subject2load

Hmm.

Maybe not that weird when you consider how much ‘form’ BA has when it comes to cost-saving..........

Frequent flyer 101

It is impossible to say for sure as most of the transaction details are not public knowledge.

It is reasonably safe to assume that:

• Airlines pay a fee to other airlines when their passengers use their lounge
• Depending on the fees and the number of passengers, there will be a point where the cost of opening your own lounge becomes cheaper than paying an alliance partner to use their lounges
• A reasonable % of passengers do not know that they can use partner lounges

Since LHR is a busy airport with AA/CX/QF having several flights per day with reasonably high premium passenger volume, then it become viable according to the assumptions above. The key is knowing at which point it becomes cheaper to operate your own lounge rather than pay per use.

I'd be curious to know how some of the other alliance lounges work (e.g Skyteam lounge at DXB) in terms of financing and cooperation. I also remember Air Canada and SAS has 'The London Lounge' many years ago so perhaps that was a simple joint venture as opposed to an alliance based deal.

Just speculating, but perhaps there is also an element of prestige/branding going on here. It makes much more sense to position your own lounges at your biggest destinations with high volume of premium passengers.

AdBoy

Anyone any idea what they pay each other? And is it tiered as to whether F or J lounges are used?

Frequent flyer 101

No idea on specifics.

I would imagine F and J are different rates, and I base that assumption largely on the cost of food + drinks you find in F vs J in most lounges.

One interesting data point is that AY have previously and/or currently try to direct non-status business class passengers to 3rd party lounges at LHR and BKK. While I'm fairly sure AY aren't paying the rack rate for these, it may give some indication as to pricing minimums or maximums.

OneWorld lounges also tend to be better than contract lounges (tho certainly not always) and they do not make money from up-selling customers in the way that No1 or Aspire can from selling champagne or spa treatments/showers.

AdBoy

V interesting.
Thinking about it, it seems odd that the alliances let you lounge hop at all. As far as t3 is concerned (with Finnair not having a lounge), they could end up paying CX, QF (soon), BA and AA if you're on one of their flights out to HEL and fancy a wander?!

gustavmahler

I haven’t managed to make it into any of the F lounges at T3, so am planning a bit of a lounge crawl ahead of our flight out to MIA for Christmas. Not sure Mrs GM will be too impressed!

Frequent flyer 101

Much of this is speculation mind. If I was designing an IT system to handle this, the more data points that were captured, then the more accurate of a cost model could be built. You could theoretically capture operating costs for each lounge individually (fixed and variable), cross reference that against which passengers, class/status and airline and build a dynamic cost model. With enough data, you could potentially capture information about who consumes more (Gold or Silver),

I know that several OneWorld airlines have fairly sophisticated pooled profit sharing on certain routes. So this kind of system for lounge access isn't a million miles away. That being said, I have absolutely no idea how sophisticated their IT systems are so all this is very much wild speculation and theorizing on my part.

Smid

It is probably only niche passengers like FT people who lounge hop, and even at that for the novelty. We did AA F, BA F and CX F earlier this year. Next flight, we'll try QF F and likely settle in the CX F. Flight after that probably just the favourite lounge (though might have to try QF J to compare with CX J having lost gold, I've been in both the others, and I will likely not visit them again)... But I can't imagine lounge hopping being that much of a problem that they might crack down on it...

When I Travel The World

I'm at T3 on Friday, but I'm not sure if the QF F lounge will be open yet !!!

EDIT : Just learned soft opening tomorrow on the 23rd at 6ISH PM. Oh well just missed it.

aceman

Just walked past now, totally boarded up without even a whiff of activity. On to CX, dining room has a 30 minute wait. This opening can’t come soon enough!

dodgeflyer

Surely if it is opening tomorrow then you will just make it?

Smid

Hmmn, will it be that much of an improvement or change? My memory of LAX QF J, and LAX QF F and SYD QF F lounges, means its a buffet like BA in the J lounges, and sit down dining with the likes of burgers or sandwiches for the F lounge, ie: not a huge difference from what the BA J and F lounges provide. So CX's lounges will still be crowded as they're pretty top notch...

Only been in the CX F lounge once, and could walk up to dining when I felt like it. It was back in spring though, must be frustrating for eating and I'd consider CX J for food in that case, in a hurry...

aceman

well there were 2 people in the lift with me with Qantas boarding passes, so I’m guessing they’ll all be directed to the new lounge. How many of them decide to ignore it and head to CX still is another matter.

dougzz

I think, and I may have remembered incorrectly, that when this was discussed previously, it was said that the first OW lounge you visit is the one that counts. So wandering into say AA after CX wouldn't result in income for AA, only CX. It was speculated that CX like all those BA people in there, as it provides income against what is a fairly fixed cost base, assuming food and drink far less significant than rent, staff and overheads.

LupineChemist

I can't imagine lounge hopping is all that common at all, really. I mean, we are definitely the minority that know you can even go to other partners' lounges in the first place, never mind hop between them.

And even then, I honestly can't be bothered to go between lounges like that. I just want to relax with a drink before my flight and not be moving around all that much.