Military Personnel: Upgrades and Other Benefits on Delta Air Lines
Dec 27, 2007, 9:54 pm
#76
Join Date: Apr 2006
Programs: DL PM, UA Gold, Marriott Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 291
I'm not really surprised at this behavior, but I wanted to see what everyone's opinions were.
Recently on a flight ATL-SFO, later in the evening but certainly not redeye, sat in first (upgraded). Saw three active duty military (in uniform) get on the plane for SFO, seated in coach. I was surprised to also see three Delta FAs (in uniform) sitting in first. When we landed in SFO, DL flight leader asked everyone to let the military pax off first. This is standard in my opinion and makes sense, but I was surprised the FAs did not sit in coach and let the military folks sit in first. What are your thoughts? Is there some official delta policy against this?
Recently on a flight ATL-SFO, later in the evening but certainly not redeye, sat in first (upgraded). Saw three active duty military (in uniform) get on the plane for SFO, seated in coach. I was surprised to also see three Delta FAs (in uniform) sitting in first. When we landed in SFO, DL flight leader asked everyone to let the military pax off first. This is standard in my opinion and makes sense, but I was surprised the FAs did not sit in coach and let the military folks sit in first. What are your thoughts? Is there some official delta policy against this?
Even if you think that the military deserves the seats, I wouldn't rush to criticize the gate agent who probably had to make this decision at the last moment. I mean... it's not as if uniformed military are necessarily identified in their PNRs. They could have just showed up at the gate after boarding passes were handed out to the Delta crew. And what if there were 4 military personnel in coach and 3 Delta staff in first... etc etc. Lot of questions to answer versus having aircraft depart on time.
Dec 27, 2007, 9:59 pm
#77
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NYC
Programs: AA Plat, Delta Plat, Bonvoy Plat, Hilton Diamon
Posts: 1,262
I was on a flight tonight where every person flying in First was there because of a Medallion upgrade except for a pilot on his way to work, and a young guy in the Navy. After everyone boarded and there were a couple of seats left in First, one of the FA's went back to coach, got the kid in the Navy uniform and brought him up front. The kid seemed really grateful and slept the entire flight.
Dec 27, 2007, 10:06 pm
#78
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 304
I believe the appropriate protocol is that after medallion upgrades and NRSA passengers have been cleared into first, and there are remaining seats, the gate agent or the OBL flight attendant have the discretion to upgrade uniformed military personnel (going to and from active assignments).
It would have been up to the F/A's cleared in first if they wanted to give up their seats.
It would have been up to the F/A's cleared in first if they wanted to give up their seats.
Dec 27, 2007, 10:16 pm
#79
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 6,338
I'm with acf69... and I'm retired Navy/Gulf vet etc...
Don't get me wrong.... when I hear of fare-paying pax deciding to offer their own seats to military personnel
....(or for that matter elderly ladies/the infirm/pregnant women etc) I think it's outstanding...
But "policy"? Nah. Doesn't seem right to me....YMMV of course!!! JMO.
Don't get me wrong.... when I hear of fare-paying pax deciding to offer their own seats to military personnel
....(or for that matter elderly ladies/the infirm/pregnant women etc) I think it's outstanding...
But "policy"? Nah. Doesn't seem right to me....YMMV of course!!! JMO.
Dec 27, 2007, 10:17 pm
#80
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP (2MM), HHonors Diamond
Posts: 443
I believe the appropriate protocol is that after medallion upgrades and NRSA passengers have been cleared into first, and there are remaining seats, the gate agent or the OBL flight attendant have the discretion to upgrade uniformed military personnel (going to and from active assignments).
It would have been up to the F/A's cleared in first if they wanted to give up their seats.
It would have been up to the F/A's cleared in first if they wanted to give up their seats.
Dec 27, 2007, 10:33 pm
#81
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 579
The flight attendants were probably on a "must-ride" priority pass and were dead heading to another flight. Many companies have provisions to upgrade dead heading crew.
Dec 27, 2007, 10:47 pm
#82
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 361
That was a very good thing to do for the uniformed Navy lad
I'd bet he was a newbie recruit going home on leave or returning
enroute to his first installation or ship.
But I'm sure there were other military (not in uniform) on the flight
as well.
What would have happened if there were 20 or so military on the flight
and all in uniform?
It's no longer required to go to and fro in uniform.
Bottom-line is that is was appropriate for the senior FA to use
their discretion especially in this Holiday Season, reminding us
to be good to one another (to the best ability that we can muster).
HAPPY NEW YEAR everyone!
Dec 28, 2007, 6:08 am
#83
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP / LT PLT / 3MM, Marriott LT Gold
Posts: 35,389
I'd have to say that NRSA pax should be assigned coach and the military folks should be placed in F class. I know that's a little hard for the gate folks to determine, but if they are able to do so, I'd say that would be the right thing to do. Either that, or as a NRSA pax, once boarded you go and swap seats as a gesture of goodwill.
Dec 28, 2007, 7:18 am
#84
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Kingdom of the Sun
Programs: DL GM/MM
Posts: 3,708
I agree that to offer one's seat is an excellent gesture. BUt it is a personal decision and should not be sullied by laws and rules.
Besides, where would one then draw the line: military out of uniform? accompanying military spouses? Health Service (or whatever they are called now) in uniform? Brittany Spears' nanny? a top AIDS researcher? a Peace Corps volunteer? .....?
Can you just imagine Congress getting their teeth into this!
Besides, where would one then draw the line: military out of uniform? accompanying military spouses? Health Service (or whatever they are called now) in uniform? Brittany Spears' nanny? a top AIDS researcher? a Peace Corps volunteer? .....?
Can you just imagine Congress getting their teeth into this!
Dec 28, 2007, 7:28 am
#85
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Denver CO
Posts: 3,682
I'm not really surprised at this behavior, but I wanted to see what everyone's opinions were.
Recently on a flight ATL-SFO, later in the evening but certainly not redeye, sat in first (upgraded). Saw three active duty military (in uniform) get on the plane for SFO, seated in coach. I was surprised to also see three Delta FAs (in uniform) sitting in first. When we landed in SFO, DL flight leader asked everyone to let the military pax off first. This is standard in my opinion and makes sense, but I was surprised the FAs did not sit in coach and let the military folks sit in first. What are your thoughts? Is there some official delta policy against this?
Recently on a flight ATL-SFO, later in the evening but certainly not redeye, sat in first (upgraded). Saw three active duty military (in uniform) get on the plane for SFO, seated in coach. I was surprised to also see three Delta FAs (in uniform) sitting in first. When we landed in SFO, DL flight leader asked everyone to let the military pax off first. This is standard in my opinion and makes sense, but I was surprised the FAs did not sit in coach and let the military folks sit in first. What are your thoughts? Is there some official delta policy against this?
Dec 28, 2007, 7:44 am
#86
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2000
Programs: DL FO, Marriott Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 12,003
Jan 3, 2009, 5:55 am
#87
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Atlanta (ATL)
Programs: LH HON, BA Gold, EK Gold, SPG Plat
Posts: 1,590
upgrading military personell into the f-cabin before boarding is finished?
While in general I support the idea of upgrading military personell to empty f seats, I don't think that should be done before the f cabin has boarded completely.
On my flight this morning, several f passengers boarded late (incl me), finding military personell in our seats. When requesting my window seat, the fa answered "but he is in the army...", to which I replied "but I paid for this ticket".
I think delta fa's should definity wait until boarding is completed and then upgrade military personell upon availability.
That would reduce the hassle and some unhappy passengers.
On my flight this morning, several f passengers boarded late (incl me), finding military personell in our seats. When requesting my window seat, the fa answered "but he is in the army...", to which I replied "but I paid for this ticket".
I think delta fa's should definity wait until boarding is completed and then upgrade military personell upon availability.
That would reduce the hassle and some unhappy passengers.
Jan 3, 2009, 6:33 am
#88
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Lexington KY/Coronado, CA
Posts: 950
Was the F cabin full and some F passengers got bumped back to coach, or did you simply get a seat other than what you were assigned? If the former, then I agree with you. If the latter, then I would just choose another F seat and be done with it.
Jan 3, 2009, 6:36 am
#89
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Florida - Delta Charter DM/3.3MM; Lifetime SPG Plat; HH Gold;
Posts: 1,789
I happen to agree with you. On three flights out of Atlanta recently, there were 3 incidences where the rules were not followed concerning medallion upgrades that were a little different than your situation. BUT..... many GA in ATL are now changing Delta's official company policies. I have written to customer service requesting that they investigate what is going on and to re-educate the GA.
In 2 out of 3 cases, I was sitting BIS in FC and it did not affect me. In one case, there was 3 FC seats and 3 Medallions on the UG list. A couple came up to the GA and neither one had status. They whipped out their credit card and asked to be upgraded to FC for $75 each. The GA said, " You are lucky! I haven't yet cleared the UG list." She thus pushed 2 medallions out of what would have been THEIR FC seats. I was already upgraded but knew that I could have been one of these unlucky souls. When I questioned the GA if this was a new Delta policy to have paid UG go before complimentary UG, she said "NO This has been the policy for quite sometime." This is NOT TRUE and she made the rules suit what she as a GA chose to do.
On another flight, there was a long UG list and the GA told everyone to board when their zone was called. Everyone was boarded on the plane. As a coincidence, there were a cluster of PM high up on the UG list in the first few rows of coach and the GA decided to arbitrarily UG people on the flight's Standby list.She said that she chose NOT to UG the medallions on the UG list because she would not know which ones to choose! We are were flabberghasted by this remark since we all knew where we stood on the list (based on the overhead at the gate) so why wouldn't she know? She then said that she would have even considered upgrading 2 soldiers sitting in the very rear of the plane but that the overhead space in FC was full. The only problem with that excuse was that they had no luggage, not even backpacks! She had plenty of time to talk to us about the inappropriate FC upgrades prior to the flight departing so she could just have easily moved the medallions upfront.
The third case was one where there was an empty seat in FC and the UG list had 7 people on it. After the flight took off, a non-medallion companion of the person sitting next to the empty seat in FC had her companion moved up. I once again was not affected but I did question the onboard leader about this. She said that she did not know who was on the UG list and this woman asked if it was OK for this man to sit next to her. Once again this action did not affect me but it COULD have!
There needs to be re-education concerning upgrades rules and policies and they should be reprimanded if the official Delta policies are not followed. This appears to be happening frequently in Atlanta. Just as the OP was extremely upset, many other medallions are also, when it affects them. This certainly impacts medallion benefits and I suspect that Delta's management is unaware of what is actually occurring in the field since it is inconsistent.
In 2 out of 3 cases, I was sitting BIS in FC and it did not affect me. In one case, there was 3 FC seats and 3 Medallions on the UG list. A couple came up to the GA and neither one had status. They whipped out their credit card and asked to be upgraded to FC for $75 each. The GA said, " You are lucky! I haven't yet cleared the UG list." She thus pushed 2 medallions out of what would have been THEIR FC seats. I was already upgraded but knew that I could have been one of these unlucky souls. When I questioned the GA if this was a new Delta policy to have paid UG go before complimentary UG, she said "NO This has been the policy for quite sometime." This is NOT TRUE and she made the rules suit what she as a GA chose to do.
On another flight, there was a long UG list and the GA told everyone to board when their zone was called. Everyone was boarded on the plane. As a coincidence, there were a cluster of PM high up on the UG list in the first few rows of coach and the GA decided to arbitrarily UG people on the flight's Standby list.She said that she chose NOT to UG the medallions on the UG list because she would not know which ones to choose! We are were flabberghasted by this remark since we all knew where we stood on the list (based on the overhead at the gate) so why wouldn't she know? She then said that she would have even considered upgrading 2 soldiers sitting in the very rear of the plane but that the overhead space in FC was full. The only problem with that excuse was that they had no luggage, not even backpacks! She had plenty of time to talk to us about the inappropriate FC upgrades prior to the flight departing so she could just have easily moved the medallions upfront.
The third case was one where there was an empty seat in FC and the UG list had 7 people on it. After the flight took off, a non-medallion companion of the person sitting next to the empty seat in FC had her companion moved up. I once again was not affected but I did question the onboard leader about this. She said that she did not know who was on the UG list and this woman asked if it was OK for this man to sit next to her. Once again this action did not affect me but it COULD have!
There needs to be re-education concerning upgrades rules and policies and they should be reprimanded if the official Delta policies are not followed. This appears to be happening frequently in Atlanta. Just as the OP was extremely upset, many other medallions are also, when it affects them. This certainly impacts medallion benefits and I suspect that Delta's management is unaware of what is actually occurring in the field since it is inconsistent.
Jan 3, 2009, 8:42 am
#90
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Upstate, NY
Posts: 3,359
Wow! It is one thing to give a FC seat to a soldier over an Elite upgrade...BUT to give someone's PAID seat to a soldier is pretty irresponsible!
As others have pointed out...the ATL GA's are in a world of their own and do whatever they feel like! It is pretty outrageous at times and it really does require flyers to stay on top of things. As much as I hate gate lice....sometimes that is what it takes to find out what kind of games the Gate Agents are playing...
I would definitely report this kind of behavior...
As others have pointed out...the ATL GA's are in a world of their own and do whatever they feel like! It is pretty outrageous at times and it really does require flyers to stay on top of things. As much as I hate gate lice....sometimes that is what it takes to find out what kind of games the Gate Agents are playing...
I would definitely report this kind of behavior...