javabytes

Of course there are cheaper options. Nobody said every flight is 750,000 miles, just that this pricing level is now in effect for itineraries originating in the US, as opposed to just those originating abroad, which is a new development.

luv2ctheworld

Is 350,000 for US-OZ actually considered reasonable for DL? Compared to AA and UA for 120,000-160,000?

gooselee

Understood. But that's the only thing that the example is good for. Cherry picking an award that demonstrates a higher redemption ceiling shows that the ceiling is higher. Period.

The issue for me is that many posters use this as evidence that the floor must necessarily also rise. The tone of the NYT article and so many threads here seem to imply that nearly all awards will now cost exponentially more miles than they have in the past, but the simple existence of a few higher priced awards does nothing to advance this conclusion.

In fact, many posts in this thread have shown just the opposite, that the previous redemption floor is still accessible and has in fact lowered on certain routes (the domestic 5k/10k routes).

If you must fly that exact route on those specific days, that is the option available via DL. If, as in the past, you have flexibility on routing or dates, you increase the likelihood of finding lower prices awards.

The fact that some dates and routes cost more than others is NOT a new development.

---

Here's a thought exercise: If FFPs had not existed before today, and someone told you by adding a 10-digit number to your airfare bookings, you could get an effective 5%-11% rebate on your spend (to be applied to future airfare), would you think that's a good deal?

Because even if DL goes completely revenue-based at the PWM rate of 1 CPM, that's what we'll still be getting. And until then, even these "terrible" 350k redemptions represent something like a 10%-25% rebate depending on medallion level.

I get that things were better in the past for many people. But if folks can get past the fact that today is not yesterday, they just might be able to recognize that today is still a pretty decent deal.

sethb

(ME3 flying tcon in US)

If we all wrote our Congresscritters and asked . . .

sethb

Flights that are $750+ round trip available for 25K SkyPesos? I haven't seen that; I've seen mostly flights that are barely cheaper than PWM rates (e.g. 35K SkyPesos for a $375 round trip).

Randomly checking now, it's a little better; I'm seeing 25K for $400 trips. Only one 3+ CPM, that's in F on a connection nobody sane would take (more miles and lots more dollars than nonstops in F).

sethb

I'm going to have to check Delta's quarterly statements for how many SkyPesos it's giving out. It may be hard to find the number.

I bet they booked a profit from devaluing them.

TheBOSman

Not unless His Excellency AAB and Tim Clark and James Hogan all backed the money truck up to the proper lobbyists...

gooselee

Correct. Just did a quick search for random dates on some of the city pairs I had booked and found the same on my first try:

8/31-9/3
ATL-ALB-ATL
ATL-YUL-ATL
ATL-XNA-ATL

Not the sexiest destinations around, but if you are going somewhere where cash prices are expensive and have a pile of DL miles to spend, the do have the potential to provide very good value.

We can cherry pick examples at both extremes all day long...

ETA: Was posting from my phone this morning, so adding some screenshots of my findings for those who are interested in the exact numbers/options. Often the routing on the awards is actually better than on the cheapest cash flights.

All searches followed my own booking pattern of a Monday-Thursday just under a month out, round trip, lowest Main Cabin fare. The YUL flights are now showing at 30k RT, but still a 3+ CPM

ATL-ALB-ATL:
http://i.imgur.com/m7uGQiU.png
http://i.imgur.com/DsiaemJ.png

ATL-YUL-ATL:
http://i.imgur.com/15FLsWU.png
http://i.imgur.com/nCg4JVY.png

ATL-XNA-ATL:
http://i.imgur.com/ZYJXRrs.png
http://i.imgur.com/J8eTAhF.png

pbarnette

350k is really closer to the ~300k+ that is the norm for an AA or UA redemption. Indeed, until AA starts their service to OZ, you pretty much have zero options to redeem miles to Oz in J, as QF simply doesn't release award space most of the time.

LaserSailor

How does the chart save me time? I see more people spending more time moaning about what once was vs saving any time booking an award reservation.

gooselee

+1 - I thought about making a similar comment before.

All the arguments about saving people time in searching for awards are a bit strange coming from people who likely spend hours every week posting on FT.

I'm not innocent, either. I spend my fair share of time posting here. But I also don't mind spending an hour or so searching for flexible dates, other airlines, etc. to piece together a nice award. And often it's much quicker than that.

If someone's time is so precious that they cannot run a few searches to potentially reveal better options (which, by the way, you have to do on any airline, even in the past, and even with cash tickets), then they have the option of potentially paying a little more for whatever shows up first. Applying the gas station analogy, if you really need some gas and don't have time to pull up Gasbuddy or drive over to that one station you know is always cheaper, you can simply pay the going price at the station right in front of you, which may be the same or may be higher.

sethb

The chart saves me time because when I find a flight for the lowest value, I know I won't find anything better with more searching.

Sure, I have lots of time to spend on FT when I choose to spend it here; but sometimes I'm searching for tickets and don't have much time to waste.

avidflyer

This is one of the many reason Delta came in at #9 of the US FF programs. The folks here who say that dismantling the FF program is "the right thing to do" clearly are on the same page as DL. However, many of those same folks try to also defend the miserable excuse of a FF program in the next breath and that is where they lose me.

Pick one and you have an opinion. Defend both and you have a problem

GRALISTAIR

I love it - may I use that line? ^

dll

Yes, it's true. I redeemed for an LAX-FAR trip in the fall. Checked various date options, all north of $720 in coach. Plenty of 25k award availability, so went that route. Nevertheless, this does not lead me to feel loyal to Delta. While I perceive value for the SkyMiles I used on that trip, I do not feel excited about the trip. It's not something I've saved miles for, like an overseas holiday. It's just...a domestic flight.