Consolidated "Points Devaluation" thread

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Jun 9, 2019 | 8:57 am
  #1486  
Hilton Devaluation have now absolutely going nuts.
I guess their redemption system made this change several years ago. An (semi-fixed and unpublished) award chart for limited number of reward rooms, as well as surge pricing, which will be the points redemption option, once reward rooms are fully booked. In this case, you're basically using points to pay flexible rate at (pretty terrible) Honors-cash exchange rate, sometimes can be low as 0.2 cents per point.

The following list is points per night for some random dates from now till July:
Conrad Centennial Singapore: 126k
Conrad Tokyo: 215k
Conrad Bora Bora Nui: 346k
Waldorf Astoria Jerusalem: 352k
Hilton Moorea: 229k
Hilton Tel Aviv: 244k
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Jun 9, 2019 | 10:17 am
  #1487  
Quote: Excuse the ignorance but I am relatively new to Hilton, is there no awards chart available with Hilton say for example I have 30,000 points and I want to see where I can use that points? is there anywhere I can find out which options I would be able to chose from?
You have to search for a particular hotel on a particular date and see what its costs.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 10:47 am
  #1488  
Disappointing to see the increase when just few days ago I saw Hilton Tokyo for 60K/night in November.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 10:54 am
  #1489  
Quote: Excuse the ignorance but I am relatively new to Hilton, is there no awards chart available with Hilton say for example I have 30,000 points and I want to see where I can use that points? is there anywhere I can find out which options I would be able to chose from?
They don't publish a chart anymore. As noted below, you can figure out a property's standard rate by running searches. That rate has now gone up (yet again) at many properties.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 10:57 am
  #1490  
Quote: Excuse the ignorance but I am relatively new to Hilton, is there no awards chart available with Hilton say for example I have 30,000 points and I want to see where I can use that points? is there anywhere I can find out which options I would be able to chose from?
You can use them at any property using points + cash.

You may find a better value by finding a 30K room though.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 11:17 am
  #1491  
Registered Aspire cad yesterday for the 120,000 bonus points. Haven't charged anything and leaning towards not. To me, 120,000 points is now about 75,000. Not the same deal.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 12:16 pm
  #1492  
Quote: And AMEX has been giving large sign-up bonuses on Hilton cards for many years. Not to mention that, the larger the bonuses, the higher the breakage, which means a significant number of those bonus points will never be used.

In any event, not sure why the purported economic geniuses here seem to believe that increased points float somehow justifies a no-notice devaluation. That is a complete non sequitur.

Finally, since this is not an open market, but rather one in which Hilton and the properties exercise exclusive control over inventory and pricing, the analogy to currency devaluation in an open market is completely inapt. Hilton certainly can keep prices unchanged. The result would be more points competing for the same number of rooms, i.e., it would be harder to redeem for the desirable properties. This is an inherent characteristic of a market in which prices are fixed. An award chart is by definition price fixing, and it can be expected to throw the demand curve out of whack, since prices are set by Hilton, not the market.
While they have been giving points out for many years, churning has definitely increased. 10 years ago, it was not what it is today, and that is a fact. Hilton is also guilty of giving out Diamond way easier.

You're reaching very deep to attempt to articulate these points have no cash value and instead were promised to be redeemed for a certain award chart. Care to show me this award chart that is implied Hilton guaranteed to everyone before they pulled the rug out? Or is this something you feel entitled to because XYZ? You said it yourself that by keeping prices unchanged, demand would likely exceed supply. Since you seem to be more of the "purported economic genius," what kind of sense would such a business model make? We're quick to point out the negatives, by holding points, they could be worth less. Inversely, should the points appreciate in value if we hold onto them longer, and they are redeemable for properties who have far exceeded their cash value for when we once earned the points?

I think you also need to re-educate yourself on what an open market is. Here is the definition according to Merriam-Webster. Take it up with them that they are wrong, and you are right
Quote:

open market
Definition of open market

: an economic market in which prices are based on competition among private businesses and not controlled by a government : free market
"How much is it worth on the open market?"
Look, I'm not defending Hilton here. This is disappointing to hear for an already disappointing rewards program. There were already many instances that these award points could jokingly equate to Zimbabwe dollars. However, we are most mad that they are not meeting a valuation that large internet communities assigned to them as we all discuss ways we squeeze every penny out of points programs in a strong economy. What did we really expect?
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Jun 9, 2019 | 12:23 pm
  #1493  
Quote: To balance out, the dates I search in 2020 weekend, DT Warsaw was dropped to 14K, and Hilton Warsaw dropped to 24K.
So, I won't say it's increase ,it's more dynamic.
Hilton Warsaw used to be 17K on cheapest days.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 12:32 pm
  #1494  
Quote: You're reaching very deep to attempt to articulate these points have no cash value and instead were promised to be redeemed for a certain award chart.
You seem to have misread my comments entirely, as that is definitely not what I said. And I don't see much point debating with someone who doesn't understand economics (but just to make one fundamental point, in this "market" Hilton is the government, because it issues the currency, controls the inventory, and sets the pricing).
Happy, 84fiero and nexusCFX like this.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 5:13 pm
  #1495  
HGI Hong Kong (Mong Kok) has been bumped by more than 33% - from 30K to 4OK for all dates that I checked. So unfortunate...
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Jun 9, 2019 | 6:49 pm
  #1496  
I see they have upped the bonus points offering on AMEX cards. 150,000 is today's offering for Aspire card.
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Jun 9, 2019 | 7:29 pm
  #1497  
Quote: Hilton Devaluation have now absolutely going nuts.
I guess their redemption system made this change several years ago. An (semi-fixed and unpublished) award chart for limited number of reward rooms, as well as surge pricing, which will be the points redemption option, once reward rooms are fully booked. In this case, you're basically using points to pay flexible rate at (pretty terrible) Honors-cash exchange rate, sometimes can be low as 0.2 cents per point.

The following list is points per night for some random dates from now till July:
Conrad Centennial Singapore: 126k
Conrad Tokyo: 215k
Conrad Bora Bora Nui: 346k
Waldorf Astoria Jerusalem: 352k
Hilton Moorea: 229k
Hilton Tel Aviv: 244k
Those are almost certainly premium rooms, which have their own pricing algorithm and have very little to do with the devaluation of standard room awards being discussed.
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Jun 10, 2019 | 12:19 am
  #1498  
Quote: Those are almost certainly premium rooms, which have their own pricing algorithm and have very little to do with the devaluation of standard room awards being discussed.
No. Thats the lowest award for standard room I can get on certain dates.
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Jun 10, 2019 | 12:30 am
  #1499  
Quote: No. Thats the lowest award for standard room I can get on certain dates.
You appear to misunderstand the difference between standard and premium rooms. Screenshots from Conrad Tokyo...

Post a screenshot if you've got dates where the standard rooms are pricing above 95k.



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Jun 10, 2019 | 12:49 am
  #1500  
I certainly know Standard Room Rewards maxes out at 95k, but the problem is, right now I've seen more surge pricing (aka "Premium Room Rewards") dates in the list of hotels I gave, than even last year.
Still, points redemption right now are going absolutely nuts.
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