing the PA that a crew member gave where he had been buried during the safety briefing and had to belt after her and drag her back to her seat in which she said at the top of her voice that she did not d*mnwell wish to go.
Her loveliness went on at full volume and on and finally I had a deputation in the galley before the bar service even began asking me to do something about it. I think that the Mother had cottoned on and had got the child to sit and was laying down the law. At which point the child clearly mouthed back and the Mother threatened and the child smacked the Mother in the mouth. I do not know who was more shocked her or I. The child was rushed into the toilet and I have to say that we did not have too much trouble afterwards. See what I mean?
Last week I had parents who were in different parts of the cabin thanks to BA's ridiculous seat selection policy. They had a baby - you would not have known that there was one. The Mother was breast feeding and was extremely discrete about it. I had no diffculty persuading the man sitting opposite to swap with the husband - and not because he had any problem with the baby - he was a Dad and thought that the family should be together. We do have some really nice people flying with us sometimes.
May 29, 2012, 3:19 am
#80
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Not the UK
Programs: EK Gold, BA Silver
Posts: 70
I am lucky enough to receive an allowance from my employer for a lot of my travel although that generally equates to Y fares and I choose to pay the extra to go J so that I can arrive in a better condition. Luckily I don't come across noxious children too often but when I do, it really spoils the flight. To be clear - I have nothing whatsoever against children flying in any class - what I object to is parents who have utterly failed in their task and think it's OK for their little snots to ruin it for everyone else. Sadly, this isn't limited to airline travel, but in the event of a flight being plagued by errant offspring, I have been known to ask the parents to control them (never works) as it's not really fair to put the CC in that position - they are probably suffering as much as the rest of us...
May 29, 2012, 3:25 am
#81
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: All over the place often South Wales and Lake District
Programs: BA Gold for Life Accor Platinum
Posts: 4,552
I have taken all 3 of my kids on aircraft long haul (kangaroo run) many times and my wife and I ensured that they were well behaved because we too wanted to sleep. I despair at parents who lose control of their children, there is simply no excuse for it.
I have a lot of sympathy for business travellers who pay a premium price on the basis that they will arrive at their destination well rested. Perhaps if the cost of taking children into a premium cabin were increased then parents may be disinclined to seat them there. Personally I feel that this would be unfair on parents that handle their children well and don't disturb others. However I have the distinct impression that such parents are getting thinner on the ground.
Don't expect any compensation, but by all means complain. If BA charged more for children they could put more CC resources into controlling them... a move that seems to be necessary because parents appear to be losing their touch!
I have a lot of sympathy for business travellers who pay a premium price on the basis that they will arrive at their destination well rested. Perhaps if the cost of taking children into a premium cabin were increased then parents may be disinclined to seat them there. Personally I feel that this would be unfair on parents that handle their children well and don't disturb others. However I have the distinct impression that such parents are getting thinner on the ground.
Don't expect any compensation, but by all means complain. If BA charged more for children they could put more CC resources into controlling them... a move that seems to be necessary because parents appear to be losing their touch!
May 29, 2012, 3:52 am
#82
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: UK
Programs: BA Blue, VS Silver
Posts: 2,575
I will add my 2p to this, as Pucci says this is a subject that will go on and on (just like cyclists on the road ..)
I'm a proud father of now of a 9 month old boy. Next week we're flying CW to MRU, this will be Jr's 4th holiday and the longest flight he will undertake. Before we was born we said we would not change our travel plans and the number of holidays we take a year.
The last trip 3 weeks ago was from TBS. The flight left at the "Oh my god" hour of the day - surprisingly he coped well with being woken up at 2am to go to the airport. But when we boarded the flight at 4.30am he was getting tired and irritated and crying, but then most people would if they'd been up since 2am. I have found when a baby is overtired they find it even harder to sleep. I cried probably for 20-30 mins just before takeoff and during the climb. There wasn't much i could do as we were still strapped in. I felt so self-concious that we were disturbing the other passengers though luckily we were right at the back. I apologised to the few at the back all of them smiled and said no problem as they all said they were parents so they perfectly understood.
As soon as seatbelt light was off I was able to papoose him and walk up and down the aisle within minutes he was asleep.... it's a routine I use for all flights and it's worked a treat.
Not all parents are inconsiderate. I must admit I can't remember a flight in the last 3 years where there was a screaming baby that annoyed me.
I'm a proud father of now of a 9 month old boy. Next week we're flying CW to MRU, this will be Jr's 4th holiday and the longest flight he will undertake. Before we was born we said we would not change our travel plans and the number of holidays we take a year.
The last trip 3 weeks ago was from TBS. The flight left at the "Oh my god" hour of the day - surprisingly he coped well with being woken up at 2am to go to the airport. But when we boarded the flight at 4.30am he was getting tired and irritated and crying, but then most people would if they'd been up since 2am. I have found when a baby is overtired they find it even harder to sleep. I cried probably for 20-30 mins just before takeoff and during the climb. There wasn't much i could do as we were still strapped in. I felt so self-concious that we were disturbing the other passengers though luckily we were right at the back. I apologised to the few at the back all of them smiled and said no problem as they all said they were parents so they perfectly understood.
As soon as seatbelt light was off I was able to papoose him and walk up and down the aisle within minutes he was asleep.... it's a routine I use for all flights and it's worked a treat.
Not all parents are inconsiderate. I must admit I can't remember a flight in the last 3 years where there was a screaming baby that annoyed me.
May 29, 2012, 3:56 am
#83
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: LHR / IAD
Programs: BA/AA/UA
Posts: 2,955
May 29, 2012, 4:08 am
#84
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Another forum
Programs: Good Riddance FT!
Posts: 2,005
The hotels chains forums are full of people asking for (and getting) compensation because they couldn't sleep due to other guests being noisy for whatever reason. This isn't generally the fault of the hotel, either. One could say that the purpose of an hotel room is to sleep, and the purpose of a plane ticket is transportation, but if the airlines advertize their premium cabins as places to sleep in to arrive relaxed at destination, the distinction is more blurry.
And again - a hotel is a very different place. In an airplane you are sitting literally one next to another with no walls, etc. There is no possible way for you to insulate yourself completely from other passengers. If you cannot handle this, there are many other forms of transport.
What if another passenger on the flight has a cold, and you catch it. Should BA likewise be held responsible? Wow.
May 29, 2012, 4:09 am
#85
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Saundersfoot
Posts: 716
I will add my 2p to this, as Pucci says this is a subject that will go on and on (just like cyclists on the road ..)
I'm a proud father of now of a 9 month old boy. Next week we're flying CW to MRU, this will be Jr's 4th holiday and the longest flight he will undertake. Before we was born we said we would not change our travel plans and the number of holidays we take a year.
The last trip 3 weeks ago was from TBS. The flight left at the "Oh my god" hour of the day - surprisingly he coped well with being woken up at 2am to go to the airport. But when we boarded the flight at 4.30am he was getting tired and irritated and crying, but then most people would if they'd been up since 2am. I have found when a baby is overtired they find it even harder to sleep. I cried probably for 20-30 mins just before takeoff and during the climb. There wasn't much i could do as we were still strapped in. I felt so self-concious that we were disturbing the other passengers though luckily we were right at the back. I apologised to the few at the back all of them smiled and said no problem as they all said they were parents so they perfectly understood.
As soon as seatbelt light was off I was able to papoose him and walk up and down the aisle within minutes he was asleep.... it's a routine I use for all flights and it's worked a treat.
Not all parents are inconsiderate. I must admit I can't remember a flight in the last 3 years where there was a screaming baby that annoyed me.
I'm a proud father of now of a 9 month old boy. Next week we're flying CW to MRU, this will be Jr's 4th holiday and the longest flight he will undertake. Before we was born we said we would not change our travel plans and the number of holidays we take a year.
The last trip 3 weeks ago was from TBS. The flight left at the "Oh my god" hour of the day - surprisingly he coped well with being woken up at 2am to go to the airport. But when we boarded the flight at 4.30am he was getting tired and irritated and crying, but then most people would if they'd been up since 2am. I have found when a baby is overtired they find it even harder to sleep. I cried probably for 20-30 mins just before takeoff and during the climb. There wasn't much i could do as we were still strapped in. I felt so self-concious that we were disturbing the other passengers though luckily we were right at the back. I apologised to the few at the back all of them smiled and said no problem as they all said they were parents so they perfectly understood.
As soon as seatbelt light was off I was able to papoose him and walk up and down the aisle within minutes he was asleep.... it's a routine I use for all flights and it's worked a treat.
Not all parents are inconsiderate. I must admit I can't remember a flight in the last 3 years where there was a screaming baby that annoyed me.
May 29, 2012, 4:22 am
#86
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Canterbury, UK
Programs: BA Gold, IHG Diamond + Ambassador, Accor Gold, Avis President's Club, Heathrow Rewards
Posts: 2,471
I couldn't agree more with this.
People need to take responsibility for their kids and that includes making sure their kids don't go on and make life miserable for others. I don't visit my private life and tribulations on others, but somehow parents seem to think that their kids are all our problems and, as testified in this thread again, we should all put up with it.
When I was young, a long time ago admittedly, we were raised to be well behaved and not make a nuisance of ourselves in public. If despite that some little tyke still misbehaved, a clip around the ears from a nearby adult usually settled the matter. If you do that these days to a stranger's kid, they'll cart you off to be entertained at Her Majesty's pleasure.
We all have good and bad days, but the idea that somehow it's ok to impose heavily on others just because the imposition happens to be children and you happen to be a parent is ridiculous.
Psychologically, we tend to not remember when all goes well, it's "uneventful". So, on that basis, I'd suggest that in most cases kids are not a problem at all, provided parents do their jobs well - they'll be well behaved and properly fed, hydrated etc - and thus not make a nuisance for the rest of us, hence we forget about it in the first place. The, probably relatively minor, group who can't be bothered to get their act together and ensure their kids are fit for travel and able to do so without causing the rest of us to suffer should expect to be tackled on it quite strongly.
For many professions, you need extensive training and practice before you're even allowed near a real job. Unfortunately, there is no requirement for people to be suitably qualified as educators and parents before they go off and procreate, even though raising kids properly is perhaps the most important task ever.
People need to take responsibility for their kids and that includes making sure their kids don't go on and make life miserable for others. I don't visit my private life and tribulations on others, but somehow parents seem to think that their kids are all our problems and, as testified in this thread again, we should all put up with it.
When I was young, a long time ago admittedly, we were raised to be well behaved and not make a nuisance of ourselves in public. If despite that some little tyke still misbehaved, a clip around the ears from a nearby adult usually settled the matter. If you do that these days to a stranger's kid, they'll cart you off to be entertained at Her Majesty's pleasure.
We all have good and bad days, but the idea that somehow it's ok to impose heavily on others just because the imposition happens to be children and you happen to be a parent is ridiculous.
Psychologically, we tend to not remember when all goes well, it's "uneventful". So, on that basis, I'd suggest that in most cases kids are not a problem at all, provided parents do their jobs well - they'll be well behaved and properly fed, hydrated etc - and thus not make a nuisance for the rest of us, hence we forget about it in the first place. The, probably relatively minor, group who can't be bothered to get their act together and ensure their kids are fit for travel and able to do so without causing the rest of us to suffer should expect to be tackled on it quite strongly.
For many professions, you need extensive training and practice before you're even allowed near a real job. Unfortunately, there is no requirement for people to be suitably qualified as educators and parents before they go off and procreate, even though raising kids properly is perhaps the most important task ever.
May 29, 2012, 4:49 am
#87
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Scotland
Programs: not a lot
Posts: 1,774
My opinion is that if you can afford to sit in the cabin then you are most welcome to.
I don't get annoyed by other children crying on a plane, I have two children of my own so can accept that these things happen.
I would get annoyed by bad behaviour on a plane, be it a child or adult.
I remember on a flight ERW-EDI in Y a couple of years ago there was a baby that wouldn't stop crying for the whole flight. Maybe unwell, but a baby cannot grin and bear it like an adult can. I didn't think at any point I wish that baby would be quiet, instead I felt sorry for the mother who basically did everything she could to comfort him.
People say that business people can't work, relax on the flight but the people in the seats are not differentiated by what they are travelling for they are all passengers who have paid to sit in their seat regardless of why they are travelling.
If it is so vital you arrive refreshed and ready for whatever the day requires then perhaps public transport is not for you as there are no guarantees.
I don't get annoyed by other children crying on a plane, I have two children of my own so can accept that these things happen.
I would get annoyed by bad behaviour on a plane, be it a child or adult.
I remember on a flight ERW-EDI in Y a couple of years ago there was a baby that wouldn't stop crying for the whole flight. Maybe unwell, but a baby cannot grin and bear it like an adult can. I didn't think at any point I wish that baby would be quiet, instead I felt sorry for the mother who basically did everything she could to comfort him.
People say that business people can't work, relax on the flight but the people in the seats are not differentiated by what they are travelling for they are all passengers who have paid to sit in their seat regardless of why they are travelling.
If it is so vital you arrive refreshed and ready for whatever the day requires then perhaps public transport is not for you as there are no guarantees.
May 29, 2012, 4:50 am
#88
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: London, UK
Programs: BA gold, *A gold, SPG silver, HHonors gold
Posts: 1,438
IMHO the parents of crying babies on night flights should remove them from the cabin into the galley or a similar semi-shielded area until the crying stops. I view this as a basic act of human courtesy.
May 29, 2012, 5:21 am
#89
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: SXB
Programs: FB Silver, BA Silver, BD Gold rememberer, IHG Diamond Royal Ambassador, Hilton and Marriott Gold
Posts: 2,583
I didn't say they should have gotten it, I said that they got it. I don't think companies care whether they are at fault when deciding to compensate or not, but whether they value future business (and/or bad publicity that could arise if they don't compensate, in some case). If you complain unduly (and don't make an habit out of it) but are seen as a great source of income, you'll get better treatment than if you're totally morally right but you're a nobody (even if you're morally and legally right, like BA does with denying compensation for late flights). If Kim Kardashian (from another thread) asked for 5,000 avios because the airport stole things in her bags, I am pretty sure BA would give them (and don't assume I think she's morally right to accuse the airline of theft).
Last edited by Richelieu; May 29, 2012 at 5:44 am
May 29, 2012, 5:23 am
#90
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: used to be FRA, LHR and now FRA, TXL
Programs: BA Gold, FB Platinum, M&M Senator (thanks FB), HH Diamond, SPG Platinum
Posts: 250
Keeping a kid quite in a plane is as complicated as keeping a kid quite in car (whith the usual questions, "when to we arrive", "I want to go out" ....).
Even if I consider that the seat configuration is better adapted for travelling with young kids in economy. Do no see any problem with kid in premium cabins.
you cannot expect a kid to stay seated for 6 hours or more, when quite a few adults are not even able to do it, spending their time either walking to the galley or opening overhead locker.
The issue with a young kid is that if he needs to stretch his legs, he may finish anywhere on the plane and will not stop at the galley chating with the CC.
Even if I consider that the seat configuration is better adapted for travelling with young kids in economy. Do no see any problem with kid in premium cabins.
you cannot expect a kid to stay seated for 6 hours or more, when quite a few adults are not even able to do it, spending their time either walking to the galley or opening overhead locker.
The issue with a young kid is that if he needs to stretch his legs, he may finish anywhere on the plane and will not stop at the galley chating with the CC.