Delta's $98 response: detained by the DHS/FBI on a DL MR
Aug 17, 2007, 1:40 am
#31
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I like fishy stories. I once caught one this big.
Aug 17, 2007, 1:59 am
#32
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Really, could you please highlight the exact place in the OP's original post where he makes the statement "...that the Delta agent thought is itineraries were 'suspicious' and sicced the feds on him"? I've read that post several times, and I'll freely admit that I sometimes miss stuff when I read it. I may well have overlooked this.
A couple of things here:
A couple of things here:
- You're assuming that "Delta ... sicced the feds on him". That has not been substantiated.
- You're asserting that an airline has no legal obligation to report certain classes of passengers or certain passenger behaviors to the government. While I am definitely not a lawyer, I'm pretty sure that's wrong. For example, I'm almost 100% positive that airlines are required to report certain name matches to authorities if people traveling with those names attempt to travel.
2. The name was not on the list of names that requires contacting federal law enforcement prior to clearing for travel.
Last edited by GUWonder; Aug 17, 2007 at 2:10 am
Aug 17, 2007, 2:05 am
#33
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There is something missing in this story the OP is telling.
First of all, the "Feds" would have been more likely the
DHS TSA supervison and the U.S. Marshal Service.
FBI would NOT have been involved in this unless there was
sufficient reason(s) OTHER THAN the highly UNUSUAL
and VERY ODD MCO-JFA-FRA-JFK-BWI-BOS
(Orlando FL - New York - Frankfort Germany - New York -
Baltimore - Boston) routing.
Aug 17, 2007, 6:02 am
#34
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Aug 17, 2007, 6:58 am
#35
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There is something missing in this story the OP is telling.
First of all, the "Feds" would have been more likely the
DHS TSA supervison and the U.S. Marshal Service.
FBI would NOT have been involved in this unless there was
sufficient reason(s) OTHER THAN the highly UNUSUAL
and VERY ODD MCO-JFA-FRA-JFK-BWI-BOS
(Orlando FL - New York - Frankfort Germany - New York -
Baltimore - Boston) routing.
Last edited by CO 1E; Aug 17, 2007 at 7:31 am
Aug 17, 2007, 8:18 am
#36
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1. Federal law enforcement officials find out about the actual DL itineraries because of what DL gives to law enforcement or that LEOs and intelligence services get from DL. Otherwise they have to somehow get it from the person travelling, who purchased the ticket or who has access to those persons and their belongings (or trash or handmedowns). [DHS CBP/ICE involvement, flight specific or not, can come into play but that wasn't the instigating factor here.]
For example, in the US, libraries and bookstores are required to report information on books read or purchased by people, and they are prohibited from telling people that they've been reported to the government.
2. The name was not on the list of names that requires contacting federal law enforcement prior to clearing for travel.[/QUOTE]
Can you substantiate that?
Aug 17, 2007, 8:35 am
#37
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I will wager 90k SkyMiles that the Delta agent was NOT required by law to rat out our mileage runner in question.
Aug 17, 2007, 8:39 am
#38
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Exactly correct.
Its funny how people think that an "unusual" itinerary is a sign of a problem. Do they really think that if someone was planning any kind of criminal activity they would necessarily fly all over the place like that? Is there any thought process at all that leads a sentient being to the conclusion that many segments= possible terrorist? Its amazing how people can just say and do things without trying to think if they really make any sense at all
Its funny how people think that an "unusual" itinerary is a sign of a problem. Do they really think that if someone was planning any kind of criminal activity they would necessarily fly all over the place like that? Is there any thought process at all that leads a sentient being to the conclusion that many segments= possible terrorist? Its amazing how people can just say and do things without trying to think if they really make any sense at all
I've never understood the concept of "unusual" routing=terrorist. Seems to me that the terrorists on 9/11 flew a perfectly "traditional" itinerary.
Mike
Aug 17, 2007, 9:11 am
#39
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I strongly suggest that there are non-public conditions under which Delta is compelled to provide information on passengers to the government. Just as Delta is not allowed to tell you that you've been moved from 2B to 37E because some deadweight (excuse me, FAM) is "protecting our liberty", I strongly believe that there are instances under which Delta is required to report passengers to the government, yet not disclose that they've done so.
For example, in the US, libraries and bookstores are required to report information on books read or purchased by people, and they are prohibited from telling people that they've been reported to the government.
For example, in the US, libraries and bookstores are required to report information on books read or purchased by people, and they are prohibited from telling people that they've been reported to the government.
Originally Posted by jimrpa
Can you substantiate that?
Last edited by GUWonder; Aug 17, 2007 at 9:17 am
Aug 17, 2007, 10:09 am
#40
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I feel like i'm in the TSS forum with all this big brother talk.
Aug 17, 2007, 10:13 am
#41
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Gotta love the apologists (for the airline as well as for the government).
IMO the OP is owed something quite substantial. Shame on DL!
IMO the OP is owed something quite substantial. Shame on DL!
Aug 17, 2007, 11:15 am
#42
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Irregardless if the OP was ratted out by a DL agent or the Feds caught wind on their own, I believe the OP should have been duly compensated by DL. He was caught up in circumstances beyond his control.
Sure he could have declined to go with the Feds, but it would have been a long cab ride home.
Sure he could have declined to go with the Feds, but it would have been a long cab ride home.
Aug 17, 2007, 11:27 am
#43
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There is something missing in this story the OP is telling.
First of all, the "Feds" would have been more likely the
DHS TSA supervison and the U.S. Marshal Service.
FBI would NOT have been involved in this unless there was
sufficient reason(s) OTHER THAN the highly UNUSUAL
and VERY ODD MCO-JFA-FRA-JFK-BWI-BOS
(Orlando FL - New York - Frankfort Germany - New York -
Baltimore - Boston) routing.
DL as well as ALL airlines WILL VOID TICKETS and CANCEL
RESERVATIONS if you attempt to take segments out of sequence.
Also they WILL VOID mileage and tickets bought & sold via eBay....
EITHER of these scenarios added with the OP possibly creating a "fuss"
(as in being very abusive in behavior to the GA -- could POSSIBLY be WHY "Feds" were summoned....
At any rate, very very "fishy" story .....
While you advice is appreciated, you are aware you are posting in a community with probably the highest concentration of mileage program experts found anywhere, right?
Aug 17, 2007, 1:29 pm
#44
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It's human nature to want to blame someone or something. It's also human nature to want to blame someone or something that you can "punish".
Aug 17, 2007, 1:31 pm
#45
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