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Originally Posted by TheChallenge
(Post 21406793)
If you provide a passport the CVS clerk has to manually key in your info; expiration, birth date, and ID number. The scanner didn't seem to have the ability to scan the bar code located in the back.
By accident I can also confirm if you buy 5k with one form of ID, you are able to buy an additional 5k with a different ID within the same twenty-four hour period. I used my DL one night around 10pm to purchase, then knowing I was leaving town for a week I stopped in at a different CVS around 6am the next morning to pick up another 5k using my passport. I didn't realize until later that day I sidetracked the 5k rule. |
Originally Posted by KYBOSH
(Post 21404890)
Its to a point. Educate them on how to do their job where it concerns you. Whether they put the cookies in the feminine hygiene section is no concern to me. Today was a new spin on the Cash Only front. Walked in around lunch time hoping to get 2 reloads. Cashier, who has rung me up before, stated that they are doing cash only as of now. She called the MOD for backup when I pushed back and the MOD said that because something funny has been going on with these cards they are doing cash only for now. Said I can come speak to the real manager when he comes in. Apparently, if what she says is to be believed, something is going on over in the next county with these cards recently. She then said, unsolicited that if corporate customer service instructed them to sell them then they would. Of course, CVS CS is closed on the weekend. This applied to ALL GCs and not just the reloads.
This is the same store that, just last night, said it was 1k a day and they had to be rang up on separate receipts. Honestly I would not be bothered with these guys but its the only store in the immediate area that has reloads. Its tucked in the cut so you would never find it. The MOD was sympathetic (or at least feigned sympathy) so I took it as she knew what the deal was with these cards. She says everything was all good until recently. Perhaps this means until a new face popped in and started buying up their reloads. We've seen this before with Office Depot/Max. When something is happening that they don't understand their instinct is to switch to cash only mode until whatever's happening passes. Debating on what I should do... I REALLY want to go and meet with the manager and get a read for what is going on. Let them know that we/I am not a threat and establish a repore with them. But I don't know how a customer who has intimate knowledge with this particular policy will come across. I find the only way to get more info or even having a chance of changing their policy is to engage them. Its the tone and tenor of the confrontation I think that will make all the difference. ya know... meeting the mgr and asking them what is going on, and even showing the fact that they are wrong and that cvs can sell these to cc COULD be of use, but at the same time it could backfire and go against the DO NOT CALL theory of most things miles. It's almost better to--wait for it--"liberate" the stacks of VRs from the store and bring them all to the racks of a different CVS and carry on as usual. :D:D:D Oh I know there will be a firestorm on that comment, but assuming this has NOT been done or we have no plans to actually do it, many here will see the logic in it: Talking to the CVS manager, while seemingly the right thing to do and the most, let's say ethical and professional thing to do, could result in them placing further restrictions on this product or on you as a buyer of it. They could black list you just because they can and all you were doing is being honest and upfront. (I have seen this kind of thing happen before btw and it is sad that being honest can get you barred from something but it happens!) And yet, secretly snagging the products and moving them all to a different store (which is something real CVS managers actually do legitimately btw) is sneaky, is considered theft by some and at the very least, scammy in the minds of others, but if carried out in stealth, would actually yield the results that you and all other area VR shoppers could now enjoy when later buying them from the other stores legally! Just think about that people... from a sheer philosophical standpoint and from the standpoint of how things actually sadly are when it comes to how retail treat GC customers, not necessarily what may be right or wrong based on any laws. But hey, what could REALLY be going on is my other theory here: Bancorp has collected enough data on this VR buyer and has told CVS to politely restrict or bar him. Why did they do that? Because this buyer gives his ID and lets them collect his patterns and data when he buys +$1k of VR per visit (People here say they like to buy as many as possible when in a CVS so as to be convenient and make it easy). On that note, imagine if this were the case? Why, then, on the heals of the horrid disaster of the HIGCs (also a Bancorp card btw) would people want to give Bancorp so much power over things? Think about it:
It's not what SHOULD BE, people... It is what IS. |
Okay, just got back from meeting with the manager and I gotta say it went as well as I could have hoped. When I got there she was standing at the counter ringing another customer up. I've seen her before and she actually okayed a previous purchase VR when the cashier was unsure. I'll call her Sweety. Also in attendance was the cashier who stated the cash only policy last night. She was sitting behind the counter eating a peach.
I walked up to Peaches and told her I was taking her up on their offer to see the head manager. She motioned to Sweety and I smiled as I realized that Sweety was present at one of my previous visits. But thought Sweety was an assistant manager when I met her before because she didn't carry herself like some tyrannical d-bag like a lot of other managers do. I explained to Sweety that Peaches and the MOD told me it was Cash Only on all gift cards the night before. Of course she said "No its not and that credit cards are accepted." I looked over at Peaches inquisitively as see was down to the peach pit but refused to put it down. LOL I then took the opening and started quizzing Sweety about any differences there might be in store policy with corporate policy. I asked about the limits and all that. She said there was no difference... store policy is in line with corporate policy. I then told her that I was in a few nights ago and the MOD said it was 1k a day and each card had to be rung up separately. I then pointed to the handwritten memo that the MOD checked that night. It was posted behind the counter. Sweety looked at it and said that was old and rules have since changed. Last test was to actually go for the gold. I asked her nicely "Okay, do you mind if I buy $5k today?" Her face to totally flustered and she looked as if she was going to need rebooting. She kinda asked (without asking) what was all this about. Seeing how well things were going up until this point I figured it couldn't hurt to give her a little intel (I would not have done this if the conversation would have gone the other way). So I told her that they were for miles and points and gave her an generic example - buying with your AMEX for MR points and using those points for travel. I know this may have been against the code but I felt I had to give her a reasonable explanation and not BS her. She thought about it for a second and you can see that it started she started relaxing a bit. I then told her that if she's uncomfortable with 5k I can do 1k today. She REALLY let her hair down then and was all smiles. I basically walked her through the transaction because while she knew about the ID scan I can tell that she didn't have a lot of experience do it (if any). That put her at ease even more as that illustrated that I have done this before ... a lot. When we finished the transaction she mentioned how it was "pretty neat" how I was getting points. I told her "yeah so could you please let your staff know that these can be purchased with a CC and what the new limits are?" She said she definitely would. I thanked Sweety and was out. Forgot to say by to Peaches though....darn. A few things: 1) I think this proves (at least in this area) that cash only policies are instituted as a protective measure when high value transactions start coming in all of the sudden and the staff dont know what to make of it. It could be the bookkeeper looks at the rolls and sees 10-20-30k in GC purchases for one day and has a ... moment. Fearing they are being hit by some fraud ring they switch to limp mode. Even when the storm has passed and no chargebacks come in they dont go back and tell the staff "OK everything is alright... you can go back to selling with a CC now." All the cashiers get it the elevated terror warning... but rarely hear then the threat level and been decreased. Unless they call a MOD and they okay the transaction. 2) One thing I realize is I/we (as churners) tend to forget that $500-$5k is A LOT OF MONEY. We are inoculated because we have 4-5 figures passing through our fingers everyday just about everyday. I realized this when I asked Sweety to ring up $5k and she just about had a heart attack. The thought of being on the hook (fraud) for $5k and possibly getting written up or even fired it too much for them. We are simply not worth the risk. If they deny the sale nothing happens to them. If they let a fraudulent sale go through something may happen to them. 3) Its important to ramp on new stores that aren't used to churners. Even if a few churners visit occasionally they maybe doing 1 VR at a time. As a new face, I definitely set off alarms. Especially with the high dollar amounts I was buying and the frequency I was visiting (once a day). 4) Social engineering is a MFer. I knew that if I was going to talk to the manager and convince them that I was not a threat spending 5k a pop I needed to look like money and not walk-in wearing my white tee and a pair of fresh air nike. So trimmed my facial hair, put on my golf shirt, a pair of Cole Haans and pulled the new MB out of the garage. As I was talking to Sweety (she did notice the MB FOB by the way) I was super nice, respectful and tried my darndest not to use any $10 words. Now that I have established myself I can go back to wearing my white-tee/jeans/sneakers and driving my daily driver (old honda civic) for my daily runs. |
Originally Posted by Marathon Man
(Post 21407274)
ya know...
meeting the mgr and asking them what is going on, and even showing the fact that they are wrong and that cvs can sell these to cc COULD be of use, but at the same time it could backfire and go against the DO NOT CALL theory of most things miles. It's almost better to--wait for it--"liberate" the stacks of VRs from the store and bring them all to the racks of a different CVS and carry on as usual. :D:D:D Oh I know there will be a firestorm on that comment, but assuming this has NOT been done or we have no plans to actually do it, many here will see the logic in it: Talking to the CVS manager, while seemingly the right thing to do and the most, let's say ethical and professional thing to do, could result in them placing further restrictions on this product or on you as a buyer of it. They could black list you just because they can and all you were doing is being honest and upfront. (I have seen this kind of thing happen before btw and it is sad that being honest can get you barred from something but it happens!) And yet, secretly snagging the products and moving them all to a different store (which is something real CVS managers actually do legitimately btw) is sneaky, is considered theft by some and at the very least, scammy in the minds of others, but if carried out in stealth, would actually yield the results that you and all other area VR shoppers could now enjoy when later buying them from the other stores legally! Just think about that people... from a sheer philosophical standpoint and from the standpoint of how things actually sadly are when it comes to how retail treat GC customers, not necessarily what may be right or wrong based on any laws. But hey, what could REALLY be going on is my other theory here: Bancorp has collected enough data on this VR buyer and has told CVS to politely restrict or bar him. Why did they do that? Because this buyer gives his ID and lets them collect his patterns and data when he buys +$1k of VR per visit (People here say they like to buy as many as possible when in a CVS so as to be convenient and make it easy). On that note, imagine if this were the case? Why, then, on the heals of the horrid disaster of the HIGCs (also a Bancorp card btw) would people want to give Bancorp so much power over things? Think about it:
It's not what SHOULD BE, people... It is what IS. Trust me I have thought of doing the VR shuffle a few times myself. But I dont want to be "that guy" who does that. Early on in my churning career I had unkind words for ppl that do that. So it would be something if I became to very people that I once loathed. Also, one thing I notice is that stores kinda know that they are out of stock with these things so if you keep bringing these things up to checkout they will suspect somethng is up with you. Case in point: Once when I had $500 Amex GCs to unload I tried to buy 5k worth. Unbeknownst to me the maximum number of different cards you can spit on a single transaction is 7-8. So when I got the the 8th card the registered cancelled the transaction out right. Well, the card 7 cards I had already spiked had already processed the preauthorizations on them (balances were effectively $0) and the hold wouldnt be released until the 8th day. :( Fearing that the cards may somehow get activated but not wanting the cashier to throw them away I put them back on the shelf but in a different spot (basically I hid them but there were more on the rack). When I came back on the 9th day, I noticed that all the VRs were OOS. Then I remembered that put a stash somewhere got them. When I walked up to the registered my friendly neighborhood cashier was ringing me up and then paused as if she remembered something. She asked "where did you get these because we have been OOS for a few day." I told her that I searched through the rack and these were stashed away in there. She said ppl have been coming in all day looking for them and they were telling them they were out. Now the cashier knows (of) me so I dont think she thinks Im a relocator but this shows that something like that wont go unnoticed for long. Now if they have an adequate stash and you are adding to their stock pile to keep them flush that's a different story entirely. :D With regards to Incomm banning customers on the retail level...that's crazy talk! LOL Incomm isn't going to send your picture to all the CVS' in your area telling them to look out for you. They are not going to create a joint Incomm/CVS taskforce and share intel on who's doing what. No way. LOL |
Kybosh,
This seems like a very reasonable way to handle things - I commend you. I think you got the best outcome you could have. Others may complain about CVS not abiding by the corporate $5k limit, but there is clearly a subjective level of comfort that needs to be taken into account. Your point about us not realizing that several thousand dollar GC purchases seems like a LOT to most people is something I will keep in mind. |
Originally Posted by KYBOSH
(Post 21408762)
With regards to Incomm banning customers on the retail level...that's crazy talk! LOL
Incomm isn't going to send your picture to all the CVS' in your area telling them to look out for you. They are not going to create a joint Incomm/CVS taskforce and share intel on who's doing what. No way. LOL I have seen this exact scenario take place with many who buy MOs or do many bill pays with debit cards at WMT. In that chain, at least, a market manager who wants to could shut you down fast, and state wide--for whatever reason THEY think they ought to even if it is not right. |
Originally Posted by KYBOSH
(Post 21408686)
snip
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Originally Posted by PaulMSN
(Post 21406902)
Unless they count from midnight to midnight.
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Originally Posted by greendx
(Post 21409002)
And the prize for re-inventing the wheel goes to.......KYBOSH
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Originally Posted by KYBOSH
(Post 21406701)
'Bert
Did they zip the DL with the scanner or run it through the reader? From my reading the 1D barcode can be formated in a number of different ways depending on the policies of the issuing state. For example, the UPC number 20133456789010185 has the expiration year in front, the DL number in middle and her birthday in the back. I think most licenses expire on your birthday so its pretty easy to know if the card is expired based on the expiration year and the DOB. The scanners at registers aren't made to read 2D barcodes Im pretty sure. So its either 1D or Magstrip. |
Originally Posted by Majuki
(Post 21405837)
Let us know how it goes! ^
No sense in trying to get more than the 1K, and create an issue/problem. Rarely, at this CVS have I ever seen fewer than 40+ VRs on the rack. |
So I had my first great VR experience at CVS today. Hit one up near my inlaws for the second time. I had gone there 2-3 weeks ago and purchased 1K of VRs without really any issue. I had asked the cashier if there was a limit while he was ringing me up and was told 1K.
Today, went up to the register with 1K and chatted up the young cashier...asked her if there was a limit. I said "I know corporate has put in a 5K limit, but some stores still seem to be 1K." She said that she would have to ring them up in multiple transactions - that she can only do $1000 at a time - but that I can do more...just in multiple transactions. So I went back to the rack and took 3K total. She had some issues with the first transaction...I think just reading the register instruction codes and scanning my DL, etc. But the second batch went fine. Final 1K I got "alternate tender" required and I knew it must be a fraud alert. I told her I'd be right back, and went outside the store and had an e-mail on my phone from AMEX...called the #, authorized the charges, then went back in. As she was ringing up my 3rd batch, I told here the only reason I didn't buy more is that I didn't want to deal with a credit card alert, but now that I've got it taken care of, I'm going to go ahead and buy another set. So, I walked out with 4K total (just didn't want to push a good thing and go for 5K). I don't have my hopes up yet though as it definitely seems to be cashier specific at this location.... So...first big VR score...hope I can continue it.... |
Originally Posted by KYBOSH
(Post 21408686)
One thing I realize is I/we (as churners) tend to forget that $500-$5k is A LOT OF MONEY. We are inoculated because we have 4-5 figures passing through our fingers everyday just about everyday. I realized this when I asked Sweety to ring up $5k and she just about had a heart attack. The thought of being on the hook (fraud) for $5k and possibly getting written up or even fired it too much for them. We are simply not worth the risk. If they deny the sale nothing happens to them. If they let a fraudulent sale go through something may happen to them.
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Originally Posted by FlightNurse
(Post 21411709)
I have been saying this all along, when people walk into CVS and buy 20K of beans in one transaction, saff will get nervous about this and start making up rules so they will keep their jobs.
Sigh...it may happen to CVS near you if people start taking it to max ($5k) every time they visit. |
Originally Posted by KYBOSH
(Post 21406701)
'Bert
Did they zip the DL with the scanner or run it through the reader? From my reading the 1D barcode can be formated in a number of different ways depending on the policies of the issuing state. For example, the UPC number 20133456789010185 has the expiration year in front, the DL number in middle and her birthday in the back. I think most licenses expire on your birthday so its pretty easy to know if the card is expired based on the expiration year and the DOB. The scanners at registers aren't made to read 2D barcodes Im pretty sure. So its either 1D or Magstrip. |
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