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Using SkyMiles on SkyTeam & Other Partners Master Thread

Using SkyMiles on SkyTeam & Other Partners Master Thread

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Old Dec 12, 21, 5:36 am   -   Wikipost
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Hello Everyone,
Due to a merging error - much of the history of this thread is sitting in the Amex Companion fare thread:
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delt...er-thread.html

The moderation team is in the process of moving posts over to this thread, however it is a very manual process that requires reading every post in the two merged mega threads, so please bear with us as we piece this together.

Regards,
Ryandc99
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Old May 29, 21, 8:05 am
  #16  
 
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Thanks. If you search each segment separately there is space available on O fare class. ExpertFlyer shows none O availability but its Z space matches what DL shows as O space. But only on a segment by segment basis.
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Old May 29, 21, 8:09 am
  #17  
 
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Old May 29, 21, 11:18 am
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Mister P. View Post
Thanks. If you search each segment separately there is space available on O fare class. ExpertFlyer shows none O availability but its Z space matches what DL shows as O space. But only on a segment by segment basis.
O space when married together is what matters. While a relatively new issue for awards, MS are now part of life for AF/KL metal awards.
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Old May 29, 21, 2:12 pm
  #19  
 
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Thanks. A couple of days ago the whole itinerary was showing up but not the case any more. Just one more question, if I book KL566 now and then the whole itinerary shows up, would it be possible to add KL1167 onto the ticket? (Don't have any status with DL, not sure if any change fees would apply).
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Old May 30, 21, 11:31 am
  #20  
 
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Originally Posted by Mister P. View Post
Thanks. A couple of days ago the whole itinerary was showing up but not the case any more. Just one more question, if I book KL566 now and then the whole itinerary shows up, would it be possible to add KL1167 onto the ticket? (Don't have any status with DL, not sure if any change fees would apply).
As a through fare only if then both flights are available in O as a through-fare. "Adding" a flight involves first booking the new flights (including one you already have), and then cancelling the flight you already have.

It may be manually added as an additive fare, though. If I was you I'd just suck it up and fly in X AMS-HEL (no real difference, costs a lot less). That you can get booked right now. NBO-AMS-HEL in O+X. Have them add the flights one by one, additive pricing, so you pay NBO-AMS O rate + AMS-HEL X rate.
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Old May 31, 21, 3:10 am
  #21  
 
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Thanks for all the tips and suggestions. I am not sure I can book mixed-cabin itinerary online or through the chat function, might have to settle for NBO-AMS for the time being. Thanks
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Old May 31, 21, 3:26 am
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Mister P. View Post
Thanks for all the tips and suggestions. I am not sure I can book mixed-cabin itinerary online or through the chat function, might have to settle for NBO-AMS for the time being. Thanks
DL agents (including chat can easily book it)
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Old May 31, 21, 5:15 am
  #23  
 
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Thanks. Just to clarify, is the whole NBO-AMS-HEL itinerary available at the moment as a mixed-cabin ticket? With departure on 16 DEC 21. (Can't get to price it on DL website). Would the total fare be 65,000 miles + tax? Thanks again.
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Old May 31, 21, 6:58 am
  #24  
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Originally Posted by Mister P. View Post
Thanks. Just to clarify, is the whole NBO-AMS-HEL itinerary available at the moment as a mixed-cabin ticket? With departure on 16 DEC 21. (Can't get to price it on DL website). Would the total fare be 65,000 miles + tax? Thanks again.
As this is wholly partner flights (no DL) it should price as one award at J level. Additive pricing happens when you add in DL metal as DL metal can have different pricing for the same cabin.
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Old May 31, 21, 8:42 am
  #25  
 
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Thanks. I was just on the chat with a DL agent and it appears there is no X award space for KL1167 on 17 Dec 21. (I also checked just that flight on DL website and it only shows O space). Were you able to find X space on that flight?
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Old May 31, 21, 6:47 pm
  #26  
 
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Originally Posted by Mister P. View Post
Thanks for all the tips and suggestions. I am not sure I can book mixed-cabin itinerary online or through the chat function, might have to settle for NBO-AMS for the time being. Thanks
You can buy it online as two separate tickets. KL still should be able to check your bags through, if you have any.

If you call or chat with reservations and have them book it as a broken fare mixed-cabin, additive pricing, on a single PNR/ticket, or book as two separate ones, in reality doesn't make much of a difference...oh, other than cancel fees, as this is outside of US origin for both, so if you cancel it you'll be hit with double redeposit fees. Not sure if the AMS "origin" vs connection will price differently for the taxes/fees also. So, there may be difference in fees, and will be a 2x higher redeposit fee if you have to cancel (or change) it later, but miles-wise it'll be the same cost booked as one ticket (painstakingly slow and difficult) via reservations, or easily so booked online as two separate tix.

Originally Posted by flyerCO View Post
DL agents (including chat can easily book it)
Book it yes, easily no. IME such additive-pricing itineraries, more often than not, are anything but a breeze to book. Probably depends on how competent and well trained (or not, as is more often the case, now more so than ever) agent you get. Esp. if here it's MS "logic" that is preventing this, I don't think the override to that, and doing it as additive pricing, is something that agents are trained in, so expect a lot of hold time while the front-line agent is on hold internally to GTS.

Originally Posted by Mister P. View Post
Thanks. I was just on the chat with a DL agent and it appears there is no X award space for KL1167 on 17 Dec 21. (I also checked just that flight on DL website and it only shows O space). Were you able to find X space on that flight?
If DL doesn't show it as available in X, then it's not available in X. At least at this time. So, you can either book it in O (additive pricing of the two flights), one ticket via reservations (may take several hours, given how hard it is to get through to DL nowadays), or two tickets online. Seems like here DL is forcing you to pay additive pricing. Or you can just book the long-haul flight on dullta.com, and book the short "domestic" EU connector using EUR, on KL on another airline (like AY presumably), whichever is the lowest cost and best schedule that works for you.

You may be able to book it as a through-fare both flights if this is not a case of married segment logic, but that may take 10s upon 10s of hours over many days and weeks of trial and failure until you get through to someone at DL who will actually do so for you. Probably not worth the time and hassle.. And there is a good chance this is a case of MS logic here, as you said that other dates this is available as a through-fare. Remember when booking awards with DL you need to have good flexibility, good to have at least +/- 3 months in your travel dates, and when booking non-DL flights esp. it's usually best to book it straight at 331 days out. So plan 11 months ahead and be very flexible with your dates, for the best chance to use your DL miles at a fair value.

Last edited by RealHJ; May 31, 21 at 6:57 pm
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Old May 31, 21, 9:26 pm
  #27  
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Originally Posted by Mister P. View Post
Thanks. I was just on the chat with a DL agent and it appears there is no X award space for KL1167 on 17 Dec 21. (I also checked just that flight on DL website and it only shows O space). Were you able to find X space on that flight?
Just looked. No, neither J/Y cabins have award space.
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Old Jun 1, 21, 5:42 pm
  #28  
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Using SkyMiles on SkyTeam & Other Partners Master Thread

Originally Posted by flyerCO View Post
Yes if KL is forcing MS even for O/X it must be available using MS.

However if that's the case and O/X is bookable as MS then itll price as one award at O level. (For all partner flights theres only one level award for each cabin - low, unlike for DL flights where there's multiple level awards for each cabin)
I thought some partners had variable award pricing using DL RDM now, also? I could be wrong...but I assumed if this was the case it would especially be true for the "closely held" or JV partners like AF/KL/AM.

In any case, this is correct that the married segment availability is 100% a requirement in order to avoid additive pricing. I have two data points for this in both directions, granted they are both in late 2019/early 2020 so take into account changes since then:
1. SFO-AMS-LHR booked in business/coach, all on KL metal/KL marketed. This did not have an available award through-fare, and thus priced additively at something like 80k one-way. Sure, I'd have loved to have the whole ticket for 70k or whatever but the long trip was in business and the extra 10k for the complete ticket and flight times I wanted was fine. Also on the KL short haul I had a row to myself anyway so it was essentially the same as euro-business.
2. ATL-YYZ-AMS-BGO//AMS-ATL booked in biz/coach mixed-metal (open jaw; we had a bunch of land/boat stuff to to get from BGO>AMS). The AMS-BGO leg was only showing available in economy, and the website would just show unavailable when I tried to search the full route beyond AMS. So when I called to book I was expecting to pay additive pricing which I was fine with. But the agent surprised me by saying, after about a 20-second search, that a mixed-cabin itinerary was available for the outbound and booked the whole thing for 150k RT. The entire phone call took maybe 15 minutes, including seat selection.
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Old Jun 1, 21, 8:59 pm
  #29  
 
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USING matrix.itasoftware.com to search for Companion tickets for Coach or F.

It's a simple matrix search where the Fare Classes are entered in the right side field on the 2nd and 4th lines of the search. Click on Advanced controls to show these additional lines.
The full entry of the field for Coach Fare Classes is: F BC=L|BC=U|BC=T|BC=X|BC=V
The full entry for the field for First Fare Classes is: F BC=I|BC=Z and if you want to include C+ use F BC=I|BC=Z|BC=W

The following example is DTW-LAS-DTW for 6 or 7 days


This search yielded the following results:


Clicking on the fare will open a window showing all available fight combinations.

Have fun searching!
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Old Jun 2, 21, 1:05 am
  #30  
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Originally Posted by gooselee View Post
I thought some partners had variable award pricing using DL RDM now, also? I could be wrong...but I assumed if this was the case it would especially be true for the "closely held" or JV partners like AF/KL/AM.

In any case, this is correct that the married segment availability is 100% a requirement in order to avoid additive pricing. I have two data points for this in both directions, granted they are both in late 2019/early 2020 so take into account changes since then:
1. SFO-AMS-LHR booked in business/coach, all on KL metal/KL marketed. This did not have an available award through-fare, and thus priced additively at something like 80k one-way. Sure, I'd have loved to have the whole ticket for 70k or whatever but the long trip was in business and the extra 10k for the complete ticket and flight times I wanted was fine. Also on the KL short haul I had a row to myself anyway so it was essentially the same as euro-business.
2. ATL-YYZ-AMS-BGO//AMS-ATL booked in biz/coach mixed-metal (open jaw; we had a bunch of land/boat stuff to to get from BGO>AMS). The AMS-BGO leg was only showing available in economy, and the website would just show unavailable when I tried to search the full route beyond AMS. So when I called to book I was expecting to pay additive pricing which I was fine with. But the agent surprised me by saying, after about a 20-second search, that a mixed-cabin itinerary was available for the outbound and booked the whole thing for 150k RT. The entire phone call took maybe 15 minutes, including seat selection.
All partners have one level award. Now some awards have AP requirements. Ie LATAM, there's three different awards available. However this is an AP issue. There's no level that gives access to increased inventory simply by paying more miles.
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