T-15.01

Anyone who joined before shuttles existed, wouldn't have paid an initiation fee. And I referenced the social membership above.. Sorry I edited probably while you were posting your reply.

T-15.01

I accept the pitch of JS as a startup is a little confusing but anyones due diligence who is joining post mid 2016 when initiation fees were introduced, and who joined placing bulk of value of membership on empty legs (jet deals) is in my view a little unwise. Even so, to only get 1 empty leg that flies for a few hours, in a single year of membership, but never step foot on a plane again, associated with JS, is probably realizing close to if not exceeding the actual cost of membership that that member paid. Each has to do their own cost-benefit analysis though, for certain.

millions

There was an initiation fee of $3,000 when I learned about JetSmarter in February and when I joined a few weeks later. And there were very few shuttles at the time. Many of the members I know are from cities that had no shuttle access when they joined. But it's cakiwi's world, so we should all start thanking our lucky stars for every jetdeal we confirm.

T-15.01

Sorry, I wasn't aware initiation fees were brought in earlier than mid 2016...my mistake. I think the LA to NYC shuttle started a year ago, and by the time you joined there were at least 4 or so more. My due diligence prior to sign up vetted specifically which shuttle flights originated near where I travel from often. Sounds like you know people who signed up without shuttles departing from where they are, and for me, I probably wouldn't have done that as it would yield way less value.

For you, me and every other member... Surely it is a pretty simple situation. If you think the value you're getting is subpar, based for example on lack of deals confirming, you just don't renew right? I have a different perspective to you, obviously, and do consider myself fortunate to ever confirm a jetdeal as part of membership with JS. It's a bonus to me, unexpected, and each time a pleasant surprise. I fully get that you see and/or saw value directly as part of membership tied to the jet deals you could confirm on. While empty legs are a part of what JS market themselves on offering I haven't ever felt that they are marketing their membership (smart and sophisticated levels at least), on the basis of jetdeals being a big part of it. Those flights are unconfirmed, sporadic, often changed, and many members have variable at best success in getting on such flights. That said, I understand many many flights in the app listed as deals still go off empty, so clearly there's not a lack of supply. Good luck nabbing a bunch this year and look forward to seeing you in the sky!

dordal

Has anybody done a real comparison of time saved on shuttles vs. commercial? I'm not talking theoretical, but more 'what happens in real life'. For example, I could show up 10 mins before departure for a shuttle flight, but I probably wouldn't, because I'd risk missing it. I could show up 30 mins before departure for a commercial flight ( at most airports most times of the day ), but I wouldn't, because I'd risk missing it.

My back of the envelope math with realistic numbers:

NY-SF (downtown to downtown)
Shuttle (HPN-OAK): Uber to heliport ( 10 mins ); wait for chopper ( 20 min ); flight to HPN (20 mins); boarding & takeoff (30 mins), flight to OAK ( 5 hrs ) ; car to downtown SF ( 35 mins ). TOTAL: 6 hr 55 min
Commercial (JFK-SFO): Uber to JFK ( 40 mins ); go through security, get to gate, board ( 1 hr ); flight to SFO ( 5 hrs ); get through SFO to get Uber ( 15 mins ); get downtown ( 25 mins ): TOTAL: 7 hr 20 mins

So that's a total timesavings of 25 mins, or about 6%.

Certainly I understand there are lots of reasons to fly private, but timesavings is a big one, and as I'm doing the math I'm wondering if the Jetsmarter 'shared private' idea really saves all that much time. Maybe better on the shorter routes?

Curious if anybody has done any real-life comparisons, and how they stack up.

T-15.01

as you suggest, on longer flights it becomes a diminishing return (private vs commercial) as a general rule, but even in your example above there are some considerations worthy of inclusion;

1) driving Manhattan to HPN or JFK is about the same (40 minutes) (if time truly is the motivator, then driving to heliport to wait, to helicopter, to wait, to fly is probably not what you'd do - you'd instead drive as close to departure as you could safely do so)
2) technically turning up to the FBO 30 minutes before is ideal and per JS requirements, however, turning up with less than 10 minutes is still possible.
3) technically turning up to JFK 1 hour before is ideal, however, it assumes best case scenario. There are so many variables with commercial that affect on-time performance. Crew. Inbound Aircraft. Another flight coming in that has pax connecting so they keep your outbound one on the ground, to name but a few. I missed a commercial the other day being in security for 45 minutes (priority line), thinking 60 minutes before departure was sufficient. I ran to the gate and was there 8 minutes prior to departure, and the door was closed.
4) Generally private aircraft fly higher, and faster. to suggest the same route would yield same flight time is likely inaccurate.

My quick 'apples to apples' comparison would be as follows:
Private: drive to HPN, give yourself only 15 minutes, fly, and into the city. (40m + 15m + 4h45m + 25m)
Commercial: drive to JFK, give yourself only 60 minutes, fly, deplane, into the city (same end point) (40m + 60m + 5h + 25m + 25m)

5h5m vs 7h30m = A commercial traveler would SAVE 32% more time to fly private instead of his/her normal commercial commute; the private traveler would have to absorb 47.5% more time to elect going commercial instead of his/her normal private commute. In either case, the differential is pretty big even aside from comfort factors and mental health benefits commuting private affords.

gold23

I also personally know 3 JS members who live and work in Westchester county. While they each have major concerns with their membership, the time savings to them is substantial. All depends on starting point....

dval44

My problem with this math is the penalty for missing each is so different. One is waiting an hour or two for the next plane, and the other is literally being charged $5,000. So while 15 minutes is "enough," you are one traffic jam away from losing $5k. Also, I have pre check and rarely spend more than 5-10 minutes going through security.

Onto some other thoughts:

Any ideas on what the next 12 months will look like?

I would personally love to see them add more empty legs. Maybe NetJets, maybe some others? Any ideas? Any new routes? Do they have any stated goals?

Does anyone understand the pricing algorithm they use for charters? Anecdotally, I've found that 2 days out is the cheapest, and the same route on the same planes is more expensive a week out, month out, etc. Kind of strange.

Does anyone else have any good sources of empty legs? I check JetSmarter, 8760, and starting today "SuiteDeals" on Jet Suite. Any other good deals to be checking?

Last JS experience was being left at the FBO with a canceled flight and a "sorry" 5 mins before takeoff. So looking for something awesome to get me going again

dval44

To answer my own question, here is an article I read yesterday on SeekingAlpha with an excerpt here:

In a recent interview, I spoke at some length with CEO Petrossov about his vision for JetSmarter.

So far, the company has perfected the capability to move its members safely and efficiently from point A to point B.

Petrossov wants to expand the vision of JetSmarter to develop a 'social network' that not only moves members between destinations but also provides them with unique, curated experiences at those destinations and the ability to create new friendships or business contacts in the process.

Petrossov calls it "Country Club 2.0". In the past, members would have to join a club and go to it for benefits.

Now, with JetSmarter's concept, the country club comes to you, delivers you to your destination, provides unique experiences and the ability to connect build relationships with other, like-minded individuals.

The company is in the process of building out partnerships with major brands, restaurants, nightlife establishments and other relevant operators in the cities that it travels most to.

In addition to expanding to Asia and South America, plans include adding turboprop flight operations to provide additional flight options and possibly a lower membership price tier for shorter distance travel needs.

JetSmarter appears to be in the lead in developing its Uber-like capability for the private jet transportation vertical.

If it can succeed in developing global coverage along with a defensible offering of services and social networking to its premium membership, the company could be a potentially high-value acquisition target for Uber or other transportation companies.

JetSmarter certainly has the resources to expand its reach and add value to its membership.

Now, it's time for Petrossov and his team to execute and create his vision of 'social aviation.'

http://seekingalpha.com/article/4033...tation-network

gold23

Well, that'll certainly shrink the JS demo. I would venture that over 50% of us want nothing to do with a social, country club type of atmosphere on a flight.

I've long felt that management's youth and a completely misguided marketing plan will be the primary reason a great concept sinks....

Townshend

Shuttles in Florida launched (Orlando and Tampa to FLL)

mile3

Along with FLL <=> Nassau

dval44

Hi,

There currently about 4 total empty legs in the US.

0 xojets, 0 delta private jets...

Anyone have insight on this? Pure coincidence with no jets flying? Just a system update? Thoughts?

Thanks!

dordal

Yeah I'm a little worried about that too.

Zero XO and zero DPJ; yesterday or today. I can't imagine they both would have stopped flying.

So it's either a tech issue, or the contract is up. Hoping it's not the latter.

millions

Weekends are always very light. I wouldn't be surprised if there were contract terms limiting Fri-Sun access.