Jan 11, 2017, 7:42 am
Last edit by: KARFA
This thread focuses on experiences and reactions for the implementation of buy on board for shorthaul, mainly led by impressions taken from flying on board British Airways' shorthaul services.
An information thread exists for your questions, particularly if they are on factual matters, here:
Buy on board: Information guide for BA shorthaul economy services
If you have an opinion about the concept of Buy on Board, the right thread is:
Buy on board: Implemented on BA short haul - opinions on the concept
Photos of current BoB menu (September 2018) post #125 in information thread
An information thread exists for your questions, particularly if they are on factual matters, here:
Buy on board: Information guide for BA shorthaul economy services
If you have an opinion about the concept of Buy on Board, the right thread is:
Buy on board: Implemented on BA short haul - opinions on the concept
Photos of current BoB menu (September 2018) post #125 in information thread
Buy on board: Experiences and reactions from BA's shorthaul economy service
Jan 18, 2017, 11:15 am
#661
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Argentina
Posts: 40,211
However, more importantly, I have the impression that BoB has changed the dynamic of the relationship between crew and passengers quite significantly. It seems that some passengers overtly respect crew members less (including in their safety capacity) as a result and are plainly less pleasant to them and that some crew are conscious and unhappy about that difference even though I'm sure that others might still like the new service. To me, the atmosphere was clearly less friendly and more tensed on both flights, and my partner (who doesn't feel as negatively towards BoB as I do) had the exact same feeling and was quite touched/saddened by what the crew member she talked to told her. I'm sure many members will make fun of me for it, but this change actually makes me rather sad, on behalf of passengers and crew members alike.
As an infrequent flier I have to say my communications with the vast majority of economy short haul cabin crew on any airline I've flown on have never gone further than answering the usual 'tea or coffee'' question.
Maybe I look like Victor Meldrew?
Jan 18, 2017, 11:28 am
#662
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: LON, MAD
Programs: KE MC Premium, BA Gold, Hilton Diamond, AZ FA+, Melia Gold
Posts: 305
However, more importantly, I have the impression that BoB has changed the dynamic of the relationship between crew and passengers quite significantly. It seems that some passengers overtly respect crew members less (including in their safety capacity) as a result and are plainly less pleasant to them and that some crew are conscious and unhappy about that difference even though I'm sure that others might still like the new service. To me, the atmosphere was clearly less friendly and more tensed on both flights, and my partner (who doesn't feel as negatively towards BoB as I do) had the exact same feeling and was quite touched/saddened by what the crew member she talked to told her. I'm sure many members will make fun of me for it, but this change actually makes me rather sad, on behalf of passengers and crew members alike.
Having said all of that, I've had some excellent crews on my usual route to and from GIB recently, since it changed over to MF. It's actually encouraged me to choose BA more often prior to BOB.
However, in relation to the atmosphere in general, I would guess that some of this stems from the crews (justified) discomfort with the frustrations of the BOB introduction creating a slightly different atmosphere onboard. I would hope that as they become more familiar with it, this will improve.
Just as a point of reference, I've now done 5 flights since BOB - 1 excellent, 2 average, and 2 extremely poor.
One other comparison to U2 and Monarch - I generally find the crews are pretty keen to have a chat while processing the payment. So far on BA this hasn't happened, as the crew are grappling with the technology. I really hope the BA crew start to relax and chat a bit more as they get used to the system - it is a real loss in the connection between the passenger and airline if they are too busy to engage in any small talk.
Jan 18, 2017, 11:33 am
#663
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Dublin
Programs: EI AC Silver, BAEC Gold
Posts: 369
However, more importantly, I have the impression that BoB has changed the dynamic of the relationship between crew and passengers quite significantly. It seems that some passengers overtly respect crew members less (including in their safety capacity) as a result and are plainly less pleasant to them and that some crew are conscious and unhappy about that difference even though I'm sure that others might still like the new service. To me, the atmosphere was clearly less friendly and more tensed on both flights, and my partner (who doesn't feel as negatively towards BoB as I do) had the exact same feeling and was quite touched/saddened by what the crew member she talked to told her. I'm sure many members will make fun of me for it, but this change actually makes me rather sad, on behalf of passengers and crew members alike.
Jan 18, 2017, 12:09 pm
#664
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: London
Programs: Sir Ratechaser Seigneur de la Patience d'un Saint (Mucci), BA Silver, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 2,569
Jan 18, 2017, 12:21 pm
#665
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Honors Diamond, Mucci de buveur de gin
Posts: 3,060
Much bettie this afternoon on the ABZ - LHR service. Boss guy makes the announcement and reiterated three times that no cash was accepted. Service was completed (obviously not many takers) way before we started descending.
Had a wee chat with the guy as I was waiting for the toilet. He said that there have been a LOT of teething problems - he did a LPA and a WAW where there was just no catering loaded. He thinks that the service should be more "hybrid" - passengers should be offered complimentary tea and coffee and Gold card holders should get a free drink of their choice - can't say I disagree with that.
And he topped it all off with this announcement at the end - "Those of you on the right hand side of the aircraft have some amazing view of central London as we are coming in tonight.....I think that those of you on the left can see Croydon."
LOL!
Had a wee chat with the guy as I was waiting for the toilet. He said that there have been a LOT of teething problems - he did a LPA and a WAW where there was just no catering loaded. He thinks that the service should be more "hybrid" - passengers should be offered complimentary tea and coffee and Gold card holders should get a free drink of their choice - can't say I disagree with that.
And he topped it all off with this announcement at the end - "Those of you on the right hand side of the aircraft have some amazing view of central London as we are coming in tonight.....I think that those of you on the left can see Croydon."
LOL!
Jan 18, 2017, 12:27 pm
#666
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 19
Having been through 10 experiences, how would I improve this process?
1) Put some 80 ml cuplets of free water on the trolley and BA shouldn't lose sleep over any lost sales. (Incidentally I have seen plenty of free water handed out, I've not witnessed any pushback on that first hand).
2) Put some meal deals on the menu, competitively priced, and put them on screen 1 of TourPOS. At the moment there are just 2 options, "Food" and "Drink", they could put half a dozen meal deals leading straight to payment and save a lot of key pressing.
3) Make the TourPOS and bluetooth printer a lot more robust and simplify the menu process. Have a 3rd backup device on board.
4) Allow pre-purchase via MMB and/or allow Highlife Shop vouchers to be bought offline, for those who don't have credit cards or Avios.
5) Get contactless working ASAP! [This is coming apparently].
6) Get the barcode visible offline on the BA App (and workable under TourPOS).
7) One or two hot items which aren't sandwiches (Cornish Pasty? Vegetarian Pasty).
8) Allow Newcastle travellers bacon baps! They are actually quite tasty in my view.
9) Sort out the naming conventions for the food items. The Swiss Mountain chocolate bar has those two words prominently on the product, but they don't appear on the drop down menu on TourPOS.
10) Add a scan food option on TourPOS so the staff don't have to keep searching for items. And/or order the items on the screen by Tray ID.
11) On A319s, with 3 crew, arrange the second trolley so that it stays in the galley but has the rarely used items available for quick retrieval, by changing and labelling the internal trays.
And, probably above all,
12) Please BA, allow the SCCM some leeway on customer service remediation. In particular if a flight is delayed more than 30 minutes crack open the Highland Spring. Due to the commission on sales, I can see crew going mad to throw away the margin, but a bit of give/take may be a good investment.
1) Put some 80 ml cuplets of free water on the trolley and BA shouldn't lose sleep over any lost sales. (Incidentally I have seen plenty of free water handed out, I've not witnessed any pushback on that first hand).
2) Put some meal deals on the menu, competitively priced, and put them on screen 1 of TourPOS. At the moment there are just 2 options, "Food" and "Drink", they could put half a dozen meal deals leading straight to payment and save a lot of key pressing.
3) Make the TourPOS and bluetooth printer a lot more robust and simplify the menu process. Have a 3rd backup device on board.
4) Allow pre-purchase via MMB and/or allow Highlife Shop vouchers to be bought offline, for those who don't have credit cards or Avios.
5) Get contactless working ASAP! [This is coming apparently].
6) Get the barcode visible offline on the BA App (and workable under TourPOS).
7) One or two hot items which aren't sandwiches (Cornish Pasty? Vegetarian Pasty).
8) Allow Newcastle travellers bacon baps! They are actually quite tasty in my view.
9) Sort out the naming conventions for the food items. The Swiss Mountain chocolate bar has those two words prominently on the product, but they don't appear on the drop down menu on TourPOS.
10) Add a scan food option on TourPOS so the staff don't have to keep searching for items. And/or order the items on the screen by Tray ID.
11) On A319s, with 3 crew, arrange the second trolley so that it stays in the galley but has the rarely used items available for quick retrieval, by changing and labelling the internal trays.
And, probably above all,
12) Please BA, allow the SCCM some leeway on customer service remediation. In particular if a flight is delayed more than 30 minutes crack open the Highland Spring. Due to the commission on sales, I can see crew going mad to throw away the margin, but a bit of give/take may be a good investment.
Once again spot on CWS thanks for that post, you are spot on with your improvements we have feed many of these suggestions above back to the company.
Water is being looked at.
We have suggested quick buy meal deals.
Contactless should be up and running by the end of the month.
Food does scan when the scanner works.
Trolley setup are being looked at.
And of course the SCCM or Capt should be able to override service standards in a delay, but BA have been removing this power from both for many years now.
Lets hope this is only in the transition stage and not just a product of BoB. EI certainly do not have this problem and the relationship between CC and pax is generally very good. Many of the CC would have been around when full service was offered on EI as well. Maybe after everyone gets used to the change that the dynamic will return to previous and better levels
Safe flying
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My username is not original I have used in memory of poster somewhere else who was a true hero to many at BA
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The information posted here are my views and opinion . They do not reflect the official view or opinion or any other individual or company
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Jan 18, 2017, 12:41 pm
#667
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: BAEC Gold, EK Skywards (enhanced Blue !), Oman Air Sindbad Gold
Posts: 6,399
Jan 18, 2017, 1:20 pm
#668
Join Date: Feb 2009
Programs: Mucci, BA, Hilton.
Posts: 1,158
Having been through 10 experiences, how would I improve this process?
1) Put some 80 ml cuplets of free water on the trolley and BA shouldn't lose sleep over any lost sales. (Incidentally I have seen plenty of free water handed out, I've not witnessed any pushback on that first hand).
2) Put some meal deals on the menu, competitively priced, and put them on screen 1 of TourPOS. At the moment there are just 2 options, "Food" and "Drink", they could put half a dozen meal deals leading straight to payment and save a lot of key pressing.
3) Make the TourPOS and bluetooth printer a lot more robust and simplify the menu process. Have a 3rd backup device on board.
4) Allow pre-purchase via MMB and/or allow Highlife Shop vouchers to be bought offline, for those who don't have credit cards or Avios.
5) Get contactless working ASAP! [This is coming apparently].
6) Get the barcode visible offline on the BA App (and workable under TourPOS).
7) One or two hot items which aren't sandwiches (Cornish Pasty? Vegetarian Pasty).
8) Allow Newcastle travellers bacon baps! They are actually quite tasty in my view.
9) Sort out the naming conventions for the food items. The Swiss Mountain chocolate bar has those two words prominently on the product, but they don't appear on the drop down menu on TourPOS.
10) Add a scan food option on TourPOS so the staff don't have to keep searching for items. And/or order the items on the screen by Tray ID.
11) On A319s, with 3 crew, arrange the second trolley so that it stays in the galley but has the rarely used items available for quick retrieval, by changing and labelling the internal trays.
And, probably above all,
12) Please BA, allow the SCCM some leeway on customer service remediation. In particular if a flight is delayed more than 30 minutes crack open the Highland Spring. Due to the commission on sales, I can see crew going mad to throw away the margin, but a bit of give/take may be a good investment.
I refuse to believe that this service would not be improved by accepting cash. I also find it hard to believe that they didn't at least talk to EI about how to implement this. They could have lifted their system and used it across. It works well on EI.
I have no issue with paying for a drink on short haul or even better get the lemon/chocolate biscuits on the menu and I'd buy them all, price irrelevant. I just think that if this is the way they are going it should be a lot more professionally delivered. The quality of the M&S stuff is all fine but so far in my experience the pos system being used is dreadful.
Jan 18, 2017, 6:37 pm
#669
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Buckinghamshire
Programs: BAEC Gold Guest List, Hilton Honours Diamond, Accor Gold
Posts: 2,303
A well known BBC News presenter - a friend of mine - flew up to GLA from LHR on Monday. On the flight she was sitting near the front of the aircraft and when the trolley came down she asked for a hot water and lemon (she'd already eaten in the lounge). There was a 'discussion' between the CC over whether she should be charged for the lemon. One male CC said "this is ridiculous". She wasn't charged.
Last edited by Dicksbits; Jan 18, 2017 at 8:03 pm
Jan 18, 2017, 7:50 pm
#670
Join Date: May 2014
Location: DMV
Posts: 2,092
Regarding the tension on board, I think it's an expectation management thing. EI pax for the most part don't expect to be fed for free and the ones that may would probably figure 'well that's just how it is on this airline' because EI isn't exactly a world famous brand. With Easyjet and Ryanair, well, people know what they're going to get by now.
In contrast, I think BA had a reputation as one of the 'good airlines' out there. The kind of airline people may have brought up as a contrast to say the U.S. airlines, the kind of brand people booked just to specifically fly with this brand. People who do not fly very often may not have heard anything about the downgrading of the brand and thus may be surprised/shocked, whereas frequent flyers might simply be resentful. Either way it makes for people in a bad mood on board.
In contrast, I think BA had a reputation as one of the 'good airlines' out there. The kind of airline people may have brought up as a contrast to say the U.S. airlines, the kind of brand people booked just to specifically fly with this brand. People who do not fly very often may not have heard anything about the downgrading of the brand and thus may be surprised/shocked, whereas frequent flyers might simply be resentful. Either way it makes for people in a bad mood on board.
Jan 18, 2017, 11:04 pm
#671
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 138
I have to agree with the tense atmosphere onboard since BOB.
I've done just 2 hops (LGW-JER and back again) and my observations were very little take up for purchases. People were very much heads down and you could almost hear the grumbling :-/
I've been sat in rows 9 & 10 and on each occasion there's been no interest at all unless the middle/back of the plane. Even then (just glancing back over my shoulder), it seemed like 4/5 hot drinks was the total business done on the flight.
At 35 mins flight time and 1 trolley, I suspected this route would struggle to finish in time but it seems to be the exact opposite so far with service complete in just a few minutes!
I've done just 2 hops (LGW-JER and back again) and my observations were very little take up for purchases. People were very much heads down and you could almost hear the grumbling :-/
I've been sat in rows 9 & 10 and on each occasion there's been no interest at all unless the middle/back of the plane. Even then (just glancing back over my shoulder), it seemed like 4/5 hot drinks was the total business done on the flight.
At 35 mins flight time and 1 trolley, I suspected this route would struggle to finish in time but it seems to be the exact opposite so far with service complete in just a few minutes!
Jan 18, 2017, 11:13 pm
#672
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 373
A well known BBC News presenter - a friend of mine - flew up to GLA from LHR on Monday. On the flight she was sitting near the front of the aircraft and when the trolley came down she asked for a hot water and lemon (she'd already eaten in the lounge). There was a 'discussion' between the CC over whether she should be charged for the lemon. One male CC said "this is ridiculous". She wasn't charged.
Jan 18, 2017, 11:29 pm
#673
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: London
Programs: BA Silver Seigneur des Horaires des Mucci.
Posts: 2,047
I have to agree with the tense atmosphere onboard since BOB.
I've done just 2 hops (LGW-JER and back again) and my observations were very little take up for purchases. People were very much heads down and you could almost hear the grumbling :-/
I've been sat in rows 9 & 10 and on each occasion there's been no interest at all unless the middle/back of the plane. Even then (just glancing back over my shoulder), it seemed like 4/5 hot drinks was the total business done on the flight.
At 35 mins flight time and 1 trolley, I suspected this route would struggle to finish in time but it seems to be the exact opposite so far with service complete in just a few minutes!
I've done just 2 hops (LGW-JER and back again) and my observations were very little take up for purchases. People were very much heads down and you could almost hear the grumbling :-/
I've been sat in rows 9 & 10 and on each occasion there's been no interest at all unless the middle/back of the plane. Even then (just glancing back over my shoulder), it seemed like 4/5 hot drinks was the total business done on the flight.
At 35 mins flight time and 1 trolley, I suspected this route would struggle to finish in time but it seems to be the exact opposite so far with service complete in just a few minutes!
I guess BA will just win for higher frequency and for Exec members
Jan 19, 2017, 12:48 am
#674
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 138
I will continue to fly BA SH to help maintain these benefits but reserve the right to be grumpy about it :-)
On commuter routes like this, it seems 3/4 of the plane are Silvers or Golds and I suspect most feel the same. I used to enjoy a cup of tea on the red eye and a G&T on the way back. Small things in the scheme of things but helped make this short flight pleasurable. I won't expense or pay for these things myself so I'll just do without from now on. It's a short flight.
The knock on effect of this bad feeling is that I haven't got a single LH BA flight booked for this year. All of these will be CX or QF instead.
Jan 19, 2017, 1:04 am
#675
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: BA Blue, IHG Spire, Marriott Gold
Posts: 402
Time will tell!