Complex Multi-City Points Bookings, Stopovers & Adding Segments (Aeroplan 2.0)
Jul 5, 2022, 3:11 pm
#886
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 733
Any tips what to ask for to get AP agent to piece through the itinerary segment by segment? She was insisting on doing it as a multi city reward and then couldn't get all the flights, but they are plainly still available through the AC site. Does stringing together complex segments as one ticket (within the AP rules) need to be done by ticketing? A supervisor? In a special system?
Jul 5, 2022, 10:26 pm
#887
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 99
Any tips what to ask for to get AP agent to piece through the itinerary segment by segment? She was insisting on doing it as a multi city reward and then couldn't get all the flights, but they are plainly still available through the AC site. Does stringing together complex segments as one ticket (within the AP rules) need to be done by ticketing? A supervisor? In a special system?
Jul 9, 2022, 6:23 pm
#889
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 616
Yup, it's in the Flight Reward Policy:
Itineraries and points pricing – travel between two zones
For connecting itineraries with an origin and destination located in two different travel zones of the Aeroplan Flight Reward chart, connecting via a third zone is generally permitted if it meets the other conditions outlined in this document. However, the following exceptions apply:
• North America to/from Europe: must travel across the Atlantic Ocean
• North America to/from Middle East: must travel across the Atlantic Ocean
• North America to/from South America: must travel wholly within the Western Hemisphere
For connecting itineraries with an origin and destination located in two different travel zones of the Aeroplan Flight Reward chart, connecting via a third zone is generally permitted if it meets the other conditions outlined in this document. However, the following exceptions apply:
• North America to/from Europe: must travel across the Atlantic Ocean
• North America to/from Middle East: must travel across the Atlantic Ocean
• North America to/from South America: must travel wholly within the Western Hemisphere
Jul 10, 2022, 7:17 am
#890
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: PHL, NYC, DC
Posts: 9,708
Dumb question from me.........does the search engine know how to price the points for a stopover reward, or should I call an agent instead?
For example I am looking at YYZ-EWR-CDG (UA) + CDG-SIN (SQ) in Y class...... shouldn't it be 60,000 points (based on 10663 miles on GCMapper) + 5000 points for stopover = 65000 total?
However AC is showing as 85,000
For example I am looking at YYZ-EWR-CDG (UA) + CDG-SIN (SQ) in Y class...... shouldn't it be 60,000 points (based on 10663 miles on GCMapper) + 5000 points for stopover = 65000 total?
However AC is showing as 85,000
Last edited by global happy traveller; Jul 10, 2022 at 8:02 am
Jul 10, 2022, 8:48 am
#892
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: YYZ
Posts: 88
Booked this a few hours ago through the AP call center. The agent was quite adamant that it wouldn't be possible to book it as a one-way with a stopover, but she eventually gave in and although she had some trouble finding the flights I requested, she managed to grab them all in the end and pieced it together to be 90k AP + $170 pp with all flights in J.
When she first took the flights from me, she told me that if it prices out as a one-way with a stopover, she won't charge the $30 pp booking fee but after she priced it out, she put me on hold and came back to inform me that the booking fee will be charged. Given how soon the flight is leaving, I went along with what she was saying but if I'm not mistaken, I shouldn't have been charged a booking fee since the itinerary has a stopover which can't be booked online? She said the booking fee is being charged because the booking is segment by segment. It doesn't matter if the booking is done segment by segment right?
Jul 11, 2022, 8:53 am
#893
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 733
Booked this a few hours ago through the AP call center. The agent was quite adamant that it wouldn't be possible to book it as a one-way with a stopover, but she eventually gave in and although she had some trouble finding the flights I requested, she managed to grab them all in the end and pieced it together to be 90k AP + $170 pp with all flights in J.
When she first took the flights from me, she told me that if it prices out as a one-way with a stopover, she won't charge the $30 pp booking fee but after she priced it out, she put me on hold and came back to inform me that the booking fee will be charged. Given how soon the flight is leaving, I went along with what she was saying but if I'm not mistaken, I shouldn't have been charged a booking fee since the itinerary has a stopover which can't be booked online? She said the booking fee is being charged because the booking is segment by segment. It doesn't matter if the booking is done segment by segment right?
Jul 11, 2022, 6:39 pm
#894
Join Date: Apr 2022
Posts: 12
Wanting to know if this is possible:
MNL-MCT-MUC and do a short hopper MUC-CDG not on the aeroplan booking and then do CDG-JFK to keep me under 11,000 miles and book it at 85,000.
I can’t get any flights from MNL/TPE across the Pacific and if I don’t do that short hopper flight it puts me over the 11,000 mile mark assuming GC map is spot on with mileage at 11,200.
MNL-MCT-MUC and do a short hopper MUC-CDG not on the aeroplan booking and then do CDG-JFK to keep me under 11,000 miles and book it at 85,000.
I can’t get any flights from MNL/TPE across the Pacific and if I don’t do that short hopper flight it puts me over the 11,000 mile mark assuming GC map is spot on with mileage at 11,200.
Jul 11, 2022, 6:55 pm
#895
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 1,633
Wanting to know if this is possible:
MNL-MCT-MUC and do a short hopper MUC-CDG not on the aeroplan booking and then do CDG-JFK to keep me under 11,000 miles and book it at 85,000.
I can’t get any flights from MNL/TPE across the Pacific and if I don’t do that short hopper flight it puts me over the 11,000 mile mark assuming GC map is spot on with mileage at 11,200.
MNL-MCT-MUC and do a short hopper MUC-CDG not on the aeroplan booking and then do CDG-JFK to keep me under 11,000 miles and book it at 85,000.
I can’t get any flights from MNL/TPE across the Pacific and if I don’t do that short hopper flight it puts me over the 11,000 mile mark assuming GC map is spot on with mileage at 11,200.
Perhaps schedule the short hop at the start? BKK, SIN?
Jul 11, 2022, 7:17 pm
#896
Join Date: Apr 2022
Posts: 12
Ahh thanks, yea guess will have do the short hop at the start. Still can’t believe all the BR flights got booked up that fast, there was like 7 available, oh well!!
Jul 13, 2022, 2:10 pm
#897
Moderator, Air Canada; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE MM, FB Plat, WS Plat, BA Silver, DL GM, Marriott Plat, Hilton Gold, Accor Silver
Posts: 16,777
Anyone had problems with taxes being calculated incorrectly when adding segments to bookings?
Summary: when adding intra-EU segments beyond Germany on a TATL ticket, the system used by the Aeroplan agents, including ticketing, wants to charge Germany's international departure tax as though the final destination is long-haul, even though it should only be charged at the intra-EU rate.
Details:
Last night I booked YYC-FRA-MUC; VIE-YUL-YYZ-YYC online, to be able to change the outbound to YYC-FRA-MUC-VCE-VIE (all connections, no stopovers) on the phone. When the agent came back with the price, ADCOL was $137, even though the taxes on making a new booking MUC-VCE-VIE were only about $86.
The agent I spoke to last night would not get on with ticketing because they were about to close, and she said they leave sharp at midnight Eastern - no closing out calls in the queue or anything like that - and we had no hope of getting through to them before they left.
So I called again this morning. Sadly, the MUC-VCE-VIE space I wanted was gone, but I could do MUC-FLR-VIE instead, which was nearly as good. The problem remained when talking to a new agent and with this slightly different routing.
After she went to talk to ticketing and got me the breakdown, the problem was clear: after making the change, it was asking for $76.48 of German departure taxes. Booking MUC-VIE alone is $16.80, because the destination (VIE) is clearly in zone 1 for the German departure tax (see Wikipedia if you want to know more!). The $16.80 is also definitely correct for my ticket - it's a YYC-VIE round trip, so the destination is VIE, and if I booked YYC-FRA-MUC-VIE and then a return from VIE on a random routing that doesn't touch Germany, so that we can understand what German taxes are applicable to a YYC-VIE round trip connecting through Germany on the outbound, the applicable German departure tax is $16.80, not $76.48.
There's clearly something screwy about adding those extra segments that's causing the ticketing system to incorrectly calculate the taxes.
So I had the return dropped, added my segments, and made this a one-way to avoid the $60 penalty, and see whether it was a sequencing issue. But after turning this in to a nice, clear, one-way to VIE, getting it ticketed and sorted, then later trying to add a return, this problem seems to keep recurring, because every return I try to tack on, the taxes are way higher than they should be.
Anyone else encountered issues like this? If so, have you found a solution? The multiple agents, and the one guy on the ticketing desk, all told me they couldn't override the system, because it's taxes, and they can't change the amount that's automatically calculated.
The best they could offer me was to pay what the system demanded, then write in later for a refund, if my interpretation of the tax amount was correct. I was told I could speak to a lead (supervisor), but that they also wouldn't be able to alter the ADCOL.
It's only $60, which is not a huge amount of money, but it's also about the principle of the thing. How many people are getting forced to pay taxes they shouldn't owe because Aeroplan's (or AC's?) system is calculating them incorrectly? How many more times will I have to deal with this? etc
Summary: when adding intra-EU segments beyond Germany on a TATL ticket, the system used by the Aeroplan agents, including ticketing, wants to charge Germany's international departure tax as though the final destination is long-haul, even though it should only be charged at the intra-EU rate.
Details:
Last night I booked YYC-FRA-MUC; VIE-YUL-YYZ-YYC online, to be able to change the outbound to YYC-FRA-MUC-VCE-VIE (all connections, no stopovers) on the phone. When the agent came back with the price, ADCOL was $137, even though the taxes on making a new booking MUC-VCE-VIE were only about $86.
The agent I spoke to last night would not get on with ticketing because they were about to close, and she said they leave sharp at midnight Eastern - no closing out calls in the queue or anything like that - and we had no hope of getting through to them before they left.
So I called again this morning. Sadly, the MUC-VCE-VIE space I wanted was gone, but I could do MUC-FLR-VIE instead, which was nearly as good. The problem remained when talking to a new agent and with this slightly different routing.
After she went to talk to ticketing and got me the breakdown, the problem was clear: after making the change, it was asking for $76.48 of German departure taxes. Booking MUC-VIE alone is $16.80, because the destination (VIE) is clearly in zone 1 for the German departure tax (see Wikipedia if you want to know more!). The $16.80 is also definitely correct for my ticket - it's a YYC-VIE round trip, so the destination is VIE, and if I booked YYC-FRA-MUC-VIE and then a return from VIE on a random routing that doesn't touch Germany, so that we can understand what German taxes are applicable to a YYC-VIE round trip connecting through Germany on the outbound, the applicable German departure tax is $16.80, not $76.48.
There's clearly something screwy about adding those extra segments that's causing the ticketing system to incorrectly calculate the taxes.
So I had the return dropped, added my segments, and made this a one-way to avoid the $60 penalty, and see whether it was a sequencing issue. But after turning this in to a nice, clear, one-way to VIE, getting it ticketed and sorted, then later trying to add a return, this problem seems to keep recurring, because every return I try to tack on, the taxes are way higher than they should be.
Anyone else encountered issues like this? If so, have you found a solution? The multiple agents, and the one guy on the ticketing desk, all told me they couldn't override the system, because it's taxes, and they can't change the amount that's automatically calculated.
The best they could offer me was to pay what the system demanded, then write in later for a refund, if my interpretation of the tax amount was correct. I was told I could speak to a lead (supervisor), but that they also wouldn't be able to alter the ADCOL.
It's only $60, which is not a huge amount of money, but it's also about the principle of the thing. How many people are getting forced to pay taxes they shouldn't owe because Aeroplan's (or AC's?) system is calculating them incorrectly? How many more times will I have to deal with this? etc
Jul 13, 2022, 2:17 pm
#898
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,347
Jul 13, 2022, 2:21 pm
#899
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 616
Not quite the same situation, but I'm being charged taxes for a country I'm no longer going to due to a schedule change rebooking. My friend who's into taxes (if you read this, henlo!) suggested I write in after flying the route to get my taxes back. He suggested calling AP and they'd put in the request to the appropriate office to have the taxes reassessed and refunded.
Jul 13, 2022, 2:22 pm
#900
Moderator, Air Canada; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE MM, FB Plat, WS Plat, BA Silver, DL GM, Marriott Plat, Hilton Gold, Accor Silver
Posts: 16,777
Yes, obviously that was an option. I preferred to see whether there was a way to actually solve the problem on the spot.
This booking has a priority reward on it, so I'll probably end up calling in, paying the incorrect tax, and writing in about it, but I'm interested to see whether others have encountered this issue, and whether there's a trick to getting it priced out properly, or whether they've been able to get refunds for improperly collected tax amounts.
This booking has a priority reward on it, so I'll probably end up calling in, paying the incorrect tax, and writing in about it, but I'm interested to see whether others have encountered this issue, and whether there's a trick to getting it priced out properly, or whether they've been able to get refunds for improperly collected tax amounts.