Jul 20, 2019, 3:27 am
Last edit by: corporate-wage-slave
Quick answers to FAQ:
Help! What do I do now?
Most importantly, don't panic and don't do anything in haste. Read these FAQ. Read the thread, particularly the posts starting from the time that the strike dates were announced. Identify your options. Think about what works for you. Then take action. If you do anything in haste, you may have thrown away good options, or you may have thrown away money that you needn't have spent.
NOTE: Some emails have been sent out by mistake notifying the cancellation of flights on 8 September and other dates. If your booking still looks OK in MMB then you don't need to take further action. A cancelled flight should be shown in MMB with struck-through text. If your flight details are not struck through, then it probably hasn't actually been cancelled. You could check ba.com to see whether BA is still taking reservations for the flight in question. If so, then the flight has not been cancelled. You may also try checking on ExpertFlyer, if you have access, to see whether your flight appears still to be operating and whether BA is still taking reservations. However, some afternoon/evening flights on 8 September have genuinely been cancelled. See main thread for details.
Has a strike been called yet?
Yes. BALPA, the pilots' union, has voted in favour of strike action, and the Court of Appeal has rejected BA's submission to have the poll set aside, so the legal process is now over. The two parties went back into talks after the legal proceedings and those talks were expected to continue into the week of 5 August.
BALPA on 23 Aug announced strikes on Monday 9 September Tuesday 10 September and Friday 27 September.
Any further strikes normally require 2 weeks notice under UK legislation.
What flights may be affected?
LHR and LGW based flights. Not LCY or STN flights. Both cabin and flight crew are in dispute with BA, but the pilots (captains, senior first officers, first officers) are closest to strike action.
How long would a strike last?
The initial strikes are for two days the a single day, with normal working in between. Any other strikes could be of any length. It would be rare in the UK for there to be a full time strike.
What would happen to my flights if it is a strike day?
A range of options have been announced, see post 1551 below for more information: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...l#post31451055
and BA Trade Site guidance here: https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...kba?faqid=7594
Rebooking is now allowed on Iberia, AA, Finnair, JAL and Qatar. Within Europe EI and Vueling are also allowed. This is for both revenue and redemption flights.
and the FAQ on BA.com here (this includes information on BA Holidays bookings which are substantially different): https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...st-information
Can I do anything with an existing booking now?
Yes. Your options are different depending on whether your flights are currently showing as cancelled or not. See the links above.
What about Heathrow staff - aren't their strikes planned there too?
Yes there is a separate dispute at the moment between Heathrow Airport (HAL) and their staff such as those who operate the security checkpoints. See the separate thread on the issue.
Am I protected by EC261 if there is a problem?
You are always covered by the Right to Care provisions of Regulation EC261. You could potentially be able to claim compensation for delays, cancellations and downgrades caused by BA staff action too, but not for HAL strikes (for cancellations only if there is flight is less than 14 day’s notice). See the main EC261 thread in the BA Forum Dashboard.
Help! What do I do now?
Most importantly, don't panic and don't do anything in haste. Read these FAQ. Read the thread, particularly the posts starting from the time that the strike dates were announced. Identify your options. Think about what works for you. Then take action. If you do anything in haste, you may have thrown away good options, or you may have thrown away money that you needn't have spent.
NOTE: Some emails have been sent out by mistake notifying the cancellation of flights on 8 September and other dates. If your booking still looks OK in MMB then you don't need to take further action. A cancelled flight should be shown in MMB with struck-through text. If your flight details are not struck through, then it probably hasn't actually been cancelled. You could check ba.com to see whether BA is still taking reservations for the flight in question. If so, then the flight has not been cancelled. You may also try checking on ExpertFlyer, if you have access, to see whether your flight appears still to be operating and whether BA is still taking reservations. However, some afternoon/evening flights on 8 September have genuinely been cancelled. See main thread for details.
Has a strike been called yet?
Yes. BALPA, the pilots' union, has voted in favour of strike action, and the Court of Appeal has rejected BA's submission to have the poll set aside, so the legal process is now over. The two parties went back into talks after the legal proceedings and those talks were expected to continue into the week of 5 August.
BALPA on 23 Aug announced strikes on Monday 9 September Tuesday 10 September and Friday 27 September.
Any further strikes normally require 2 weeks notice under UK legislation.
What flights may be affected?
LHR and LGW based flights. Not LCY or STN flights. Both cabin and flight crew are in dispute with BA, but the pilots (captains, senior first officers, first officers) are closest to strike action.
How long would a strike last?
The initial strikes are for two days the a single day, with normal working in between. Any other strikes could be of any length. It would be rare in the UK for there to be a full time strike.
What would happen to my flights if it is a strike day?
A range of options have been announced, see post 1551 below for more information: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...l#post31451055
and BA Trade Site guidance here: https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...kba?faqid=7594
Rebooking is now allowed on Iberia, AA, Finnair, JAL and Qatar. Within Europe EI and Vueling are also allowed. This is for both revenue and redemption flights.
and the FAQ on BA.com here (this includes information on BA Holidays bookings which are substantially different): https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...st-information
Can I do anything with an existing booking now?
Yes. Your options are different depending on whether your flights are currently showing as cancelled or not. See the links above.
What about Heathrow staff - aren't their strikes planned there too?
Yes there is a separate dispute at the moment between Heathrow Airport (HAL) and their staff such as those who operate the security checkpoints. See the separate thread on the issue.
Am I protected by EC261 if there is a problem?
You are always covered by the Right to Care provisions of Regulation EC261. You could potentially be able to claim compensation for delays, cancellations and downgrades caused by BA staff action too, but not for HAL strikes (for cancellations only if there is flight is less than 14 day’s notice). See the main EC261 thread in the BA Forum Dashboard.
LHR/LGW pilots (BALPA) industrial action 9 Sep, 10 Sep, and 27 Sep
Aug 24, 2019, 3:34 am
#1426
Moderator, Emirates
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Where My Heart Is
Programs: BAEC Silver, FB Platinum, KQ Asante Gold, Shebamiles Blue, Emirates Blue
Posts: 3,386
According to the BALPA statement £5million to give what they’re asking for. £40million it will cost per strike day, £120million for the first wave of strikes along with the cost of reputational damage on both sides.
Aug 24, 2019, 3:42 am
#1430
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: London
Programs: plenty - ggl, ccr, etc, etc.
Posts: 1,704
I’m struggling to think of anything in a highly skilled portable job like that the requires public goodwill. Balance of power is what matters and with huge pilot backing at BA (97%) balpa have that.
In much more consensual societies like Scandinavia this public goodwill argument did not have any effect at all. SAS had a bitter dispute earlier this year and ended up giving the pilots what they demanded.
Aug 24, 2019, 3:57 am
#1432
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: London
Programs: plenty - ggl, ccr, etc, etc.
Posts: 1,704
There way this might end, will be just like at almost every other airline. That end will probably be BA backing down on almost all points, but probably only after leaving it too late to avoid the damage to the company or the CEO’s career. (Remember Bob Ayling has to go off to run a caravan park after the unions broke him).
Last edited by DFB_london; Aug 24, 2019 at 4:05 am
Aug 24, 2019, 4:13 am
#1433
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Newcastle UK
Posts: 1,114
I have very mixed feelings about the strike. We keep hearing from BALPA about historical pay cuts for example that flight crew have taken in leaner times, but they don't put any meat on the bones of that. I think people would be genuinely interested to hear from an individual that knows the detail.
At the outset, flight crew have signed a contract of employment which they were obviously happy to do so at the time. Were their T&C's changed involuntarily? I don't know. If they were not, I think flight crew are being quite greedy. If it was voluntary, not so. Compared to many they have been offered a fairly decent (11.5% ish) over 3 yrs. That's not bad and is what most other BA employees and unions have accepted.
So, what about all the other BA employees? There's not as much union clout with the exception of cabin crew, so what about all the others that would like profit share. Up until a good few years ago there was a company wide annual profit share scheme, which I'm sure flight crew benefitted from too, unless somebody tells me otherwise? If flight crew again receive profit share, doesn't this just cause bad feeling amongst other employees?
I believe that unions, although largely diminished, do have some power left, so I'm all for a justifyable "fight", but the devil is in the detail.
I for one would be really grateful if someone in the know could shed some light. That way, when my flights are dusrupted I know how to REALLY feel about it.
At the outset, flight crew have signed a contract of employment which they were obviously happy to do so at the time. Were their T&C's changed involuntarily? I don't know. If they were not, I think flight crew are being quite greedy. If it was voluntary, not so. Compared to many they have been offered a fairly decent (11.5% ish) over 3 yrs. That's not bad and is what most other BA employees and unions have accepted.
So, what about all the other BA employees? There's not as much union clout with the exception of cabin crew, so what about all the others that would like profit share. Up until a good few years ago there was a company wide annual profit share scheme, which I'm sure flight crew benefitted from too, unless somebody tells me otherwise? If flight crew again receive profit share, doesn't this just cause bad feeling amongst other employees?
I believe that unions, although largely diminished, do have some power left, so I'm all for a justifyable "fight", but the devil is in the detail.
I for one would be really grateful if someone in the know could shed some light. That way, when my flights are dusrupted I know how to REALLY feel about it.
Aug 24, 2019, 4:17 am
#1434
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: London / Berlin
Posts: 130
This assertion presupposes that balpa and its pilots are dependent on the goodwill of the public.
I’m struggling to think of anything in a highly skilled portable job like that the requires public goodwill. Balance of power is what matters and with huge pilot backing at BA (97%) balpa have that.
However, If we start to get strikes beyond September, particularly if the union reject further offers from BA management, public criticism might begin to have an effect. Sociopaths excluded, most people do care somewhat about not being perceived as the bad guys.
Aug 24, 2019, 4:27 am
#1435
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,596
I have very mixed feelings about the strike. We keep hearing from BALPA about historical pay cuts for example that flight crew have taken in leaner times, but they don't put any meat on the bones of that. I think people would be genuinely interested to hear from an individual that knows the detail.
At the outset, flight crew have signed a contract of employment which they were obviously happy to do so at the time. Were their T&C's changed involuntarily? I don't know. If they were not, I think flight crew are being quite greedy. If it was voluntary, not so. Compared to many they have been offered a fairly decent (11.5% ish) over 3 yrs. That's not bad and is what most other BA employees and unions have accepted.
So, what about all the other BA employees? There's not as much union clout with the exception of cabin crew, so what about all the others that would like profit share. Up until a good few years ago there was a company wide annual profit share scheme, which I'm sure flight crew benefitted from too, unless somebody tells me otherwise? If flight crew again receive profit share, doesn't this just cause bad feeling amongst other employees?
I believe that unions, although largely diminished, do have some power left, so I'm all for a justifyable "fight", but the devil is in the detail.
I for one would be really grateful if someone in the know could shed some light. That way, when my flights are dusrupted I know how to REALLY feel about it.
At the outset, flight crew have signed a contract of employment which they were obviously happy to do so at the time. Were their T&C's changed involuntarily? I don't know. If they were not, I think flight crew are being quite greedy. If it was voluntary, not so. Compared to many they have been offered a fairly decent (11.5% ish) over 3 yrs. That's not bad and is what most other BA employees and unions have accepted.
So, what about all the other BA employees? There's not as much union clout with the exception of cabin crew, so what about all the others that would like profit share. Up until a good few years ago there was a company wide annual profit share scheme, which I'm sure flight crew benefitted from too, unless somebody tells me otherwise? If flight crew again receive profit share, doesn't this just cause bad feeling amongst other employees?
I believe that unions, although largely diminished, do have some power left, so I'm all for a justifyable "fight", but the devil is in the detail.
I for one would be really grateful if someone in the know could shed some light. That way, when my flights are dusrupted I know how to REALLY feel about it.
Aug 24, 2019, 5:38 am
#1437
Join Date: Jan 2015
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 1,630
The BA website says that on average pilots and cabin crew have 16.5 years experience. If you allow a bit for cabin crew being younger and probably less experienced than pilots, it suggests about 20 years experience for the pilots. The historical sacrifices that people keep using as justification for the strike occurred around 2009, so I assume about 50% of the people going on strike haven't sacrificed anything because they joined BA after 2009?
Aug 24, 2019, 5:42 am
#1438
Join Date: Jan 2015
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 1,630
Aug 24, 2019, 6:22 am
#1439
Moderator: British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jan 2009
Programs: Battleaxe Alliance
Posts: 22,127
I'd just like you all to spare a thought for the BA call centre staff members who are currently fielding a very large number of calls, including from those who would be pretty irate or stressed.
The agents I have dealt with have all been impeccable, and done very best to help in any way they could. Kudos to them.
We all have our frustrations (including not having been able to get through at all, and having had to wait 50 minutes for the GGL line to be answered) but they're doing what they can. I hope we can all be courteous and sympathetic to them. After all, they don't make the policy, and they do not need the 'attitude' from us.
The agents I have dealt with have all been impeccable, and done very best to help in any way they could. Kudos to them.
We all have our frustrations (including not having been able to get through at all, and having had to wait 50 minutes for the GGL line to be answered) but they're doing what they can. I hope we can all be courteous and sympathetic to them. After all, they don't make the policy, and they do not need the 'attitude' from us.
Last edited by LTN Phobia; Aug 24, 2019 at 6:27 am