Originally Posted by MSPeconomist

So any TATL AF segment is 16,500 miles to upgrade from PV S class into Affaires, but what does it cost for the upgrade (assuming it's needed) into European business class for flights within Europe beyond CDG, including flights to ATH, IST, and SVO as well as shorter EU flights?

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

AF business class has been made fun of for decades: see competition's commercial: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUWS7qCWTrA

Originally Posted by TrojanTraveler

Thanks much. So if I read this correctly, it's 32,500 RT (but 16,500 one way) between Europe and N America. And it's 52,000 RT from N America to SE Asia?

I ask because while S fares are not always reasonable, I have over a million non-DL Amex points.

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

...
AF business class has been made fun of for decades: see competition's commercial: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUWS7qCWTrA

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

If you read "32 500 / 16 500 /16 500 / 75 000" in the chart, it means:
- upgrade from Economy to Business: 32,500 FB miles per segment
- upgrade from Economy to Premium voyageur: 16,500 FB miles per segment
- upgrade from Premium voyageur: 16,500 FB miles per segment
- upgrade from Affaires to La Première: 75,000 FB miles per segment.

FYI, upgrade to La Première would (of course) only apply on select fare (D is the cheapest you'll find and discounted Affaire - Z - will not work) and you have to have Elite status with AF.

Sounds to me you found a great way to use those AmEx points...

Originally Posted by DLroads

I remember that commercial! I needed it in April when I mentioned to AF VP of marketing (in the AF DO) that I felt embarrassed and cheated by their 'short haul' business class service to AMM and TLV. I actually asked him directly (and there is a video to prove it) "do you feel embarrassed?" That was the first note he heard in our session... and you know what? well worth it just to see his facial expression when fellow FT wanted to jump in.

Originally Posted by TrojanTraveler

I don't completely follow. This is what it states below the chart:

**Cabine Economique à Cabine Affaires
Cabine Economique à Cabine Premium Economique ou Alizé
Cabine Alizé à Cabine Affaires
Cabine Affaires à Cabine La Première

I don't see Upgrade from Premium Voyaguer here...

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

Alizé = Premium Voyageur (this is name they marketed it on when they started it on flights to the French Caribbean and La Réunion).
Starting October 28 of this year, they will rebrand it Premium Economy.

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

Alizé = Premium Voyageur (this is name they marketed it on when they started it on flights to the French Caribbean and La Réunion).
Starting October 28 of this year, they will rebrand it Premium Economy.

Originally Posted by dieuwer2

I think the seats in the Alize cabin are different from those in the PV cabin.

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

A/ I think it would be possible to call SkyMiles and have them process the upgrade with SMiles, as long as there is O inventory on their end. But most of the time there is none as AF keeps those seats almost exclusively for Flying Blue customers.

B/ That's impossible; FB and SM are two different programs. Your best shot would be pushing American Express membership rewards points to your flying blue account.

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

Been there, done that:
- first, call FlyingBlue desk to make sure there is O inventory on your itinerary.
- buy S class ticket from Air France; you have to speak to an agent on the phone as there is no way to select S from the web site; you can argue it's not doable online and relatively easily have them wave the service fee; have the agent put your SkyMiles account in the reservation;
- once ticket is emitted, log in to AF.us with your PNR; most times the website would allow you to upgrade online;
- call back FlyingBlue and have them process the upgrade; the ticket won't be reissued right away but you'll receive your upgrade voucher with a different 057 ticket number; you'll have to pull 16,500 FB miles per segment.
- call back DL with the original 057 ticket to double check the SkyMiles number is still in there for mileage credit; sometimes FlyingBlue agents are zealous and would substitute it with your FlyingBlue number; triple check at the airport.

Originally Posted by dieuwer2

I think the seats in the Alize cabin are different from those in the PV cabin.

Originally Posted by vgb2001

A/ NO. AF has effectively ended any upgrades for skymiles members as of 09/13. That is the reason why the thread was started originally. So even in the miraculous possibility that O ex-US is available (basically only after June 2013), upgrades (miles or PU503) will not be allowed. That is until AF re-authorize them but as of yesterday night (my last conversation with international reissue desk), the 09/13 memo still applies.

Originally Posted by MSPeconomist

Why must you do the upgrade online yourself and call back? Can't you just call AF once, check upgrade availability, purchase the ticket, get the upgrade, and have the ticket reissued (or at least request that the email upgrade voucher or whatever be sent to you) all during one phone call?

Originally Posted by Cortina Airlines

You're confused (or maybe I am). In my scenario, we're talking about a AF-emited ticket (ie 057 ticket) with AF coded flights. In my understanding, those can still by upgraded with SkyMiles. So, I still think what I said applies but it's true I haven't tried since last week.
I think I'm still in line with the thread as we're talking about DL customers trying to upgrade on AF metal.