MikeFromTokyo

I agree that they should aim to be more flexible than this at a luxury property, they used to be able to serve the Kozue Japanese breakfast without a reservation if it was available.

The Japanese breakfast at the PH is actually prepared in part by the chefs of Kozue, the Japanese restaurant, which is why they prefer to have advanced notice. In the past, when I would order this breakfast almost every day the waitstaff made sure to change the type of fish and some of the other items each day for more variety.

Hikki1224

I think there is a modern trend of pursuing mottainai* culture.

From Wiki: a Japanese term meaning "a sense of regret concerning waste when the intrinsic value of an object or resource is not properly utilized"

Not to mention, cost containment may also be another aspect of such a decision.
However, I believe the hotel has made such a decision based on a premise that they could obtain support from their patron.

RichardInSF

?????

hailstorm

Made perfect sense to me. Maybe you could help us out by elaborating on your confusion?

sensei

I will say that I found the need to pre-order the breakfast disappointing (whatever the reason may be). My rate was well north of $500 (adjusted for a complimentary 4th night) and at a luxury property I would expect the hotel to cater to guests' wishes, and not the other way around. I think a lot of that experience is mottainai. Isn't that part of the point of a luxury stay?

What is also annoying is that they request you commit to a specific time for breakfast. Personally, I like walking down to breakfast without a reservation and at my leisure.

By the way, one night I requested the breakfast around 8:30PM and had to wait ten minutes for a call back to verify availability. It sounded like it was far from an automatic request. To their credit, management noticed this, and without prompting from me, I was approached after breakfast the following morning and assured that they would most certainly have the Japanese breakfast for me the following morning.

To be sure, this is otherwise still a stellar property.

RTW1

That's exactly my position as well..... pre-ordering and setting a fixed time is not my idea of how breakfast should be done. It's annoying enough for dinner :-).

Pickles

Actually, although the PHT is my favorite hotel in Tokyo, it is, in my opinion, the least westernized of the top tier hotels: FSM, Peninsula, Shangri-La, MO, RC (and maybe the GHT), and setting aside the Imperial and the Okura, which are a notch below from the top ranks at this point. Over the years, they remain with excellent service, but it has become more and more Japanese over time.

My sense is that it caters primarily to a Japanese crowd, given the bang-up wedding business it does, the staycationers, and the mid-day romp room rental system, and they have turned their attitude towards that.

They can be incredibly tin-eared in their policies, and sometimes rather rigid on how they conduct their business. Sometimes it feels like I'm staying at a ryokan or eating at a high-end Japanese restaurant in Japan. To be clear, I love ryokans and high-end Japanese restaurants, but it takes a certain level of acceptance that the rules are the rules, and how breaking the rules is a reflection on you being rude rather than the establishment being unreasonable with the rules.

Exhibit A is clearly the sub-thread above on the Japanese breakfast preordering shenanigans. That's classic Japanese crank attitude, and the expectation is that guests would "understand", rather than the more Western approach of "breakfast is breakfast, how dare you constrain how I take my breakfast. And make it snappy!".

hailstorm

Not that it makes your point of view any less valid, but I've not heard any complaints from a Japanese on this. My general experience is that, if you tell them in advance what needs to be done, they will generally accept it. And I'm guessing that their assumption is that the majority of interest in the Japanese breakfast will come from their Japanese patrons.

MikeFromTokyo

At a high-end hotel a guest should not be given a deadline to order breakfast, or be forced to commit to a specific time to do anything. At a proper hotel everything revolves around the convenience of guests and their complete satisfaction.

Some hotels like Four Seasons Marunouchi and the Peninsula are better than others, but all of the Tokyo hotels suffer from this type of inflexibility and strict enforcement of "rules." This type of nonsense occasionally makes me furious, which fortunately results in prompt service recovery and no further issues for the rest of a stay.

hailstorm

That's your opinion. Which is fine for you to have. But in reality, 100% customer satisfaction has to be balanced against the logistics of running a business. Which is why, for example, you no longer see hotels employing in-house doctors for their guests' convenience.

If the need to reserve one specific type of breakfast, which would seem to adversely impact a very small subset of guests, somehow prevents a greater inconvenience or offers a greater advantage in other areas to the majority of guests, then I'm happy with them making that trade off.

MikeFromTokyo

It is understandable that the hotel should recommend advance reservations to guarantee availability, but they should prepare a certain number of breakfasts to accommodate last minute orders, as they previously have done. When staying at a luxury hotel guests are paying to get what they want when they want it.

OsakaWino

Does this mean that there is now no Japanese breakfast available without pre-order, with a specific time reservation? Or is this for a 'special' bento type breakfast?

If there is no Japanese breakfast available other than pre-order or buffet, than I would consider that substandard even for a lower level hotel.

If the pre-order is just for a 'special' type but a standard type is otherwise available, I see nothing wrong with that. Special meals would by definition either require pre-order or be limited to a preset qty.

What do they do for someone checking in late after the time for pre-order is past? Tell them if they want Japanese food for breakfast they will have to eat with the cattle at the buffet? (I'm fine with a buffet for free, but I would never pay for it; really hate jostling with a bunch of undisciplined brats and stupid women with their swinging carry-all handbags.)

There are a good many older wealthy Japanese who do not like eating Western food for breakfast, and I imagine they will not return to the PH if they are told there is no Japanese breakfast available when they want it.

amaroo

Stayed Oct this year, can concur with others - no Japanese B'fast without previous evening order.

We ordered it for our second night stay - brilliant, can see why pre-order is required.

If you want it & are arriving late - just mention it when you confirm the booking. No different to when you need to book an in-house fine dining experience.

OsakaWino

That might be true if it is some sort of special breakfast, but to have no alternative Japanese food for breakfast is ridiculous. Rather like not having eggs on the breakfast menu without pre-order at a US hotel.

The HR Osaka has Japanese a la carte room service breakfast available 24 hours. I'm sure it pales in comparison with the PH's Japanese breakfast, but at least something is always available, the same with eggs.

amaroo

I'm no expert. However, they did have a Japanese spread on the buffet. Maybe the market is just not there for a full on B'fast.

I'm thinking if it was - it would be offered.