p.s. Operations Transitioning to EWR on October 25, 2015
Jun 19, 2015, 10:20 pm
#721
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: NYC/WAS
Programs: UA GS, AA EXP, DL '90s PM, now FK (Flying Kettle)
Posts: 541
This will get far worse simply because the total number of transcon seats is being slashed in this move.
Jun 19, 2015, 10:27 pm
#722
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,187
OS serves both EWR, IAD & ORD. No reason why they would want to funnel connecting traffic through JFK rather than selling VIE-JFK-VIE seats to O&D traffic.
Last edited by Indelaware; Jun 19, 2015 at 10:37 pm
Jun 19, 2015, 10:36 pm
#723
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: IAH
Programs: Marriott Plat, Hyatt Globalist, DL Plat, UA Silver
Posts: 4,043
Jun 19, 2015, 10:38 pm
#724
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,187
While I personally would like to see IAD closed, its not going to happen. UA has too great of O&D there and EWR is already at capacity. That said, I see UA trying to funnel more and more connecting traffic through ORD and away from both EWR & IAD.
Jun 19, 2015, 10:40 pm
#725
Join Date: Sep 2013
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Jun 19, 2015, 10:48 pm
#726
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: LAS HNL
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Jun 19, 2015, 11:01 pm
#727
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: LAX
Programs: UA MM | BA Silver
Posts: 7,193
MINT is already on the LAX-JFK route, they are just increasing capacity. You'll like the product, although the seat is on the firm side.
Jun 19, 2015, 11:20 pm
#729
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Las Vegas
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Change went through and got the "Please call to have your ticket reissued" flag. Lol. Nice job, UA.
Jun 19, 2015, 11:26 pm
#730
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Suburban Philadelphia
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My concern with the move to EWR is upgrades, and not just the fact that CPUs will no longer be allowed on LAX/SFO-EWR flights.
Passengers on LAX/SFO-EWR flights who want to upgrade will have to use a confirmable upgrade instrument (RPU/GPU) or miles. That's how it is now on p.s. flights to/from JFK. But after the move to EWR, domestic passengers on LAX/SFO-EWR flights will have to compete for upgrades against international passengers, for whom the LAX/SFO-EWR flight is one leg of their itinerary. This wasn't typically the case with JFK, since JFK wasn't a connection point to international United flights...
It seems to me that having to compete against international passengers for upgrades will leave domestic passengers flying just the LAX/SFO-EWR route at a significant disadvantage. Upgrading an international flight, by rule, requires a confirmable instrument that's higher in the pecking order and a relatively expensive fare -- certainly, a fare that's higher than any discounted p.s. fare.
In light of this, I don't see how anyone flying just the LAX/SFO-EWR route can reasonably expect to be upgraded after the move; especially on an RPU and/or anything less than an M-fare.
Passengers on LAX/SFO-EWR flights who want to upgrade will have to use a confirmable upgrade instrument (RPU/GPU) or miles. That's how it is now on p.s. flights to/from JFK. But after the move to EWR, domestic passengers on LAX/SFO-EWR flights will have to compete for upgrades against international passengers, for whom the LAX/SFO-EWR flight is one leg of their itinerary. This wasn't typically the case with JFK, since JFK wasn't a connection point to international United flights...
It seems to me that having to compete against international passengers for upgrades will leave domestic passengers flying just the LAX/SFO-EWR route at a significant disadvantage. Upgrading an international flight, by rule, requires a confirmable instrument that's higher in the pecking order and a relatively expensive fare -- certainly, a fare that's higher than any discounted p.s. fare.
In light of this, I don't see how anyone flying just the LAX/SFO-EWR route can reasonably expect to be upgraded after the move; especially on an RPU and/or anything less than an M-fare.
Jun 20, 2015, 12:18 am
#731
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: LAX/TPE
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Exactly...let's not be naive, this isn't a "strategic move to normalize operations at a hub", this is a full scale retreat from competition that is cleaning UA's clock.
The PS service was dumbed down, and DL, AA and B6 ramped up their products to the point it left PS a tired, old relic. My agency just received a memo from one of those airlines offering a HUGE commission bonus, and per the memo, the intent was to pull all traffic from UA and rebook on this competitor to drive one final stake in PS' heart before it moves to EWR, tail between its legs....it was very aggressive and upfront and the bonus is too hard to pass up, not that we were putting anyone on PS to begin with given the other options and the demand from our customers to fly B6 Mint.
The PS service was dumbed down, and DL, AA and B6 ramped up their products to the point it left PS a tired, old relic. My agency just received a memo from one of those airlines offering a HUGE commission bonus, and per the memo, the intent was to pull all traffic from UA and rebook on this competitor to drive one final stake in PS' heart before it moves to EWR, tail between its legs....it was very aggressive and upfront and the bonus is too hard to pass up, not that we were putting anyone on PS to begin with given the other options and the demand from our customers to fly B6 Mint.
Jun 20, 2015, 1:06 am
#732
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver
Posts: 5,848
On the AA forum, someone posted January fare data for SFO-JFK, and it appears that B6 isn't selling very many MINT seats on that route, even at a bargain-basement average fare of $633 each way:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/24988033-post572.html
AA and UA continue to attract high average premium cabin fares and high average overall fares, despite DL and B6 selling seats cheap.
I suspect that UA will do OK even after moving the JFK operation to EWR.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/24988033-post572.html
AA and UA continue to attract high average premium cabin fares and high average overall fares, despite DL and B6 selling seats cheap.
I suspect that UA will do OK even after moving the JFK operation to EWR.
The most likely scenario for UA is that they did not want to pay to reconfigure the current PS fleet nor did they want to pay to convert the international 757s to a domestic configuration. Thus the shift of aircraft to EWR as there was no other market where they could use those planes right now.
Time will tell how long it lasts. If Europe recovers the international 757s may head back to Europe.
Jun 20, 2015, 3:13 am
#733
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Jun 20, 2015, 4:13 am
#734
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The more interesting question is what happens to SFO/LAX - IAD traffic. If EWR goes lie flat in Business, much of the reasoning seems to be that it will make for a more seamless connecting experience from Europe through to the West Coast on UA metal. That would suggest that IAD should have the same treatment.
Jun 20, 2015, 4:33 am
#735
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,324
If UA were planning to downsize IAD and move ops to EWR, then their fleet planning would be very different. They would need much larger airplanes in the fleet, so would be looking seriously at 748s and 388s, rather than 789s and 350s. So, I don't believe that that is the plan at all.
The more interesting question is what happens to SFO/LAX - IAD traffic. If EWR goes lie flat in Business, much of the reasoning seems to be that it will make for a more seamless connecting experience from Europe through to the West Coast on UA metal. That would suggest that IAD should have the same treatment.
The more interesting question is what happens to SFO/LAX - IAD traffic. If EWR goes lie flat in Business, much of the reasoning seems to be that it will make for a more seamless connecting experience from Europe through to the West Coast on UA metal. That would suggest that IAD should have the same treatment.