Apr 9, 2016, 5:10 pm
Last edit by: Prospero
Boeing 787-8 (788) Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business Class Seats Selection Guide & Reviews
There were 20 787-8 Dreamliners at the end of 2018, now gradually expanding to 42 total 788s in the AA fleet.
This thread is dedicated to discussion of the Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner with Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business class seating and service
For the 787-9, see Boeing 787-9 / 789: Business (Rockwell Collins (née B/E) Super Diamond Seat, Service (master thd)
The 787-8 offers 20 modified Zodiac "Concept D" Business Suite all aisle access "podded" seats in 1-2-1 with back to back seating in the center pairs, and alternating front and rear facing window seats. They are said to be 21-26" wide, and have 60-61" pitch upright in pods with full aisle access and 77" in the horizontal "bed" position. True AVOD offering up to 250 movies, 160 TV shows, 13 radio channels, 375 albums and 20 games, is offered via cabled handset controllers to large flat touch screens. Power offered is 110 VAC via universal plugs and 5 VDC USB. Bose QuietComfort headsets with noise reduction are provided (picked up about one hour prior to arrival). Ku-Band satellite WiFi is offered for sale.
The Dreamliner "big sister" model (22 787-9, first in service September 2016, has Collins (née B/E Aerospace) Super Diamond Solo seats that largely avoid the Zodiac problems, is the "big sister"). The second batch of 787-8s (787T) differ from the first batch and are fitted with Collins Super Diamond seats.
Zodiac "Concept D Business Suite" seats connected "at the head" are affected by movement from the seat they are connected to, often referred to on FT as "motion over the ocean". The Business seats that are unconnected and stable in 787-8 J are 1D&H, 5A&L.
Due to the modifications AA required of Zodiac for these seats, there are some peculiarities reported:
Link to photos taken by SFO777 here, from his trip on AA2320 DFW-ORD 07:10 - 09:36 Inaugural flight, shared with 68 FlyerTalkers.
There were 20 787-8 Dreamliners at the end of 2018, now gradually expanding to 42 total 788s in the AA fleet.
This thread is dedicated to discussion of the Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner with Zodiac Concept D Business Suite Business class seating and service
For the 787-9, see Boeing 787-9 / 789: Business (Rockwell Collins (née B/E) Super Diamond Seat, Service (master thd)
The 787-8 offers 20 modified Zodiac "Concept D" Business Suite all aisle access "podded" seats in 1-2-1 with back to back seating in the center pairs, and alternating front and rear facing window seats. They are said to be 21-26" wide, and have 60-61" pitch upright in pods with full aisle access and 77" in the horizontal "bed" position. True AVOD offering up to 250 movies, 160 TV shows, 13 radio channels, 375 albums and 20 games, is offered via cabled handset controllers to large flat touch screens. Power offered is 110 VAC via universal plugs and 5 VDC USB. Bose QuietComfort headsets with noise reduction are provided (picked up about one hour prior to arrival). Ku-Band satellite WiFi is offered for sale.
The Dreamliner "big sister" model (22 787-9, first in service September 2016, has Collins (née B/E Aerospace) Super Diamond Solo seats that largely avoid the Zodiac problems, is the "big sister"). The second batch of 787-8s (787T) differ from the first batch and are fitted with Collins Super Diamond seats.
Zodiac "Concept D Business Suite" seats connected "at the head" are affected by movement from the seat they are connected to, often referred to on FT as "motion over the ocean". The Business seats that are unconnected and stable in 787-8 J are 1D&H, 5A&L.
Remedial seat stability fix announced 9 Oct 2016 by John Walton, Runway Girl Network (link)
"Jay Mapston, American’s manager of onboard products, cabin design, spoke to Runway Girl Network with praiseworthy candor about the airline’s current situation and plans. To start, Mapston explains the 787-8 fleet’s (Zodiac) Concept D (Business Suite) will see remedial stability work to fix the much-discussed issue where the seats shake when an adjoining passenger moves."
As of July 2019, no such fix has been put in place. The seat modification has to be designed, submitted to the FAA for certification (STC) and approved, the parts manufactured and seats modified. Normally, the seat manufacturer would do this, but as AA terminated the Zodiac contract for failure to perform. It’s anyone’s guess when and if a fix is forthcoming.
AA canceled the contract with Zodiac for inability to comply with scheduled delivery times, causing seatless Dreamliners to sit out availability idled in the desert and causing considerable delay for the 777-200ER refurbishment. The seats were NOT used for the 787-9 nor more than half the 47 aircraft 772 fleet, and it is likely the newly ordered 788s will be equipped with Super Diamond Seats.
"Jay Mapston, American’s manager of onboard products, cabin design, spoke to Runway Girl Network with praiseworthy candor about the airline’s current situation and plans. To start, Mapston explains the 787-8 fleet’s (Zodiac) Concept D (Business Suite) will see remedial stability work to fix the much-discussed issue where the seats shake when an adjoining passenger moves."
As of July 2019, no such fix has been put in place. The seat modification has to be designed, submitted to the FAA for certification (STC) and approved, the parts manufactured and seats modified. Normally, the seat manufacturer would do this, but as AA terminated the Zodiac contract for failure to perform. It’s anyone’s guess when and if a fix is forthcoming.
AA canceled the contract with Zodiac for inability to comply with scheduled delivery times, causing seatless Dreamliners to sit out availability idled in the desert and causing considerable delay for the 777-200ER refurbishment. The seats were NOT used for the 787-9 nor more than half the 47 aircraft 772 fleet, and it is likely the newly ordered 788s will be equipped with Super Diamond Seats.
- Many seats are interlaced with others - passenger in one moves, the linked seat moves. "Motion over the ocean" is induced by the partner seat attached at the head,
- Forward facing seats may have more restricted shoulder room / width when flat than aft facing
- Middle seat privacy dividers were balky and continually slipped into the retracted position, so they were "fixed" in place so they are not passenger operable. Apparently crew fixes them in several configurations: all up, making them great for privacy but nearly impossible for couples wanting to share conversation; all down, making for lower privacy; facing forward up, facing aft down. Some aircraft have them repaired and passenger operable, some not.
- Rows 1 and 2 center seats have no overhead bins; they were displaced by the crew rest area in the fore fuselage crown.
- 1A and L are close to lav and galley.
- Many prefer seats 5A or L as they are unaffected by other seats / passenger movement in seats.
- 5A and 5L have one window, rather than two.
Link to photos taken by SFO777 here, from his trip on AA2320 DFW-ORD 07:10 - 09:36 Inaugural flight, shared with 68 FlyerTalkers.
Dreamliner 787-8 / 788 Zodiac Business Seats & Reviews (master thd)
Aug 4, 2018, 7:59 am
#496
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: RDU
Posts: 2,264
There's other threads on this topic... https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...aster-thd.html
6A is a great seat. 6A avoids the connected seat problem which impacts the majority of the cabin. Also, the rear-facing seats place your head closer to the window (vs. the aisle for the forward-facing seats), which can afford more privacy. You can also generally be first (or one of the) off the plane.
You can read more about the connected seat issue here: https://thepointsguy.com/2016/04/ame...-class-review/
The mini cabin also feels nice and private, although you are closer to the main cabin than the forward business class cabin. You'll also have about 1/2 the plane walking by you during boarding assuming the jetbridge is between the business cabins, so if you want to avoid that, move to the forward cabin.
6A is a great seat. 6A avoids the connected seat problem which impacts the majority of the cabin. Also, the rear-facing seats place your head closer to the window (vs. the aisle for the forward-facing seats), which can afford more privacy. You can also generally be first (or one of the) off the plane.
You can read more about the connected seat issue here: https://thepointsguy.com/2016/04/ame...-class-review/
The mini cabin also feels nice and private, although you are closer to the main cabin than the forward business class cabin. You'll also have about 1/2 the plane walking by you during boarding assuming the jetbridge is between the business cabins, so if you want to avoid that, move to the forward cabin.
Aug 21, 2018, 7:31 am
#501
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,107
Has anyone heard or read anything recently about whether or not they are still anticipating a December start to pulling out the mini-cabin to add in PE?
Have two flights in December that were originally 789's that are now 788's. If it's just starting in December, the odds are still in my favor for not being disrupted. However, if they start early, I may want to move from 6A into the forward cabin while the seatmap is still pretty wide open.
Have two flights in December that were originally 789's that are now 788's. If it's just starting in December, the odds are still in my favor for not being disrupted. However, if they start early, I may want to move from 6A into the forward cabin while the seatmap is still pretty wide open.
Aug 23, 2018, 9:26 pm
#502
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: San Francisco
Programs: AA EXP; Marriott BonVoy Titanium Elite, Marriott LT Plat.
Posts: 1,717
So is the window seats in the mini-J cabin are being labeled the best seats on the a/c, I'm wondering why I'm able to select them on short notice. All of the seats in the front cabin are selected. Even the middle seats in the mini cabin. But 6 and 7 window seats are available. Makes me wonder if I'm in for some sort of surprise.
Aug 24, 2018, 3:44 am
#503
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: PHL
Programs: AA EXP, HH Diamond, Owner of 2,000 TWA shares
Posts: 812
So is the window seats in the mini-J cabin are being labeled the best seats on the a/c, I'm wondering why I'm able to select them on short notice. All of the seats in the front cabin are selected. Even the middle seats in the mini cabin. But 6 and 7 window seats are available. Makes me wonder if I'm in for some sort of surprise.
Those seats are fine, 6 faces rear, 7 faces forward. I've sat in both 7 windows during 4 TPACs this year and have had no noise issues from Y. Never tried 6 myself as they put the snacks out in the galley and there are lavs behind. I've never heard complaints about 6, though. Either way, you'll be fine.
Aug 24, 2018, 9:41 am
#504
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: RDU <|> MMX
Programs: AA EXP 2MM, SK EBS
Posts: 12,483
So is the window seats in the mini-J cabin are being labeled the best seats on the a/c, I'm wondering why I'm able to select them on short notice. All of the seats in the front cabin are selected. Even the middle seats in the mini cabin. But 6 and 7 window seats are available. Makes me wonder if I'm in for some sort of surprise.
Aug 24, 2018, 11:25 am
#505
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Houston , TX
Programs: Platinum Pro. .Hilton Honors Gold,
Posts: 678
On the 788 you want a window seat in row 7 or 6. I would take my chances with light noise from economy over FA chatter in the galley up front.
Keep in mind next year they are cutting business class down to 20 seats on the 788 so row 6 and 7 will be premium economy. On the new configuration row 5 the last row will be the most desireable.
Keep in mind next year they are cutting business class down to 20 seats on the 788 so row 6 and 7 will be premium economy. On the new configuration row 5 the last row will be the most desireable.
Aug 24, 2018, 12:36 pm
#506
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: San Francisco
Programs: AA EXP; Marriott BonVoy Titanium Elite, Marriott LT Plat.
Posts: 1,717
Thanks!!! Took row 6A outbound and 7A inbound. And I cannot agree more with you #D3KingAmerican about the FA chatter. On my last TPAC,several J customers "lightly" complained that they need to piper down abit. They were a little too animated with a couple J passengers that were chatting in the galley as well.
Sep 5, 2018, 7:30 am
#507
Join Date: May 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP, LT Gold
Posts: 3,148
And so it begins for the 787-8 fleet... N800AN headed to KPAE for PE refit and 28 --> 20 J reduction: https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/n800an
Sep 5, 2018, 8:02 am
#509
Join Date: May 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP, LT Gold
Posts: 3,148
I don't think AA ever gave specific dates on when they were going to start this. With the busy summer season winding down, I guess they wanted to get going on it. Especially since there's an oppty cost of no PE sales on these planes / routes until they are refitted.
Sep 5, 2018, 9:49 pm
#510
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: bay area, ca
Programs: UA plat, , aa plat, marriott LT titanium
Posts: 4,833
Hadn't seen this thread - ord-bcn seat 1a - rocking /jolt when passenger in 2a got up or????, was annoying but didn't think too much about it, just commented to FA that something was wrong with the seat, initially thought it was a glitch in the mechanism until I figured out it was the other person.
Return (don't know if same tail #) MUCH worse jolting if 2a (who wasn't a big person) moved a little bit - jolts were so bad that had I been drinking at the moment it happened I would have spilled whatever all over myself!
Reported to FA who knew nothing about it being an ongoing problem but said she would report it (at my insistence)- denied ability to issue any comp (as AA had promoted for resolution on board) for extreme discomfort and my special meal not loaded correctly (as well as the only edible part being thrown out by FA when I asked for it to be warmed and he misunderstood and threw it out!)
I'm not so concerned about comp, but finding out that this is a long standing problem that the FA claim to know nothing about and the fact that this has been going on for months with no fix makes me angry and sad. Another reason AA has lost my business
Return (don't know if same tail #) MUCH worse jolting if 2a (who wasn't a big person) moved a little bit - jolts were so bad that had I been drinking at the moment it happened I would have spilled whatever all over myself!
Reported to FA who knew nothing about it being an ongoing problem but said she would report it (at my insistence)- denied ability to issue any comp (as AA had promoted for resolution on board) for extreme discomfort and my special meal not loaded correctly (as well as the only edible part being thrown out by FA when I asked for it to be warmed and he misunderstood and threw it out!)
I'm not so concerned about comp, but finding out that this is a long standing problem that the FA claim to know nothing about and the fact that this has been going on for months with no fix makes me angry and sad. Another reason AA has lost my business