Has anyone got any smart ideas on how we can put pressure on FFPs to get the web-sites in reasonable order?

This morning I have tried to get balances from the following:

British Airways: Logged in OK, although the numbers were way out.

American Airlines: Error Loading Page.

Hilton: Unable to locate server.

Marriott: Uses Bizmiles for its statements, which as we all know if just a joke.


Why arn't we doing more to encouage the FFPs to improve standards? Perhaps a truely customers representative organisation should give 'black marks' for poor performance to supplement the plethora of awards for good service?

In simple language, these schemes are constantly getting pats on the back. How about the occassional kick up the....


Nick




[This message has been edited by Merry (edited 05-11-99).]

Ooooh, Merry, now your TALKING! Here is an award that would generate some serious competition. Call them the Terrible Ten:

Worst Airline Mileage Program
Worst Hotel Program
Worst Credit/Charge Program
Worst Overall Web Site
Worst Web Site Mileage Summary
Worst First Class Service
Worst Coach Class Service
Worst Airline Lounge Value
Worst Customer Service
And the Least Coveted Award of the Year:
Program that has done the most over the past 12 months to screw their most loyal customers.

Randy, this is JUST the sort of thing that would make a big difference for the frequent flying community! Nothing like a little sunshine to send the cockroaches scurrrying! Not to mention the press and increased circulation it'd get for you! And not to worry, I'm sure no one here would even want credit for the idea !!!!!

[This message has been edited by Matt Wald (edited 05-11-99).]

I used to believe that was one of the purposes and functions of Randy's organization. But after seeing the article in InsideFlyer where tons of ink is slung in BA's direction and very little in UA's (the most pathetic airline online site in the industry) I have strong doubts...

I am confident that Randy and his people will do something - will you?

[This message has been edited by Rudi (edited 05-11-99).]

(double-sorry)

[This message has been edited by Rudi (edited 05-11-99).]

I don't think you should count on Randy's InsideFlyer to get out front on a top ten worst list. He has clearly tried to lead the industry with a carrot, and not a stick, which is certainly important when you are an organization which counts on deriving revenue, at least indirectly, from industry-related sources. Therefore, I don't think Inside Flyer will sponsor this.
At the very least, however, we ought to consider voting on the nominations ourselves, using Matt's list as the categories. If a consensus to do so develops, we could create a new Buzz topic for each of the 10, and then vote on them online.
Maybe Inside Flyer, although not sponsoring it outright, might then at least give a modicum of attention to it, such as running an article on what its readers think.

Djlawman

PS--casting my early vote for worst web site mileage summary, has to be Marriott's use of biz miles.

Marriott - bizmile is "only" an update of points and/or miles-account problem. The general program informations on Marriott's homepages (programs, rules, promotions) are acceptable

UA's website is not only a mileage-update-problem (hopefully and promissed soon solved). UA's online-information is for the mileage-program poor, often uncomplete and months behind (years: mileage-plus-guide for US members dates back to summer 1997!, months: Ansett/Air NewZealand miles count as UA-status-miles since jan-1-99) or show up never (most bonus-miles promotions outside the US).

I, for one, have been reasonably satisfied with online access to my United account. I use United connection on PC to verify my United flights, they normally post within two days. And I use the United web site to verify partner activity - this usually takes longer to post simply because partner activity can take upto 3 months to post. I am willing to accept a 2 day lag for flight postings.

What I would like to see improved:
- faster posting of partner activity (ALL airlines are pretty bad on this).
- better web site information on bonus miles and offers. Here the United web site could use a lot of improvement. At the very least they could direct an employee to read Inside Flyer on the 1st of the month, and update their web site using information from Inside Flyer.

DJlawman raises an interesting point that I'd like to see Randy or the rest of the gang at Inside Flyer comment on.

I had assumed initially that FT was a forum where we could honestly and without inhibition comment on the FF and affinity programs. Now, I have seen posts about surveys and miles removed.

I had assumed Inside Flyer could work as a frequent fliers' advocate - sort of a "Consumer Reports" of miles and points. Unfortunately, I don't know if Inside Flyer is prepared to take such a stand in fear of alienating an industry that advertizies in the publication and covets the (Freddie) awards.

I'd love to see a public statement from Inside Flyer, perhaps even included on the masthead of the magazine, that indicates that the honest and truthful reporting of the industry is a standard that will not be compromised by any "relationship" with any companies, and that FT will remain an un-edited forum where non-obscene posts will have that same protection, regardless if the contributor agrees or disagrees with a majority view, or even if it offends an airline or hotel. After all, they do have the same opportunity as we do to officially join the discussion, rebut the post, and truly engage in a meaningful dialog.

Randy?

[This message has been edited by NJDavid (edited 05-11-99).]

A very excellent point, NJD. By the nature of most of us being here and sharing the "good, the bad, & the ugly" (excuse me Clint), there should be some advocacy as to what we say. However, your major point translated is, "Money Talks, People Walk"!!!

OK, I'm on board. Let's do something. I suppose we could release "The Good, The Bad and the Ugly" when it comes to the digital mile. Let me think about how I could post up a balloting similar to the Freddies but only applying to this particular area. I'm willing to provide the forum, let's continue with the ideas over the next few days and we'll take the best of them and put into action. Airlines have staked a future in this area, it does make all the sense in the world that it works. I'm actually going to be in Chicago on May 13/14 (Thursday/Friday) at a national conference titled "@Travel" where I'll start some grilling questions to some of the people there. BTW, Bob Crandall, the former head of American Airlines is scheduled to speak. Ideas all?

Thanks Randy,

I think my post may have been taken too literally though. What I was trying to nurture discussion on was:

- Is one of the purposes of this forum to press for service improvements?
- Is this something we should be doing?
- Is this something your company does?
- Is this something your company should be doing?
- Is this something your company is prepared to do?

What prompted this was your artice in the US edition (perhaps non-US citizens don't use the internet?) of InsideFlyer about the problems with various web-sites.

It is one of the few times I have heard anything which could vaguely called lobbying on the part of Inside Flyer. But I am unaware of any contact being made with the airlines saying "this is unacceptable".

The nature of the artice is one of a factual account of what is going on and a promise to monitor things. My point was what positive action is beign taken to push progress.

Is this something you feel you do or should do, or is this something we need to go off-line to achieve? If indeed people think we should be trying to achieve this.

Nick

PS: I think you took a couple of comments about BA and blew them out of all proportion, but that is another story.

Thank you for your reply, Randy. However, the point in which I am most interested is from NJDavid's post, and I quote:

"the honest and truthful reporting of the industry is a standard that will not be compromised by any "relationship" with any companies, and that FT will remain an un-edited forum where non-obscene posts will have that same protection, regardless if the contributor agrees or disagrees with a majority view, or even if it offends an airline or hotel. After all, they do have the same opportunity as we do to officially join the discussion, rebut the post, and truly engage in a meaningful dialog."

While I like Matt's idea of being able to vote on the bottom ten, and I applaud you Randy for even considering facilitating such a step, I too would like answers as posed by Merry and a commitment as outlined by NJD and emphasized by Jaws...

Back to you...

I think that this forum is appropriate to press for service improvements. I often send email to airlines/hotels/cars with comments on their web sites. Unfortunately most of the time I seem to get back a template reply. I applaud Rudi's effort a while back to press United airlines for improvements on their web site. The more we all can get involved, the better we have a chance to get our voice heard.

I have often posted articles critical of companies, even of Inside Flyer. Not one of my post has been censored or deleted. Is this a real problem?