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Old May 15, 2014, 7:29 pm
  #166  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC E50K (*Gold), DL, CZ
Posts: 1,252
Thanks, Ben, for answering FT's questions tonight. Much appreciated.

My question relates to the YYZ-HND route. It was of course, slated to be one of the official 788 routes as of July 1, but as I was checking my bookings last night, found the 77W substitution instead. From what I can tell, the system has upgraded many waitlisted upgrade requests, so ^ to that at least.

Can you shed any light as to why the 788 was marketed heavily, and then pulled abruptly, with no announcement, no emails, etc.?

Also, what are the plans on July 1 for the YYZ-HND flight? Any special welcome remarks, ribbon cutting, that type of thing? Just trying to figure out how early I should arrive at the airport.
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Old May 15, 2014, 7:30 pm
  #167  
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE
Posts: 2,343
Feedback re: Tango to Flex gap

Ben and Ben,

Many thanks for the open dialogue - much appreciated.

One piece of feedback that I'd like to pass along for your consideration is regarding the gap between Tango and Flex fares.

The initial gap between Tango and Flex on domestic routes was fairly reasonable, given that you could justify that it includes seat selection and was upgrade eligible. The current premium for Flex vs. Tango fares on most routes now appears to be +50% or more. I personally can no longer justify spending that much more on the same flight just to receive 100% status miles and a chance at using upgrade credits. Many competitors offer full status miles on all fares, and a much more reasonable premium on upgrade eligible fares.

My employer (one of top 10 largest companies in Canada by revenue/profit/market cap, and I would expect similar in travel spend) recently moved to a policy of lowest fare (Tango fares on AC) after many years of buying Flex/Tango plus fares. I understand the desire of AC to push the envelope to try to extract a premium (I've spent a few years working in Pricing in my industry), but if fewer are choosing to buy-up to Flex fares because of the widening gap, then it doesn't really help you generate additional revenue.

My spouse (who is SE) switched to another airline this year for FF program. The huge premiums for Flex fares - 50% premium for full status miles were the tipping point. I'm sticking around for this year as I am on track for E75/SE100, but am considering making the switch to another program/airline for next year because I can no longer justify paying this much more just to earn full status miles.

I'd suggest taking a closer look at your Tango vs. Flex premiums, as my belief is that many travelers and employers are deciding that Flex fares are not worth the current premium.
gcashin is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:30 pm
  #168  
 
Join Date: May 2014
Programs: AC Elite 50K
Posts: 367
Plastic Seats

I'm just curious as to whats with the plastic/leather/pleather seats on these new 777s. I assume the material stands up better, but on a flight of any more than 1.5 hours its just a nasty experience. (sweat?) I mean for myself, its one of the reasons I avoid Westjet, etc. It's just not pleasant. Perhaps you'll consider doing something about that. (10X I get, its just where the industry is. Same thing with 31" which frankly I can live with. Im 5' 9 the world was built for people my size.)
LittleYHZ is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:32 pm
  #169  
formerly with Air Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: YYZ YUL
Posts: 423
Originally Posted by B788
Ben; great addition to these boards, please stop buy more often as and if your schedule permits. Can you confirm when will the new YUL MLL International Lounge be completed and what will be the new offerings in this Lounge?
With our rapid increase in international capacity ex YUL in addition to increases by both LH and LX you're most probably aware we have a major crowding problem at this location during certain time periods. The expanded lounge will be opened in 2 phases. Phase 1 will open this summer on the main departure level and provide additional seating while the new permanent expanded area gets built on the upper level. We're doing our best to work with ADM to finish phase 2 as quickly as possible.
Ben Smith is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:34 pm
  #170  
 
Join Date: May 2014
Programs: AC Elite 50K
Posts: 367
Originally Posted by B788
Ben; great addition to these boards, please stop buy more often as and if your schedule permits. Can you confirm when will the new YUL MLL International Lounge be completed and what will be the new offerings in this Lounge?
I want to know when they're going to do the domestic. I was in there in December and some people were there talking with designers and looking at sketch boards. (which they took great care to hide from anyone who might have tried to catch a glimpse.) Particularly the tiny tiny tiny washroom, where instead of bumper cars, we get to play bumper people! The bags are the bumpers!
LittleYHZ is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:38 pm
  #171  
formerly with Air Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: YYZ YUL
Posts: 423
Originally Posted by yqtyyz
Thanks, Ben, for answering FT's questions tonight. Much appreciated.

My question relates to the YYZ-HND route. It was of course, slated to be one of the official 788 routes as of July 1, but as I was checking my bookings last night, found the 77W substitution instead. From what I can tell, the system has upgraded many waitlisted upgrade requests, so ^ to that at least.

Can you shed any light as to why the 788 was marketed heavily, and then pulled abruptly, with no announcement, no emails, etc.?

Also, what are the plans on July 1 for the YYZ-HND flight? Any special welcome remarks, ribbon cutting, that type of thing? Just trying to figure out how early I should arrive at the airport.
We've recently been advised by Boeing that 788 acft #2 and #3 delivery dates have slipped by a few weeks therefore various schedule adjustments have been made for the month of July. YYZ-HND will launch as planned but with a 349 seat 77W with the route switching to a 788 later in the summer. There will be official ceremonies at both ends as well as unique offerings on board.
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Old May 15, 2014, 7:38 pm
  #172  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: YVR
Programs: AC*SE MM, Marriott Lifetime Titanium
Posts: 4,604
Originally Posted by Ben Smith
you can look forward to continued investment in the mainline product both in the air and on the ground (espresso makers, additional and improved lounges) new routes IST MXP GIG - many more to come
Just want to point out my earlier post as you guys look to improve premium ground services

Great to have some AC presence on these boards again. Even if the answers are limited in what you can share, it's much appreciated.
yvr76 is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:40 pm
  #173  
formerly with Air Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: YYZ YUL
Posts: 423
Originally Posted by yvr76
My feedback - keep airport priority services just that. Allowing credit card holders on reward travel to use priority checkin and boarding has made somewhat long lines even longer, or in some cases a joke.

I've also seen Aeroplan card holders argue their way into priority lines on revenue travel, and agents are either too confused or tired to keep up with or enforce rules.

Priority ground services are an important part of Elite benefits and premium cabins, and these recent changes have further diluted their value.
We hear and see this issue loud and clear. We are working on ways to improve delivery of this service.
Ben Smith is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:47 pm
  #174  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC E50K (*Gold), DL, CZ
Posts: 1,252
Thanks for your insight. Can't wait, and hopefully you'll be on-board as well!

Originally Posted by Ben Smith
We've recently been advised by Boeing that 788 acft #2 and #3 delivery dates have slipped by a few weeks therefore various schedule adjustments have been made for the month of July. YYZ-HND will launch as planned but with a 349 seat 77W with the route switching to a 788 later in the summer. There will be official ceremonies at both ends as well as unique offerings on board.
yqtyyz is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:47 pm
  #175  
formerly with Air Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: YYZ YUL
Posts: 423
Originally Posted by Plumber
^ to Ben Lipsey for adding value to the AC forum for us. I hope it continues.

^ to Ben Smith for jumping in offering clarification and insights into several hot topics. It is much appreciated!
Thanks for your note.
We are very mindful that you our customers (in many cases some of our best) are critical to our success and you should all know we don't take your loyalty for granted and do our very best to earn your business with products and services that also allow us to operate a long-term financially profitable and sustainable company. It's always a challenge balancing the high expectations of our customers against financial and operational constraints but thanks to your feedback we strive to make the most informed decisions possible that balance the needs of all stakeholders.
Ben Smith is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:50 pm
  #176  
formerly with Air Canada
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: YYZ YUL
Posts: 423
Originally Posted by LittleYHZ
I'm just curious as to whats with the plastic/leather/pleather seats on these new 777s. I assume the material stands up better, but on a flight of any more than 1.5 hours its just a nasty experience. (sweat?) I mean for myself, its one of the reasons I avoid Westjet, etc. It's just not pleasant. Perhaps you'll consider doing something about that. (10X I get, its just where the industry is. Same thing with 31" which frankly I can live with. Im 5' 9 the world was built for people my size.)
There will only be leather accents on the seat coverings in all cabins of the 787 and refurbished 777 fleets.
Ben Smith is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:53 pm
  #177  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: YKF
Programs: AC Elite 50K, Amex AP Plat, Choice Privileges, National Exec Elite, Via Prefrence
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by gcashin
Ben and Ben,

Many thanks for the open dialogue - much appreciated.

One piece of feedback that I'd like to pass along for your consideration is regarding the gap between Tango and Flex fares.

The initial gap between Tango and Flex on domestic routes was fairly reasonable, given that you could justify that it includes seat selection and was upgrade eligible. The current premium for Flex vs. Tango fares on most routes now appears to be +50% or more. I personally can no longer justify spending that much more on the same flight just to receive 100% status miles and a chance at using upgrade credits. Many competitors offer full status miles on all fares, and a much more reasonable premium on upgrade eligible fares.

My employer (one of top 10 largest companies in Canada by revenue/profit/market cap, and I would expect similar in travel spend) recently moved to a policy of lowest fare (Tango fares on AC) after many years of buying Flex/Tango plus fares. I understand the desire of AC to push the envelope to try to extract a premium (I've spent a few years working in Pricing in my industry), but if fewer are choosing to buy-up to Flex fares because of the widening gap, then it doesn't really help you generate additional revenue.

My spouse (who is SE) switched to another airline this year for FF program. The huge premiums for Flex fares - 50% premium for full status miles were the tipping point. I'm sticking around for this year as I am on track for E75/SE100, but am considering making the switch to another program/airline for next year because I can no longer justify paying this much more just to earn full status miles.

I'd suggest taking a closer look at your Tango vs. Flex premiums, as my belief is that many travelers and employers are deciding that Flex fares are not worth the current premium.
+1

I would also like to hear some rationale on AC's expansion of rouge routes to LAX and SFO from YVR/YYC. Do you really believe these routes are more leisure heavy than business/premium pax? As well, making Elites 50K having to purchase a flex fare for preferred seating is really a slap in the face for their loyalty. I would strongly suggest looking at the UA model for Economy Plus which gives a tiered window for upgrading to E+ and a copay for those without status is a better model to achieve both profitability and Altitude member satisfaction.

Also Ben, I'm glad to see your presence on here ( would like to see more of that). However as a marketer, I just need to point out AC Altitude's dismal performance of top down messaging (which one cannot control on the internet) and instead be seen to be engaging in honest discussions and not rehashing press release talking points that insult the intelligence.

A honest casual coffeeshop style conversation where you are able to explain the rationale for changes would be much more welcomed, and be more interactive. Having AC rouge delete negative reviews on your facebook, twitter, and tripadvisor clearly shows that your PR teams feels they can control the message (when they cannot) and makes the story about AC's communication behaviour than having an honest discussion with your (best) customers.

Last edited by kwflyer; May 15, 2014 at 8:04 pm
kwflyer is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:56 pm
  #178  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Toronto, Canada
Programs: Aeroplan
Posts: 300
Thanks Ben for your willingness to enter into the fray. ^

Quick question on customer phone support. I typically find I receive very quick response when DM'ing AC via twitter, usually in less than an hour, and realize that in an emergency where I'm stuck for support overseas, it's a great way to get immediate feedback. However, any plans for customer service itself to increase the number of operators available? On average, I'm on the phone at least an hour before I get a response. Typically with other airlines, such as United, I'm talking to an operator within 15 minutes (an Airline which I grant is larger, but AC should scale it's operators/staff to support a response time similar).

Cheers!
TravellingBeard is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 7:59 pm
  #179  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC E50K (*Gold), DL, CZ
Posts: 1,252
Ben - when will they change your username's colour to green?

Loving the timely responses for those of us who are non-twitter or Facebook users.
yqtyyz is offline  
Old May 15, 2014, 8:00 pm
  #180  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC SEMM / HH Diamond
Posts: 3,174
One more note of appreciation to both Ben's for the involvement on FT - it's very very welcome.

To Ben Smith, while (we) have your attention ... is there anything you can say re: the display of the upgrade list? I did read & understand Ben Lipsey's response (that you are not prepared to disclose the upgrade priority rules, and that you are constrained by Canadian privacy rules re: disclosure of the list).

I'm only abstractly interested in what the underlying rules are ... we think we have an idea now, I'm sure we're wrong but close, and I think that will evolve on both sides but also remain the same.

However, it would be hugely valuable to me (and from comments here, to many others) to see what the upgrade list looks like, at the airport. I really value and appreciate what UA show's to their top tier ... and it's so frustrating when flying on my "home" airline not to have any idea at all re: the likelihood of my upgrade. It affects everything from my mental state to how much pasta I eat in the lounge prior to boarding.

Even if you won't disclose the rules & reasons why the order is the way it is, please consider showing the wait list at the gate. (And no, I don't buy the privacy excuse - even with strict Canadian privacy rules there are a hundred ways to get around that ... opt in, display 3 digits of the aeroplan number, display the checking number, etc).

I'll be at the 787 event on Tuesday, so I'm planning to ask you again in person so I'm just giving you a chance to respond here first (or at least plan an answer for when I ask

Anyway, thanks again to both of you for your participation, it's much appreciated.
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