Jan 4, 2021, 1:37 am
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
This is an archive thread, the archive thread is https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-airlines-mileageplus/1960195-b737max-cleared-faa-resume-passenger-flights-when-will-ua-max-flights-resume.html
Thread Topic
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
United does not fly the 737 MAX 8 that has been involved in two recent crashes, but it does operate the 737 MAX 9.
How to tell if your flight is scheduled to be operated by the MAX 9:
View your reservation or flight status page, either on the web or on the app. United lists the entire aircraft type. Every flight that is scheduled to be on the 737 MAX will say "Boeing 737 MAX 9." If you see anything else -- for example, "Boeing 737-900," it is not scheduled to be a MAX at this time.
The same is true in search results and anywhere else on the United site.
For advanced users: UA uses the three letter IATA identifier 7M9 for the 737 MAX 9.
All 737 MAX aircraft worldwide (MAX 8, MAX 9, and MAX 10) are currently grounded.
Thread Topic
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
READ BEFORE POSTING
Once again many posters in this thread have forgotten the FT rules and resorted to "Personal attacks, insults, baiting and flaming " and other non-collegial, non-civil discourse. This is not allowed.
Posters appear to be talking at others, talking about others, not discussing the core issues. Repeating the same statements, saying the same thing LOUDER is not civil discourse. These problems are not with one poster, they are not just one point of view, ...
As useful as some discussion here has been, continuing rules violations will lead to suspensions and thread closure. Please think about that before posting.
The purpose of FT is to be an informative forum that, in this case, enables the UA flyer to enhance their travel experience. There are other forums for different types of discussions. This thread was had wide latitude but that latitude is being abused.
Bottom line, if you can not stay within the FT rules and the forum's topic areas, please do not post.
And before posting, ask if you are bringing new contributing information to the discussion -- not just repeating previous points, then please do not post.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
Once again many posters in this thread have forgotten the FT rules and resorted to "Personal attacks, insults, baiting and flaming " and other non-collegial, non-civil discourse. This is not allowed.
Posters appear to be talking at others, talking about others, not discussing the core issues. Repeating the same statements, saying the same thing LOUDER is not civil discourse. These problems are not with one poster, they are not just one point of view, ...
As useful as some discussion here has been, continuing rules violations will lead to suspensions and thread closure. Please think about that before posting.
The purpose of FT is to be an informative forum that, in this case, enables the UA flyer to enhance their travel experience. There are other forums for different types of discussions. This thread was had wide latitude but that latitude is being abused.
Bottom line, if you can not stay within the FT rules and the forum's topic areas, please do not post.
And before posting, ask if you are bringing new contributing information to the discussion -- not just repeating previous points, then please do not post.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
This thread has engendered some strongly felt opinions and a great tendency to wander into many peripherally related topics. By all normal FT moderation standards, this thread would have been permanently closed long ago ( and numerous members receiving disciplinary actions).
However, given the importance of the subject, the UA Moderators have tried to host this discussion but odd here as UA is not the top 1 or 2 or 3 for MAX among North America carriers. However, some have allowed their passion and non-UA related opinions to repeatedly disrupt this discussion.
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
Discussion of Boeing's culture or the impact on Boeing's future is not in scope. Nor is comments on restructuring the regulatory process. Neither is the impacts on COVID on the general air industry -- those are not UA specific and are better discussed elsewhere. And for discussion of UA's future, there is a separate thread.
Additionally repeated postings of essentially the same content should not happen nor unnecessarily inflammatory posts. And of course, the rest of FT posting rules apply including discuss the issue and not the posters.
The Moderator team feels there is a reason / need for this thread but it has been exhausting to have to repeated re-focus the discussion -- don't be the reason this thread is permanently closed ( and get yourself in disciplinary problems).
Stick to the relevant topic which is (repeating myself)
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
However, given the importance of the subject, the UA Moderators have tried to host this discussion but odd here as UA is not the top 1 or 2 or 3 for MAX among North America carriers. However, some have allowed their passion and non-UA related opinions to repeatedly disrupt this discussion.
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
Discussion of Boeing's culture or the impact on Boeing's future is not in scope. Nor is comments on restructuring the regulatory process. Neither is the impacts on COVID on the general air industry -- those are not UA specific and are better discussed elsewhere. And for discussion of UA's future, there is a separate thread.
Additionally repeated postings of essentially the same content should not happen nor unnecessarily inflammatory posts. And of course, the rest of FT posting rules apply including discuss the issue and not the posters.
The Moderator team feels there is a reason / need for this thread but it has been exhausting to have to repeated re-focus the discussion -- don't be the reason this thread is permanently closed ( and get yourself in disciplinary problems).
Stick to the relevant topic which is (repeating myself)
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
United does not fly the 737 MAX 8 that has been involved in two recent crashes, but it does operate the 737 MAX 9.
How to tell if your flight is scheduled to be operated by the MAX 9:
View your reservation or flight status page, either on the web or on the app. United lists the entire aircraft type. Every flight that is scheduled to be on the 737 MAX will say "Boeing 737 MAX 9." If you see anything else -- for example, "Boeing 737-900," it is not scheduled to be a MAX at this time.
The same is true in search results and anywhere else on the United site.
For advanced users: UA uses the three letter IATA identifier 7M9 for the 737 MAX 9.
All 737 MAX aircraft worldwide (MAX 8, MAX 9, and MAX 10) are currently grounded.
B737MAX Recertification - Archive
May 20, 2019, 2:41 am
#1516
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,866
I was not concerned about the DC 10 because I understood the problems and the fix. I was booked on the PIT-PBI leg 2 days after US 427 went down. Since the 737-300 came out I always questioned how far they can drag out this old plane without having control issues. US redesignated the flight as 2427 the day I flew it, but to this day, I feel the 737 has literally been stretched too far. Without an aggressive MCAS, do we see more stall propensity with MAXA?
May 20, 2019, 4:30 am
#1517
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 57,617
I was not concerned about the DC 10 because I understood the problems and the fix. I was booked on the PIT-PBI leg 2 days after US 427 went down. Since the 737-300 came out I always questioned how far they can drag out this old plane without having control issues. US redesignated the flight as 2427 the day I flew it, but to this day, I feel the 737 has literally been stretched too far. Without an aggressive MCAS, do we see more stall propensity with MAXA?
Both my college classmate and my brother would have no problem flying or riding on a max aircraft. I trust them more than I do armchair observers who have marginal or no left seat experience.
May 20, 2019, 4:57 am
#1518
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,233
I had my strangest flight experience ever on a MAX from Bkk to Pvg on shanghai airlines. After takeoff we kind of cycled between incredible power to the engines and complete loss of power for about 10 minutes. There was also a feeling of not being stable in altitude. Eventually we reached cruising altitude and all was ok (except for the horrible toilets) but the accidents made me think of this again and from that point on I’ve always wondered what happened in the cockpit that day. I’ve flown out of BKK probably 100 times and this is the only time I experienced such a flight pattern. For me, I’ll wait a long time before I get on one of those Boeing MAXs.
May 20, 2019, 5:30 am
#1519
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York, NY
Programs: UA, AA, DL, Hertz, Avis, National, Hyatt, Hilton, SPG, Marriott
Posts: 9,454
I had my strangest flight experience ever on a MAX from Bkk to Pvg on shanghai airlines. After takeoff we kind of cycled between incredible power to the engines and complete loss of power for about 10 minutes. There was also a feeling of not being stable in altitude.
May 20, 2019, 7:20 am
#1520
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,233
I’m nowhere near qualified enough to know anything about this sort of issue. All I can say is that from the perspective of a guy who has flown probably 3 million miles, it was a weird feeling I’ve never felt before or since. Might have been the MAX or might have been something else. I just know I don’t wanna fly that plane in the near future.
May 20, 2019, 7:47 am
#1521
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 233
Once the grounding is over and all the necessary agencies sign off on the plane, it will probably be the safest aircraft to fly on. No other plane will have it's systems so thoroughly examined by so many people.
May 20, 2019, 7:55 am
#1522
Join Date: Dec 2014
Programs: UA GS ,QF Plat
Posts: 686
I had my strangest flight experience ever on a MAX from Bkk to Pvg on shanghai airlines. After takeoff we kind of cycled between incredible power to the engines and complete loss of power for about 10 minutes. There was also a feeling of not being stable in altitude. Eventually we reached cruising altitude and all was ok (except for the horrible toilets) but the accidents made me think of this again and from that point on I’ve always wondered what happened in the cockpit that day. I’ve flown out of BKK probably 100 times and this is the only time I experienced such a flight pattern. For me, I’ll wait a long time before I get on one of those Boeing MAXs.
May 20, 2019, 7:56 am
#1523
Join Date: Sep 2018
Programs: UA 1K, LH FT, Marriott Plat, IHG Gold, Hertz PC, Avis PPlus
Posts: 72
May 20, 2019, 9:04 am
#1524
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Houston
Programs: UA Plat, Marriott Gold
Posts: 12,694
May 20, 2019, 9:37 am
#1525
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BNA
Programs: HH Gold. (Former) UA PP, DL PM, PC Plat
Posts: 8,185
My understanding is that the 737-10 MAX does not need MCAS as the high-AoA pitch forces are conventional. The airplane is not yet certified, though, so that could change.
That sounds like step-climbs common in busy terminal airspace. At low altitude, the power comes way back when leveling off below 10,000' so as to not exceed the 250 knot airspeed limit.
May 20, 2019, 11:10 am
#1526
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York, NY
Programs: UA, AA, DL, Hertz, Avis, National, Hyatt, Hilton, SPG, Marriott
Posts: 9,454
May 20, 2019, 6:49 pm
#1527
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,866
Putting aside the thousands of news reports that refer to MCAS as being anti-stall, MCAS still seems to have close ties to stall situations:
Here is a Freedom of Information Request submitted to the FAA:
https://www.americanoversight.org/wp...-19-0432-1.pdf
According to the Seattle Times, engineers directly involved with Boeing’s safety analysis of MCAS told the paper that the analysis
“understated the power of the new flight control system, which was designed to swivel the horizontal tail to push the nose of the plane down to avert a stall.”3
https://www.faa.gov/news/testimony/n...=105_Testimony
Statement of Daniel K. Elwell, Acting Administrator
“To date, the FAA has tested this enhancement to the 737 MAX flight control system in both the simulator and the aircraft. The testing, which was conducted by FAA flight test engineers and flight test pilots, included aerodynamic stall situations and recovery procedures. The FAA’s ongoing review of this software installation and training is an agency priority, as will be the roll-out of any software, training, or other measures to operators of the 737 MAX.”
Here is a Freedom of Information Request submitted to the FAA:
https://www.americanoversight.org/wp...-19-0432-1.pdf
According to the Seattle Times, engineers directly involved with Boeing’s safety analysis of MCAS told the paper that the analysis
“understated the power of the new flight control system, which was designed to swivel the horizontal tail to push the nose of the plane down to avert a stall.”3
https://www.faa.gov/news/testimony/n...=105_Testimony
Statement of Daniel K. Elwell, Acting Administrator
“To date, the FAA has tested this enhancement to the 737 MAX flight control system in both the simulator and the aircraft. The testing, which was conducted by FAA flight test engineers and flight test pilots, included aerodynamic stall situations and recovery procedures. The FAA’s ongoing review of this software installation and training is an agency priority, as will be the roll-out of any software, training, or other measures to operators of the 737 MAX.”
May 22, 2019, 12:17 am
#1528
Join Date: Jan 2013
Programs: UA, Some Others
Posts: 286
Maybe the plane isn't a death trap, but crappy lavs, and skinny seating are not good.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; May 22, 2019 at 12:56 am Reason: overly personalized comments removed -- stick to the issue
May 22, 2019, 12:44 am
#1529
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 21,419
I do not care about a small Y lavatory on a narrowbody plane.
The difference in seat width between the A320 series and the B737 is one inch per seat, and it doesn't matter to me. Neither is wide enough for me to find it comfortable in Y.
The fact of the matter is, neither of these planes is going to be particularly comfortable in Y, so that part is a draw. I already explained my preference for the MAX, which has nothing to do with the width.
The fact of the matter is, neither of these planes is going to be particularly comfortable in Y, so that part is a draw. I already explained my preference for the MAX, which has nothing to do with the width.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; May 22, 2019 at 12:58 am Reason: quote updated to reflect Moderator edit; removed response to deleted content
May 22, 2019, 8:30 am
#1530
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Houston
Programs: UA Plat, Marriott Gold
Posts: 12,694