UA958 Jun 12 '15: MX @ ORD, Diverts to YYR for 2nd MX, Pax Housed @ Military Barracks
Jun 15, 2015, 10:31 pm
#256
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,187
On another note, wonder if United pays the terminal fee of $1,161.36 (not sure if there is also a landing fee or a parking fee).
http://www.goosebayairport.com/fees.asp
http://www.goosebayairport.com/fees.asp
Jun 15, 2015, 10:36 pm
#257
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: SJC
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Apparently some folks were able to get themselves re-booked onto AC service to get out of there. AC flies regional jets in there from Halifax and St.John's.
And to the guy who suggested renting a car and driving back to the states, it's one heck of a drive on a long, barren and rough highway with minimal services!
And to the guy who suggested renting a car and driving back to the states, it's one heck of a drive on a long, barren and rough highway with minimal services!
Jun 15, 2015, 10:36 pm
#258
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For my business we have backup equipment for nearly everything we run. For our small operation it blows my mind that UA does not have, at the ready, a spare frame for every type at each hub should something go MX or divert. I am even more baffled that there is not a rescue frame sitting on each US coast for just such a contingency. Maybe the rescue frame does a turn or two each day hub to hub to keep it somewhat utilized. But for a 763 to sit within 2-3 hours of multiple UA hubs and have pax returned to EWR after 20 hours is just the worst possible outcome of a irrops recovery I have seen. While the execs have been counting their money and options of late, I guess they forget how quickly the costs of these issues can chip away at the brand and pricing power. This reminds me of two events in UA history....the dumping of pax in Cody, WY for them to fend for themselves during a snowstorm and the summer from He**. both of which pax were given the middle finger by UA as we were just told to be 'glad we got there safely when we got around to it'.
Jun 15, 2015, 11:06 pm
#260
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,187
And it is not just the cost to own the aircraft, each aircraft requires expensive ongoing maintenance, aircraft parking fees, and each aircraft would require crews (and crews are generally not certified across many fleet types). OMG. Even if one reduced it to EWR & SFO and only two types at each place. Do you want ticket prices to go up astronomically?
Now, it might make sense for UA, DL, & AA/US to collectively contract with a Canadian airline to keep a spare 757 or two at YQX or YYR to be made available for wet lease on short-notice on a first come, first serve basis. But that would require some anti-competitive talks.
Jun 15, 2015, 11:23 pm
#261
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Sydney,Australia
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Hadn't seen this posted..
http://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/...mare-1.3114256
"We were a little bit caught off-guard, but I always try to find the positive in things," Jamie Snook, mayor of Happy Valley-Goose Bay tells As It Happens host Carol Off.
Jun 15, 2015, 11:28 pm
#262
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For my business we have backup equipment for nearly everything we run. For our small operation it blows my mind that UA does not have, at the ready, a spare frame for every type at each hub should something go MX or divert. I am even more baffled that there is not a rescue frame sitting on each US coast for just such a contingency. Maybe the rescue frame does a turn or two each day hub to hub to keep it somewhat utilized. But for a 763 to sit within 2-3 hours of multiple UA hubs and have pax returned to EWR after 20 hours is just the worst possible outcome of a irrops recovery I have seen. While the execs have been counting their money and options of late, I guess they forget how quickly the costs of these issues can chip away at the brand and pricing power. This reminds me of two events in UA history....the dumping of pax in Cody, WY for them to fend for themselves during a snowstorm and the summer from He**. both of which pax were given the middle finger by UA as we were just told to be 'glad we got there safely when we got around to it'.
Jun 15, 2015, 11:42 pm
#263
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Looks like these passengers got to London quicker than another group of passengers got to Shanghai in 2012. I still remember the coverage on that delay:
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/21/travel...gers-stranded/
And the discussion on the UA forum here:
Stranded in Alaska for two days by UAL - Advice?
And one quote from that thread that could just as well be about the Goose Bay diversion:
If there's a contest for worst travel experience of the year, United Airlines Flight 857 might be in the running.
The plane departed San Francisco on Sunday for a 13-hour trip to Shanghai. But most of the 262 passengers didn't get to China until Tuesday evening -- three days late -- after an unplanned and prolonged layover in Anchorage, Alaska.
About three hours into the flight, the United jetliner was diverted to Anchorage because of broken bathrooms. When a replacement plane arrived Monday, it also was grounded because of mechanical problems, prompting most of the passengers to catch a third plane Tuesday.
The plane departed San Francisco on Sunday for a 13-hour trip to Shanghai. But most of the 262 passengers didn't get to China until Tuesday evening -- three days late -- after an unplanned and prolonged layover in Anchorage, Alaska.
About three hours into the flight, the United jetliner was diverted to Anchorage because of broken bathrooms. When a replacement plane arrived Monday, it also was grounded because of mechanical problems, prompting most of the passengers to catch a third plane Tuesday.
And the discussion on the UA forum here:
Stranded in Alaska for two days by UAL - Advice?
And one quote from that thread that could just as well be about the Goose Bay diversion:
Jun 15, 2015, 11:54 pm
#264
was thetravelingRedhead
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Side note about AA's twitter crew- asked them why they would sell a BIS-ORD-DOH ticket with a "short" (1 hour) connection time and about connections, got a rude response about how they don't know and to call reservations. ugh. so much to learn and so little time.
Jun 16, 2015, 12:55 am
#265
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I've read the whole thread and I agree, UA dropped the ball. On the surface, it sounds as if the Captain did a terrific job and again, without knowing all the facts, if he did indeed look after the 2 kids as reports indicate, then bravo to him.
While it may not be an appropriate analogy (and I will disclose that I am an Aussie but not beating the QF drum), it made me think of the QF32 incident and how the PIC handled the customer facing issues in the airport - after everyone was safely on the ground.
While it may not be an appropriate analogy (and I will disclose that I am an Aussie but not beating the QF drum), it made me think of the QF32 incident and how the PIC handled the customer facing issues in the airport - after everyone was safely on the ground.
The QF32 incident made headlines around the world but beyond the airmanship, leadership and teamwork on the flight deck, Captain de Crespigny then instinctively continued to lead when back in the terminal with his passengers (customers).
Despite his emotional and physical exhaustion from piloting and managing the crisis over four hours in the air and on the ground, he then assumed the role of customer service and Public Relations (PR) representative for Qantas, Airbus and Rolls-Royce.
He didn’t need to refer to a manual to do a masterful job because the culture within Qantas empowered him with shared values of transparency and service excellence.
Rather than leave it to PR and customer service people, he took charge and when every passenger was safely in the terminal he went and spoke to them saying: “When you fly Qantas you’re flying with a premium airline and you have every right to expect more. An army of Qantas staff are right now finding you hotel rooms and working out how to get you to Sydney as soon as possible. But right now I want you to write down this number – it’s my personal mobile phone and I want you to call me if you think Qantas is not looking after you or if you think that Qantas does not care.”
Then he explained what had happened, why, what would happen next and disclosed everything he knew. He answered every possible question in multiple passenger lounges for over two hours. He prepared everyone for the media circus that would ensue and stayed in the lounge with passengers until there were no more questions – eventually he was standing on his own.
Source: http://www.thefordhamcompany.com.au/...ou-about-qf32/
Despite his emotional and physical exhaustion from piloting and managing the crisis over four hours in the air and on the ground, he then assumed the role of customer service and Public Relations (PR) representative for Qantas, Airbus and Rolls-Royce.
He didn’t need to refer to a manual to do a masterful job because the culture within Qantas empowered him with shared values of transparency and service excellence.
Rather than leave it to PR and customer service people, he took charge and when every passenger was safely in the terminal he went and spoke to them saying: “When you fly Qantas you’re flying with a premium airline and you have every right to expect more. An army of Qantas staff are right now finding you hotel rooms and working out how to get you to Sydney as soon as possible. But right now I want you to write down this number – it’s my personal mobile phone and I want you to call me if you think Qantas is not looking after you or if you think that Qantas does not care.”
Then he explained what had happened, why, what would happen next and disclosed everything he knew. He answered every possible question in multiple passenger lounges for over two hours. He prepared everyone for the media circus that would ensue and stayed in the lounge with passengers until there were no more questions – eventually he was standing on his own.
Jun 16, 2015, 2:17 am
#266
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Now, it might make sense for UA, DL, & AA/US to collectively contract with a Canadian airline to keep a spare 757 or two at YQX or YYR to be made available for wet lease on short-notice on a first come, first serve basis. But that would require some anti-competitive talks.
Jun 16, 2015, 2:35 am
#267
Join Date: Aug 2013
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Not trying to be a Pollyanna but....
None of us are route planners. I'm sure UA was in touch with LHR and would've continued direct if it made sense ... Or not.
Honestly, were that me, I'd have preferred the return to EWR before continuing to LHR. With my travel patterns, if I were a day or so late getting to LHR, it's likely be a trip in vain, so I'd rather just go home.
Now, in an ideal world, they would've polled the passengers, asked 'who wants to continue and who wants to go back?' and flew two planes in - one to EWR and one to LHR. Might've been able to sub a pair of 752's instead of a 763 this way.
We know LHR has among the most restrictive set of landing slots and rules, so I'm sure that plays into this somehow as well.
Lots of armchair route planning possible - some of which will be right, some of which won't.
But the simple fact is that none of us are armed with all the info the ops center people had; things are ALWAYS a lot more complex than they seem.
None of us are route planners. I'm sure UA was in touch with LHR and would've continued direct if it made sense ... Or not.
Honestly, were that me, I'd have preferred the return to EWR before continuing to LHR. With my travel patterns, if I were a day or so late getting to LHR, it's likely be a trip in vain, so I'd rather just go home.
Now, in an ideal world, they would've polled the passengers, asked 'who wants to continue and who wants to go back?' and flew two planes in - one to EWR and one to LHR. Might've been able to sub a pair of 752's instead of a 763 this way.
We know LHR has among the most restrictive set of landing slots and rules, so I'm sure that plays into this somehow as well.
Lots of armchair route planning possible - some of which will be right, some of which won't.
But the simple fact is that none of us are armed with all the info the ops center people had; things are ALWAYS a lot more complex than they seem.
Terrible job on this one UA!
Jun 16, 2015, 2:44 am
#268
Join Date: May 2005
Programs: UA 2MM Plat, AA Exec Plat, SPG Plat
Posts: 24
for reference, the captain was female. so many comments that "he" took after the pax and children... just an interesting observation.
she was soft spoken and you could barely hear her emergency announcement. but, she did a hell of a job getting us there safely and indeed took care of those unaccompanied minors.
UAL processed my refund. Shame it was only that leg, as it was 1/3 the cost of the inbound to ORD.
The whole experience does make me question my loyalty to United. Granted, I have home bases in Chicago and London, so it makes it super convenient. Plus, lifetime Platinum is a nice perk. But seeing the ridiculous Mx experience (our plane diverted, backup plane grounded, more maintenance in Goose Bay, another emergency landing while there) makes me really question their maintenance strategy and/or fleet age.
she was soft spoken and you could barely hear her emergency announcement. but, she did a hell of a job getting us there safely and indeed took care of those unaccompanied minors.
UAL processed my refund. Shame it was only that leg, as it was 1/3 the cost of the inbound to ORD.
The whole experience does make me question my loyalty to United. Granted, I have home bases in Chicago and London, so it makes it super convenient. Plus, lifetime Platinum is a nice perk. But seeing the ridiculous Mx experience (our plane diverted, backup plane grounded, more maintenance in Goose Bay, another emergency landing while there) makes me really question their maintenance strategy and/or fleet age.
Jun 16, 2015, 3:20 am
#269
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I've read the whole thread and I agree, UA dropped the ball. On the surface, it sounds as if the Captain did a terrific job and again, without knowing all the facts, if he did indeed look after the 2 kids as reports indicate, then bravo to him.
While it may not be an appropriate analogy (and I will disclose that I am an Aussie but not beating the QF drum), it made me think of the QF32 incident and how the PIC handled the customer facing issues in the airport - after everyone was safely on the ground.
While it may not be an appropriate analogy (and I will disclose that I am an Aussie but not beating the QF drum), it made me think of the QF32 incident and how the PIC handled the customer facing issues in the airport - after everyone was safely on the ground.
The QF32 incident made headlines around the world but beyond the airmanship, leadership and teamwork on the flight deck, Captain de Crespigny then instinctively continued to lead when back in the terminal with his passengers (customers).
Despite his emotional and physical exhaustion from piloting and managing the crisis over four hours in the air and on the ground, he then assumed the role of customer service and Public Relations (PR) representative for Qantas, Airbus and Rolls-Royce.
He didn’t need to refer to a manual to do a masterful job because the culture within Qantas empowered him with shared values of transparency and service excellence.
Rather than leave it to PR and customer service people, he took charge and when every passenger was safely in the terminal he went and spoke to them saying: “When you fly Qantas you’re flying with a premium airline and you have every right to expect more. An army of Qantas staff are right now finding you hotel rooms and working out how to get you to Sydney as soon as possible. But right now I want you to write down this number – it’s my personal mobile phone and I want you to call me if you think Qantas is not looking after you or if you think that Qantas does not care.”
Then he explained what had happened, why, what would happen next and disclosed everything he knew. He answered every possible question in multiple passenger lounges for over two hours. He prepared everyone for the media circus that would ensue and stayed in the lounge with passengers until there were no more questions – eventually he was standing on his own.
Source: http://www.thefordhamcompany.com.au/...ou-about-qf32/Despite his emotional and physical exhaustion from piloting and managing the crisis over four hours in the air and on the ground, he then assumed the role of customer service and Public Relations (PR) representative for Qantas, Airbus and Rolls-Royce.
He didn’t need to refer to a manual to do a masterful job because the culture within Qantas empowered him with shared values of transparency and service excellence.
Rather than leave it to PR and customer service people, he took charge and when every passenger was safely in the terminal he went and spoke to them saying: “When you fly Qantas you’re flying with a premium airline and you have every right to expect more. An army of Qantas staff are right now finding you hotel rooms and working out how to get you to Sydney as soon as possible. But right now I want you to write down this number – it’s my personal mobile phone and I want you to call me if you think Qantas is not looking after you or if you think that Qantas does not care.”
Then he explained what had happened, why, what would happen next and disclosed everything he knew. He answered every possible question in multiple passenger lounges for over two hours. He prepared everyone for the media circus that would ensue and stayed in the lounge with passengers until there were no more questions – eventually he was standing on his own.
Jun 16, 2015, 3:42 am
#270
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 342
this plane diverted to YYR. YYT was in similar range...for a plane to divert to yyr over yyt means this pilot wanted to get the plane on the ground asap....so i think a lot of people are not realizing the seriousness of this.
but mind you we can agree ua screwed up recovery
but also mind you the closest major city is...far...Americans (Canadians included) kinda forget how remote and sparse Canada is.
https://www.google.co.za/maps/dir/St...53.3016826!3e0
i think ua had few choices. still sucks, but it's not like we know they had a spare in EWR that they were too cheap to use (unless someone on here has proven that?)
but mind you we can agree ua screwed up recovery
but also mind you the closest major city is...far...Americans (Canadians included) kinda forget how remote and sparse Canada is.
https://www.google.co.za/maps/dir/St...53.3016826!3e0
i think ua had few choices. still sucks, but it's not like we know they had a spare in EWR that they were too cheap to use (unless someone on here has proven that?)